Question from A Reader:
Hello!!!! My question is, what is the begining point for the ana-baptist faith and then later the baptist. Some say 350 A.D. some say earlier. When did they begin and where can I find some more information on this topic?? Another thing, doesn't the Council of Trent mention the "persecutions of the Anabaptists 1200 years earlier ?"
Though the Baptists like to claim ancestry in the early Church, in fact nothing like the Baptist religion is found in history until the 13th century, when groups such as the Waldensians and the "Spiritual Franciscans" began to develop doctrines similar to theirs. I am unaware of anything in the Council of Trent that specifically refers to persecution of Baptists more than a thousand years before, though it may have referred to other heresies of that period. There is no reliable book of history that finds any significant part of the Baptist religion before 1200. - Dr. Carroll
Question from Art Kelly on 07-28-1998:
The Council of Trent certainly does NOT make ANY mention of persecution of Anabaptists 1,200 years earlier. If anyone asserts that it does, please indicate in which session of Trent such a statement can be found.
Anabaptists are today?s Amish and Mennonites and do NOT claim ancient lineage.
Baptists were founded in 1609 and are NOT related to Anabaptists.
First of all, Anabaptists believed, as Catholics do, in salvation by grace through BOTH faith AND works. Since Baptists have always strongly believed in the (anti-Biblical) view of salvation by faith ALONE, with nothing else required, it would be hard to imagine a more fundamental Second, Anabaptists practiced baptism by affusion, rather than immersion. For Baptists, that ranks almost as important.
Third, a look at history will reveal that ties to the Anabaptists were continually DISAVOWED by early Baptists, while at the same time they all claimed the closest of ties with the so-called Protestant Reformation.
For verification of this, I would direct Mr. Dreher to several BAPTIST sources:
Phil Johnson?s Hall of Church History with separate sections on the Anabaptists and the Baptists
A Primer on Baptist History: The True Baptist Trail by Chris Traffansted
Baptists , by Pastor Fred Zaspel of the Word of Life Baptist Church, Pottsville, Pennsylvania
[and, finally] Baptist Successionism: A Critical Question in Baptist History by James Edward McGoldrick, a scholarly book which can be obtained through interlibrary loan.
Mr. Dreher should know that the claims of "ancient Baptists" by the likes of the Landmark Baptists and Dr. J. M. Carroll?s 1931 booklet, A Trail of Blood, have been examined by Baptist scholars and found to be without any merit whatsoever. .
Answer by Warren H. Carroll, Ph.D on 07-28-1998:
Very well said! Thank you particularly for the references. - Dr. Carroll