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Icemen to join hunt for bin Laden
Sydney Morning Herald ^ | 10/22/01

Posted on 10/22/2001 7:55:51 AM PDT by dead

Hard as ice: the men who go further than the SAS

An elite British unit is preparing to join the hunt for Osama bin Laden in the mountains of northern Afghanistan, defying the myth that the onset of winter will stall military operations.

The first snows are expected by the end of the month, bringing fierce storms, near-zero visibility and temperatures as low as -20C.

But the 24-strong Brigade Patrol Troop has expertise in the extremes of winter warfare and could be the force on which the hunt for the al-Queda leader and his men may ultimately turn. Recruited almost exclusively from the Royal Marine Commandos, the troop practise and refine their skills in northern Norway.

The troop, based in Plymouth, comprises six four-man teams, each with its own medic, signaller, sniper and patrol commander.

All are parachutists, and their weapons of choice are the M16 assault rifle or the L96 infantry sniper rifle, but at least one will have a Belgian Minimi light machine gun, which has a better rate of fire. They can also carry anti-tank weapons.

During the Cold War they were used alongside regular Royal Marine Commandos as the first line of defence for NATO's northern flank against a Soviet invasion.

They pride themselves on their ability to operate in weather conditions considered extreme even by the standards of special forces. They have no equivalent in the United States armed forces, and such are the selection standards that only a handful of SAS troopers have managed to join their ranks.

The men must be able to live in snow holes for weeks on end as they seek, and then destroy, the enemy. Their other skills include laser target indication for air attacks, ice wall and mountain climbing, resistance to interrogation and escape techniques.

As intelligence on the dispositions of the Taliban and the whereabouts of bin Laden arrives at US Central Command in Tampa, Florida, and the Joint Force Headquarters in Britain, the men will be inserted by helicopter to cover the high passes that al-Qaeda may use to move into lower valleys, where weather conditions are less hostile.

On arrival at their landing sites, the commandos will establish a ring of covert observation posts dug deep into the snow. From here they will observe any movements and, with encrypted signals sent in high-speed bursts, report to their commanders at forward bases in Afghanistan or neighbouring countries such as Pakistan or Uzbekistan.

Their task will be to assess possible routes, supply lines and secret locations so more heavily armed special forces troops, such as the SAS, can be flown in to intercept. But if they identify bin Laden or any of his lieutenants they will be cleared to open fire.

Alternatively, if an al-Qaeda camp is located, the information they provide will allow planners to bring spy satellites on line, allowing the mountain troops to call in air strikes using conventional satellite and laser-guided bombs, or cruise missiles.

The Telegraph, London


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS:
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1 posted on 10/22/2001 7:55:51 AM PDT by dead
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To: dead
Awesome. I think infrared optics should work especially well in the Winter as well.

Belgian Minimi light machine gun

Is that pronounced Mini-me? Cute...

2 posted on 10/22/2001 8:04:53 AM PDT by Paradox
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To: dead
A bump for the Brits!
3 posted on 10/22/2001 8:13:14 AM PDT by Coop
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To: dead
Someone pointed out that we must be wasting a lot of resources training troops in Alaska, if they can't even be used in the winter. Any thoughts from the military among us?
4 posted on 10/22/2001 8:15:49 AM PDT by KayEyeDoubleDee
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To: dead
"They have no equivalent in the United States armed forces"

Looking at Clintoons nose makes one think he could be called an "iceman".

But in all seriousness, I don't know what the big deal is about working in winter conditions that would be normal for most of people in Alaska and in the northern tier of American states and Canada. Can't there be gun mounts installed on snowmobils?

Yeah, I know that in unknown terrain and adverse conditions it gets harder to accomplish tasks, but outside the average combat soldiers capabilities? Come on.

5 posted on 10/22/2001 8:16:29 AM PDT by Dust in the Wind
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To: dead
I need PICS!!! Please!! I love men in uniform! lol
6 posted on 10/22/2001 8:28:36 AM PDT by richandfamous
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To: Dust in the Wind
Ya' know, they must be right. After all, don't the weak-minded capitalists at Prudhoe Bay all flee after August? And since our soldiers are so weak, maybe we should send scientists from the Antartica?
7 posted on 10/22/2001 11:34:34 AM PDT by texas booster
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To: KayEyeDoubleDee
The US Army does about as much cold weather training as the Panamanian Defense Forces. Occasionally, we send some Marine amphibious units to Norway for joint maneuvers. A few Spec Ops guys get some, too. Otherwise, our cold weather troops largely consist of a few guys in the Alaskan national Guard who have experience patrolling for SPETSNAZ troopers who would practice infiltrations into Alaska during the Cold War.

Historically, training of almost any kind has been anathema to the US Army. Napoleon once wrote, "The more inferior the quality of a body of troops, the more artillery it requires." In America, we have taken that to heart by providing lots of firepower and not bothering to train our infantry.

8 posted on 10/22/2001 11:45:44 AM PDT by Seydlitz
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To: Seydlitz
I remember joint exercises at Fort Wainwright, Air Force and Army. Those grunts lay out in the snow and cold for days on end. We went home to warm beds each night. I doubt if it has all diminished to nothing. That was in Feb and the temp was a high of -15 or so.
9 posted on 10/22/2001 11:55:24 AM PDT by cynicom
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To: cynicom
Spending some time in the snow is done by the troops (my dad's Army unit spent some time in the snow at Ft. Drum in upstate NY in the late 60s). However, real cold weather training is something that takes months of dedicated course work (such training was done in WW II for elite units like the 10th Mtn., the joint US/Canadian 1st SSF and the Norwegian-American 999th Ski Bn.). Add to that the exceptional altitudes of Afghanistan, and one quickly realizes that a week or two sleeping in the snow is terribly inadequate (for an example, witness the terrible casaulties suffered by the US Rangers at the Mingiano gap in Italy in 1943).
10 posted on 10/22/2001 12:07:06 PM PDT by Seydlitz
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To: cynicom
I remember joint exercises at Fort Wainwright, Air Force and Army. Those grunts lay out in the snow and cold for days on end. We went home to warm beds each night. I doubt if it has all diminished to nothing. That was in Feb and the temp was a high of -15 or so.

I spent 2.5 years with the 172d Arctic Inf Bde and unless things have changed its one tough outfit. Operated 10-14 days at a time in -50F (wind chill not included). Double (or more) field exercises than other infantry units I was ever with. Our daily PT was done outside in short sleeve sweatshirts (unless in was less than -15 when we'd do it inside).
We ate Rangers for lunch ;)
11 posted on 10/22/2001 12:30:01 PM PDT by VA_Reb
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To: VA_Reb
VA....

We went to Alaska from Micronesia, it was 120 plus inside the aircraft when we departed. Arrived in Elmendorf it was a balmy -20 in the afternoon. The grunts from Ft. Wainwright had been out in the boonies for long time before we arrived and they were still there when we left. In fact I think a few shot at us, not sure. hehehehe

12 posted on 10/22/2001 12:52:01 PM PDT by cynicom
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To: Seydlitz; cynicom
Cynicom seems to disagree with you. I too have been told, by an ex-military type, that we do in fact train for the winter conditions...
13 posted on 10/22/2001 1:50:27 PM PDT by KayEyeDoubleDee
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To: dead
Who Dares Wins!
14 posted on 10/22/2001 2:40:13 PM PDT by knighthawk
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To: Seydlitz
"Otherwise, our cold weather troops largely consist of a few guys in the Alaskan national Guard who have experience patrolling for SPETSNAZ troopers who would practice infiltrations into Alaska during the Cold War."

With all due respect, 10th Mountain is based at Camp Drum in northern New York...and their training ground is the Adirondacks. Winter is not for the soft in those parts.

15 posted on 10/22/2001 3:08:20 PM PDT by okie01
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To: dead
BTTT
16 posted on 10/22/2001 9:01:17 PM PDT by StriperSniper
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To: Seydlitz
Remember, high altitude and bitter cold affect both sides equally.

The wide-eyed kids from Saudi and Qatar don't function any better than our regulars at 13,000 feet up.

I have trouble going to Denver to visit customers. Imagine trying to haul 100 lbs and fight at the top of Pikes Peak, to get an idea of what our guys go thru.

17 posted on 10/23/2001 9:21:11 PM PDT by texas booster
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To: Seydlitz
I thought the Marines were sending a few hundred infantry a year through Bridgeport, CA for cold weather training.
18 posted on 10/23/2001 9:25:54 PM PDT by breakem
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To: dead
24-strong Brigade Patrol Troop
Amazing bravery. 24 guys? Big BUMP of thanks and God Bless!
19 posted on 10/23/2001 9:42:49 PM PDT by Libertina
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To: Seydlitz
If you beleive this crap that our infantry are not well trained, then you truly are a product of the left's media blitz. American infantry are concentrated primarily in the XVIII Airborne Corps, Special Forces, Rangers, and 1st Infantry Div-Europe; 2nd Infantry Div-Korea. We have worn these poor soldiers out with peace wartime training, e.g, insurgency, peace-keeping, peace-making missions. If you want true kick-ass action, turn them lose in combined arms. The problem American has no quality, it is one of quantity.
20 posted on 10/23/2001 9:49:59 PM PDT by Jumper
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