What I am trying to demonstrate is that predestination, the foolish and well-refuted doctrine under contention, is completely falsifiable by reason. Something God gave us. I don't need Scripture. And if Scripture is so clear why are there 27,000 flavors of Protestants.
I appeal to secular philosophy because your version of determinism (predestination) has so many holes in it that it's simply the easiest way to go.
By the way, asking you to define human nature was purely rhetorical. But of course you've got your NKJV quotes all lined up, just like RNMom.
Finally, in regards to philosophy--if you're going to talk about determinism, you better realize you're outside the bounds of theology.
Attn Lurkers: Note this poster's imperviousness to logic, and his/her disdain therof. If you are as well impervious to logic, please turn off your CPU and continue communicating in a series of grunts and clicks.
I'm probably the only lurker out tonight and not for long. I have read much of Aristotle and more of the Word. Reason is a mental understanding but faith is a spiritual understanding. Though Jean C. can react to you on your level, you cannot really converse with him on his, as spiritual knowledge is not something you can get or give yourself, and never will receive from above unless you open yourself up to an understanding of scripture.
So, does the 'reason' of secular philosphers 'trump' scripture? Are we to interpret scripture in the light of secular philosophers?
"What I am trying to demonstrate is that predestination, the foolish and well-refuted doctrine under contention, is completely falsifiable by reason. Something God gave us."
Sure, God gave us reason (when yours will start to kick in is another question!). However, there are concepts which are 'beyond' reason and logic. The Trintiy is one of them. You admit this. Creatio ex nihilo is another. The Incarnation is another.
I'll run this simple 'logic' by you and see what you think:
Certain true concepts about God are concepts which are illogical, therefore, concepts which are illogical are not necessarily false.
"I don't need Scripture."
Well, nothing more needs to be said:
"And if Scripture is so clear why are there 27,000 flavors of Protestants."
If Catholocism is correct why are there 27,000,000 flavors of Catholics?
"By the way, asking you to define human nature was purely rhetorical. But of course you've got your NKJV quotes all lined up, just like RNMom."
For the third time, what is behind the comments regarding the NKJV? (Oh, and by the way, I was quoting from the NIV.)
"Finally, in regards to philosophy--if you're going to talk about determinism, you better realize you're outside the bounds of theology."
Actually, no. The great Protestant Reformer Philip Melanchthon was well known to appeal to secular philosophers. The fact that he took quite a similar position, albeit slightly different, on predestination (and just as illogical) might suprise you. The 'Great' Humansist Philosopher Erasmus raved about the cognative abilities of Melanchthon.
"Attn Lurkers: Note this poster's imperviousness to logic, and his/her disdain therof. "
Goodness! I love 'logic'. It is quite illogical for you to state that my presumption that Scripture trumps logic necessitates my 'disdain' for 'logic'. And speaking of computers, I happen to be a rather large endorser of RPN Logic!
Jean
Says it all ..