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To: metmom

Doesn’t this speak to the sin of presumption?

https://www.catholic.com/qa/what-is-the-sin-of-presumption

This is how the old Catholic Encyclopedia defines the sin of presumption:

It may be defined as the condition of a soul that, because of a badly regulated reliance on God’s mercy and power, hopes for salvation without doing anything to deserve it, or for pardon of his sins without repenting of them.


9 posted on 01/16/2018 7:07:30 PM PST by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: Salvation
That's an interesting question.
I answer that
there are two ways to respond to God's promises. The bad way, which Bunyan would attribute to ignorance and say makes a way to destruction even at the borders of heaven, is to, take it all for granted and coast.

But the good way is this. I have nothing to offer God but my need and his gifts, present and promised. But because I am, as Paul and John say repeatedly, “in Christ,” I can offer his gifts. A pipe, patent and open to the source, offers nothing of its own, yet passes good water to others and is itself moistened and cooled by the water which runs through it.

So, relying on Christ, who has the living water, I can make commitments to remain, open to him at one end, and to those I serve at the other. I can live and serve not on my gifts but on his promise, which even now, as a trickle from the right side of the temple — that is: his pierced side — is so small it can be stepped over. But down stream, why, there the saints swim!

10 posted on 01/16/2018 7:26:43 PM PST by Mad Dawg (Sta, si cum canibus magnis currere non potes, in portico.)
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To: Salvation
hopes for salvation without doing anything to deserve it

And what can you do to 'deserve' it?

Not talking about unrepentant sins here. The wages of sin is death. How do you do something to deserve salvation if Christ's death isn't enough?

11 posted on 01/16/2018 8:05:36 PM PST by xone
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To: Salvation
No such thing as the sin of presumption.

That's a Catholic fabrication.

Being confident of God's promises to us, the God who cannot lie or change, is trust and faith, not presumption.

Hebrews 11:1 Now faith is the assurance of things hoped for, the conviction of things not seen.

12 posted on 01/16/2018 9:10:41 PM PST by metmom ( ...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith..)
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To: Salvation
It may be defined as the condition of a soul that, because of a badly regulated reliance on God’s mercy and power, hopes for salvation without doing anything to deserve it, or for pardon of his sins without repenting of them.

We can't do anything to *deserve* salvation*.

Romans 3:20-30 For by works of the law no human being will be justified in his sight, since through the law comes knowledge of sin. But now the righteousness of God has been manifested apart from the law, although the Law and the Prophets bear witness to it—the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all who believe. For there is no distinction: for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and are justified by his grace as a gift, through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus, whom God put forward as a propitiation by his blood, to be received by faith. This was to show God's righteousness, because in his divine forbearance he had passed over former sins. It was to show his righteousness at the present time, so that he might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus.

Then what becomes of our boasting? It is excluded. By what kind of law? By a law of works? No, but by the law of faith. For we hold that one is justified by faith apart from works of the law. Or is God the God of Jews only? Is he not the God of Gentiles also? Yes, of Gentiles also, since God is one—who will justify the circumcised by faith and the uncircumcised through faith.

13 posted on 01/16/2018 9:17:07 PM PST by metmom ( ...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith..)
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To: Salvation

Dosent this speak to the sin of presumption?
..............................................
You might be right

Mathew 5:3
Blessed are the poor in spirit; for theirs is
the kingdom of heaven.


16 posted on 01/17/2018 5:21:42 AM PST by ravenwolf (Left lane tdrivers and tailgaters are the smallest peabrains in the world.)
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