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Cold water ocean circulation doesn't work as expected (N. Atlantic conveyor belt)
Duke University ^ | May 13, 2009 | Unknown

Posted on 05/13/2009 12:30:05 PM PDT by decimon

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To: decimon
"This will be a great disappointment to those wanting to shut down the conveyor belt to freeze out the Europeans."

Yup. I'm disappointed...I'd bought into the conveyor belt theory.

21 posted on 05/13/2009 4:21:15 PM PDT by blam
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To: blam
...I'd bought into the conveyor belt theory.

Sounds like the circulation is so but not as was thought. If you can shut down the northern flow then you can still glaciate Europe. ;-)

22 posted on 05/13/2009 4:27:33 PM PDT by decimon
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To: decimon
And since cold Labrador seawater is thought to influence and perhaps moderate human-caused climate change, this finding may affect the work of global warming forecasters.

OK. So, the conveyor belt doesn't work like we thought? We've still had no warming for almost 10 years, regardless of how the system works.

23 posted on 05/13/2009 4:27:47 PM PDT by colorado tanker ("Lastly, I'd like to apologize for America's disproportionate response to Pearl Harbor . . . ")
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To: decimon

What happened to the good old days where a human sacrifice or two solved all of a society’s problems. Since the “planet huggers” are willing to sacrifice everything to save the planet, they should be asked to provide two volunteers.


24 posted on 05/13/2009 4:28:47 PM PDT by coconutt2000 (NO MORE PEACE FOR OIL!!! DOWN WITH TYRANTS, TERRORISTS, AND TIMIDCRATS!!!! (3-T's For World Peace))
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To: colorado tanker
We've still had no warming for almost 10 years...

Sure we have. It's just been a cold warming.

25 posted on 05/13/2009 4:30:24 PM PDT by decimon
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To: coconutt2000
What happened to the good old days where a human sacrifice or two solved all of a society’s problems.

Two is a tragedy, two billion a statistic.

26 posted on 05/13/2009 4:33:03 PM PDT by decimon
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To: decimon
Sure we have. It's just been a cold warming.

LOL! Sounds like you've been in James Hansen's liquor cabinet, er, uh, I mean computer model.

27 posted on 05/13/2009 4:40:08 PM PDT by colorado tanker ("Lastly, I'd like to apologize for America's disproportionate response to Pearl Harbor . . . ")
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To: americanophile
The Earth is such an impossibly complex system, that all your little models are like ancient maps of the Earth-centered universe. Curious, but baseless.

Isn't that where man usually starts before he masters a science? Little models that don't quite pan out until new mathematics and physics are created to understand and predict phenomenon? I do not agree with Al Gore and company but I know all this research and science will be put to good use in the future once the chaff is blown away.

28 posted on 05/13/2009 4:44:21 PM PDT by Sawdring
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To: colorado tanker
Sounds like you've been in James Hansen's liquor cabinet...

The bourbon was warming.

29 posted on 05/13/2009 4:46:04 PM PDT by decimon
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To: Sawdring
I do not agree with Al Gore and company but I know all this research and science will be put to good use in the future once the chaff is blown away.

That's pretty much my view. I'm all for the science and all against the ideology.

Put aside the anthropogenic stuff and it is predictable that we will eventually have a severe warming or cooling. That won't be in my lifetime but people will eventually need the science to alleviate or cope with the...dare I say it?...change.

30 posted on 05/13/2009 4:52:36 PM PDT by decimon
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To: Sawdring

...until then, don’t try to sell it as an immutable truth. “The debate about global warming is over,” crowd is selling faith, not fact...they have completely lost sight of the scientific method. They have a conclusion and steps that need to be taken immediately to abate the problem...yet they still seek evidence for it, by any means necessary.


31 posted on 05/13/2009 4:54:48 PM PDT by americanophile
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To: americanophile
...until then, don’t try to sell it as an immutable truth.

This is the way it has always been done. If you believe you have the science to back up your conclusions you have the immutable truth. Then when you are proven wrong, you get egg all over your face. This is science at is highest level with politics, religion and economics thrown in.

32 posted on 05/13/2009 5:04:10 PM PDT by Sawdring
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To: decimon
I get excited about geologists traveling to the planets and determining historical solar system warming and cooling trends caused by “space weather” from the Sun. That will improve our understanding of Earth's climate immensely.
33 posted on 05/13/2009 5:07:49 PM PDT by Sawdring
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To: Sawdring

No, you observe something in an attempt to understand it. When you think you have good evidence, you advance a theory, then you let the scientific community evaluate you. You do not, by contrast, start with a conclusion, sell the conclusion as fact to the world, attempt to enact political and economic policy in response, then conduct selective research to support your theory, while glossing over or outright lying about anything that doesn’t fit your models and claim that it makes the inevitable conclusion simply, ‘more difficult’ to prove.


34 posted on 05/13/2009 5:10:21 PM PDT by americanophile
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To: decimon; Monkey Face

There goes the next Austin Powers sequel.

And what a relief that is. ;’)


35 posted on 05/13/2009 5:13:51 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/____________________ Profile updated Monday, January 12, 2009)
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To: decimon
Climatologists pay attention to the Labrador Sea because it is one of the starting points of a global circulation pattern

Now, that's a silly statement.

Someone point out to me the "starting point" of a convection pattern.

36 posted on 05/13/2009 6:00:22 PM PDT by Sherman Logan (Everyone has a right to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.)
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To: SunkenCiv
Another example of why no one should take the pronouncements of scientists too seriously.
37 posted on 05/13/2009 6:43:52 PM PDT by BenLurkin
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To: coconutt2000
What happened to the good old days where a human sacrifice or two solved all of a society’s problems.

I'm ready to throw Al Gore into a volcano whenever you are. /sarc>

Cheers!

38 posted on 05/13/2009 7:42:16 PM PDT by grey_whiskers (The opinions are solely those of the author and are subject to change without notice.)
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To: decimon

HAHA....start over


39 posted on 05/17/2009 10:21:15 PM PDT by dila813
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To: decimon
Since the RAFOS float paths could only be tracked for two years, Lozier, her graduate student Stefan Gary, and German oceanographer Claus Boning also used a modeling program to simulate the launch and dispersal of more than 7,000 virtual "efloats" from the same starting point.

They could have gone all day without mentioning that. It sounds kooky. If the model predicted something other than what the real data showed, no mention of the model would have been made. Since the model predicts the same thing that the data show, we are left wondering how much they tinkered with the model to make it spit out the same answer as the real data. And does their ability to make the model give the right answer mean that the model includes all of the relevant factors, with all of the appropriate weighting? There's no way to tell.

Here's an example: You have a room full of pairs of people. You are told to develop a model that predicts the older person's age based on the younger person's age. You are told that in each pair the older person is twice the age of the younger person. You decide to collect some data. You talk to one pair. The younger person is 16, the older one is 32. You can now build your model: Take the younger person's age and add 16 to it. That will give you the older person's age. It worked for your sample, so your model must be right. And you tried it with 7,000 ecouples. It worked every time.

40 posted on 05/17/2009 11:00:38 PM PDT by Rocky (OBAMA: Succeeding where bin Laden failed.)
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