Replies

Your method here, ealgeone, is twisty-tailed around from the git-go, because you persist in telling FReeper Catholics what they believe, rather than asking what they believe. That, by the way, is why your method always fails, That is why Catholics never respond by saying, "Oh, yeah, what an insight! I see the light!" Because you keep selecting, arranging, shading and framing your own picture of the Catholic Faith, rather than patiently *inquiring* about the Catholic Faith as it is.

It's as if one were to issue a critique of Shakespeare called, "Othello the Prince of Denmark, Indiana, at the Asylum at Charenton-om-Avon," --- and refuse any correction because there were *some* elements of you the Bard there (quoted verbatim) (verbatim!)so this must be real, authentic Shakespeareanism.

So you jump into a thread about an entirely different topic (the shuttering of a heretical Episcopalian seminary--- nothing to do with devotion to Mary) and you do your routine Mary-baiting which we've read here so often we could write it ourselves.

It's beyond tedious.

Your method here, ealgeone, is twisty-tailed around from the git-go, because you persist in telling FReeper Catholics what they believe, rather than asking what they believe. That, by the way, is why your method always fails,

I could ask a mormon what they believe and it won't change their theology. They can explain it all they want.

Wrong theology is wrong theology.

You cannot refute what I've noted regarding the rcc on mary. If you could you would have posted the corrections. But you can't because these are all beliefs of the rcc.

I've quoted from catholic sources on the issues of Mary as you know I have.

The catholic is raised up to believe these false teachings. They do not know any different. One who is not a catholic looking from the outside can see the error.

I compare roman catholic teaching on Mary to what is espoused in the New Testament and the catholic position is not there. There are no verses noting mary as our advocate, mediatrix or co-redemtrix and I think you know this.

To avoid the claim of "catholics worship mary", catholicism has to redefine what worship it.

When the rcc has to resort to word games such as this to justify their actions it is on sandy ground.

I'm sure you're aware there is a movement to establish a fifth marian dogma. It doesn't have full support to move forward just yet but I predict it will.

I find it interesting that the further we get from the New Testament period the more extreme these dogmas become.

The Church-approved apparitions of the Lady of All Nations in Amsterdam, Holland (1945-1959; Church approval, May 31, 2002) confirm that only with the proclamation of the Dogma of Mary Co-redemptrix, Mediatrix, and Advocate will Mary be able to intercede for “true peace for the world” (May 31, 1954 message). The Lady of All Nations also called all peoples to “petition the Holy Father” for this fifth Marian Dogma (May 31, 1954 message), and to pray daily the “Prayer of the Lady of All Nations” for the accomplishment of this Fifth Dogma.http://www.fifthmariandogma.com/

See, it all comes back to Mary for the catholic. However, the Bible teaches that we have the Holy Spirit already making intercession for us (Rms 8:26). We also have Jesus interceeding for us (Rms 8:34). One can only conclude that the catholic believes these intercessions are somehow insufficient and that Mary's intercession is somehow more effective as has been noted by catholic writers.