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Are Americans Ready To Accept A Police State?
Toogood Report | 11-14-1 | Chuck Baldwin

Posted on 11/16/2001 1:19:07 PM PST by Magician

Current trends seem to suggest that America may not be the "land of the free" much longer. In the wake of the September 11 terrorist attacks on New York and Washington, our federal government seems committed to the proposition that freedom is expendable if expunged in the name of security. Even more disturbing is the fact that a majority of the American people seems fine with the idea.

Fox News recently reported, "A handful of U.S. senators and some in the Bush administration are calling for changes in a 150-year-old statute, known as the Posse Comitatus Act, that keeps the military out of the business of domestic laws enforcement."

The Posse Comitatus Act became law in 1878 in order to end military occupation of the Reconstruction-era South. It states, "Whoever, except in cases and under circumstances expressly authorized by the Constitution or Act of Congress, willfully uses any part of the Army, as a posse comitatus or otherwise to execute the laws shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than two years, or both." However, both Republicans and Democrats appear ready to amend or scrap Posse Comitatus to allow the U.S. military to engage American citizens.

Georgia Democrat, Max Cleland, said, "We've got to figure out a new Posse Comitatus that allows the Department of Defense to step forward and defend America." Virginia Republican, John Warner, echoed Cleland's sentiment in a letter to the Secretary of Defense asking his department to "re-examine military doctrines to enable our active duty military to more fully join other domestic assets in the war against terrorism."

Using military forces for domestic law enforcement was anathema to America's Founding Fathers. Subsequent generations of Americans, likewise, found the idea repulsive — but such is not the case today.

A local newspaper, The Florida Sun, recently asked Pensacolians, "Is it worth giving up your personal freedom and privacy for greater national security?" A significant majority responded in the affirmative. It is noteworthy that the area served by this paper, the Florida panhandle, is among the most conservative districts in the nation. Yet, even in this bastion of political conservatism and Bible-belt spirituality, freedom does not seem as fashionable as it once did. All that seems to matter nowadays is "security."

This reminds me of a quotation attributed to Benjamin Franklin. He is reputed to have said, "They who give up essential liberty for temporary security deserve neither liberty nor security." However, Franklin's concept seems lost to the current generation of Americans.

Instead, the vast majority of our neighbors and friends seem quite content to voluntarily surrender their liberties to an ever-increasing and extremely intrusive federal government. Neither does it seem to matter whether they are Democrats or Republicans. Both appear more than ready to accept a European-style police state.


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Editorial
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1 posted on 11/16/2001 1:19:07 PM PST by Magician
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To: Magician
I think its safe to say most freepers are ready and willing to embrace a police state (for reasons I cant fathom).
2 posted on 11/16/2001 1:19:08 PM PST by michaelje
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To: Magician
YES, THE ALTERNATIVE IS DEATH. DUH.
3 posted on 11/16/2001 1:19:08 PM PST by Liberals are Evil Socialists!
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To: Liberals are Evil Socialists!
Just remember when you put your head down on your pillow tonight, the government loves you. Sleep tight.
4 posted on 11/16/2001 1:19:08 PM PST by michaelje
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To: Magician
The most frightening thing is that according to the Zogby poll issued today, about 80% of respondents, Repubs AND demos, would be in favor of random searches of Luggage (no biggie), their persons, their cars, monitoring of their phone calls, and facial-identity software/cameras in every place short of our own homes.

It pissed me off to see so damned many lemmings are out there, willing to run scared and sacrifice their personal freedoms at the first sign of trouble.
5 posted on 11/16/2001 1:19:09 PM PST by Demosthenes
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To: Liberals are Evil Socialists!
Yes, yes ,uh-huh (as I reach for the nearest blunt object)
6 posted on 11/16/2001 1:19:09 PM PST by mxbluto
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To: Magician
No. Tracking down and immobilizing murders with the force of whatever arms we have at our disposal...even our own, individually-held (or doesn't this come into the equation of this supposed "trend?) weapons, is just fine with most reasonable people I know in America, regardless of party affiliation. Euros sweat, because of their tradition of abusing eachother and themselves with their armies, police, and "Milicia." We don't. We're America, and will kick our OWN government's a$$ if we have to...and not wait for a hundred years to build up the nerve. "Land of the Free, Home of the Brave" is no joke, or gingle. Our government knows that, being elected in "bloodless revolutions" every few years, out of our OWN ranks...not some ruling class. Freedom. Use it or lose it.

Got cheese?...

7 posted on 11/16/2001 1:19:10 PM PST by PoorMuttly
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To: Demosthenes
Careful. The Freerepublic gubmint shills will tell you to don your tin foil hat.
8 posted on 11/16/2001 1:19:11 PM PST by michaelje
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To: Magician
I think it may be in that term "essential liberty" that we may find disagreement. There is no such thing as a totally "free" society, that is anarchy and everyone who has even glimpsed life in it would say, no thanks.

It seems that any discussion of this subject though first rules out any type of common sense. It seems there can only be one extreme or another with some.

9 posted on 11/16/2001 1:19:12 PM PST by Mahone
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To: PoorMuttly
Ya these guys spouting civil rights are not on our side. If you are not breaking any laws then you have nothing to worry about. The next statement is always what about the IRS, lol again, they want freedom to break the law.
10 posted on 11/16/2001 1:19:18 PM PST by veryconernedamerican
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To: michaelje
See my post yesterday along these lines, here.

This has been verified as real.

11 posted on 11/16/2001 1:19:26 PM PST by 11B3
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Comment #12 Removed by Moderator

To: PoorMuttly
...not some ruling class

You're kidding right :)

13 posted on 11/16/2001 1:19:29 PM PST by mxbluto
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To: 11B3
I know its real. I see it happening in every day life. Im just being a wiseass on this thread because of the fact that there are SO MANY freepers that are quick to call you a tin foil, anti UN, bunker child. I read your link and I know this is the real deal. I also love how "left wing terrorism" is in a smaller font on their pamphlet.
14 posted on 11/16/2001 1:19:30 PM PST by michaelje
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To: PoorMuttly
Got jingle?
15 posted on 11/16/2001 1:19:30 PM PST by PoorMuttly
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To: Demosthenes
Again proving the 80/20 rule. 80% are dimwits & 20% make this country functonal.
16 posted on 11/16/2001 1:19:31 PM PST by Digger
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To: Magician
Close our borders for 10 years. This will give us time to scrape up the cock-roaches and send 'em home.

Since the Feds can't enforce current laws, I, our family, has already made arrangements to move to another part of the country where we're in charge of our own destiny.

There was a movie that came out in the early 1970s, where a guy yelled out the window, "I'm not going to take it anymore!" I'm FED UP with the hypocracy of the Muslim bull-sh!t crap.

17 posted on 11/16/2001 1:19:31 PM PST by Cobra64
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To: pathan

Imagine Bill Clinton or Hillary Clinton with the power provided under these new laws. Frightening! It is hoped, but not assured, that they would never again rise to power. But what is our alternative?


Our Union is standing infront of its' tombstone. We are at a state of war. War! And, our enemy has announced that they will fight us until every single American is Killed. Could this be an idle threat?


Does anyone really, and honestly believe that these terrorists think that they can destroy America? No. Most US Citizens think that the worst that they can do is an occasional bombing or missle here and there. It might cut us, and sting, but it won't destroy our country.


I beg to differ.


Bin Laden is not Stupid. He is an Evil and Dangerousman who has devious plans set in motion. These plans are grandiose. To destroy our nation, he knows that he would have to perform some serious and lethal actions. I believe that he has done just this.


And even worse, our CIA and the KGB and independent organizations all indicate that this is a real possibility. Our Nation recognizes this and even our President has announced that he believes that this is a real threat to our nation. The threat is a multitude of attacks using well placed Nuclear and Biological weapons.


You may disagree with me. But I don't think that we should take the chance that nothing would happen. Study the effects of Smallpox. Once you get it and are infected. You will die. The only way to stop the spread of the germs is to isolate and destroy the pockets of contamination. And Nuclear? Imagine Boston, New York, Chicago, Houston, and Los Angles are reeling from a mini suitcase nuke. Millions would die slow painful deaths...


The alternatives to the Homeland defense preparations is DEATH. There is no alternative. And I, for one, will accept whatever it takes to prevent the destruction of our Nation.


18 posted on 11/16/2001 1:19:32 PM PST by vannrox
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To: mxbluto
Not kidding, but I know what you mean. We have systems that, if we actually used them better, or at all, like really voting...like enforcing existing laws, like holding officials actually accountable for their behavior and voting record.....but we don't, so we get this sometimes garbage in office, or idiot laws upon idiot laws, which only help the criminals and and corrupt, or irresponsible....so then it gets worse...error upon error. We ultimately institutionalize our individual lack of integrity, courage and personal wisdom. We gets the government, and workers thereof, which we deserve to get. They at least have to try harder, be more genuinely sociopathic, as I believe our previous Chief Executive to be, and /or more entangled in our bribeable by cocktail party press, than simply hiding behind the Secret Police, etc.

Case in point: Would YOU let Teddy Kennedy even park your car?

19 posted on 11/16/2001 1:19:32 PM PST by PoorMuttly
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To: PoorMuttly
Exactly.
20 posted on 11/16/2001 1:19:44 PM PST by 11B3
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