Replies

Athanasius was the Bishop of Alexandria -and thus was on the same level of the Bishop of Rome (what you guys call the "pope"). In fact, some call him the Pope of Alexandria.

Of course, official Roman Catholic History tends to be at odds with reality, so I don't expect you to recognize these facts.

But, you were correct (inadvertantly) in calling him a 'catholic' biship. While he certainly wasn't 'Roman' catholic, he was a member of the catholic (universal) church, after all. He just happened to be the head of the Alexandria branch.

Jean

Athanasius was the Bishop of Alexandria -and thus was on the same level of the Bishop of Rome (what you guys call the "pope").

No. It is quite clear from the universal writings of the Church fathers in this period of time (3rd-5th Centuries), that the Bishop of Rome was recognized as the successor of St. Peter and universal pastor of the Church. It was the final decisions of this Bishop that settled all the major controversies during this period. Rome, Alexandria, and Antioch were the three big patriarchates at this time, indeed the Council of Nicaea in 325 recognized the supreme place of the Bishops of these three cities as an ancient custom. That St. Peter founded all of them (Alexandria through St. Mark) plays a role in their importance. The term "first among equals" did not develop until Centuries later when portions of the Eastern Church split form the West. That the term translated as "Pope" was used by other major Bishops during this time is not disputed. It was about 100-200 (?) years later that it was used exclusively for the Bishop of Rome.

Of course, official Roman Catholic History tends to be at odds with reality, so I don't expect you to recognize these facts.

Well then, how about using the proper term and say "Catholic History". The Catholic Church consists of 22 particular Churches that worship in 7 different Rites. The term "Roman" Church correctly refers to the Church in Rome. "Roman Catholic" was a term originally applied to the Catholic Church in the West by others who did not recognize that the Church is much larger that the Latin Rite in the West. The Pope is the Patriarch Bishop of the Latin Rite of the Church in addition to being Her universal pastor and visible head. I myself am Byzantine Catholic, so "Roman Catholic" does not describe me properly. Of course, the Catholic Church is One!

I, like most people here, am not a professional historian. Talking about Church - and therefore, world events and history - that occurred approx. 1500 years ago on the other side of the world in a much different socio/economical, cultural, and political arena than any of us live in, is not the easiest thing to do. All I can say, is that when I see people on these threads claim that St. Augustine was really a Calvinist, having lived a 1,000 years before Calvin as a Catholic Bishop who held all the particular Catholic beliefs that Calvin denied, then I have to wonder whose history tends to be at odds with reality.

But, you were correct (inadvertantly) in calling him a 'catholic' biship.

Nothing inadvertant about it. A Bishop, through the sacrament of Holy Orders and consecration, is a successor of one of Christ's Apostles, whom He founded His One "universal" Church on. A Bishop is an Hierarchical Priest of Christ. This is exactly what St. Athanasuis was. Just out of curiosity, do you as a Calvinist (if you are one) recognize Bishops?

While he certainly wasn't 'Roman' catholic, he was a member of the catholic (universal)

This statement cracks me up. You like to claim Roman Catholics as your own and distance them from Roman Catholicism when it serves you. I didn't know you guys also accepted Transubstantiation too.

"You shall see the Levites bringing loaves and a cup of wine, and placing them on the table. So long as the prayers of supplication and entreaties have not been made, there is only bread and wine. But after the great and wonderful prayers have been completed, then the bread is become the Body, and the wine the Blood, of our Lord Jesus Christ. 'And again:' Let us approach the celebration of the mysteries. This bread and this wine, so long as the prayers and supplications have not taken place, remain simply what they are. But after the great prayers and holy supplications have been sent forth, the Word comes down into the bread and wine - and thus His Body is confected.",

St. Athanasius -"Sermon to the Newly Baptized" ante 373 A.D.,

Face it. Athanasius and the Fathers of the Church WERE Roman Catholic. There was no split in the Church then. Only Catholics and Heretics. Arius was a Catholic priest who fell into heresy by his erroneous proclamations. The Church pronounced him ArchHeretic and the rest is history.

Secondly, there was NEVER a pope Alexanderos (there was a primate of Alexandria) as your link would suggest. Therefore he could never have recommended Athanasius to the papacy. The reigning pope at the time of Athansius' consecration to the bishopric was Sylvester I..