Posted on 12/30/2009 9:14:26 AM PST by Vigilanteman
Agreed.
A great many truck drivers are your best friend on the roads.
For me, that would be enough there to go ahead and pay it. It is a chance you take with those judgment calls. However, most of the time if you fight it, you win. The court, nor the police officer generally want to waste the time with a big drawn out case that will cost the court more than the ticket.
Find a lawyer that specializes in this sort of thing. You didn’t say what jurisdiction this occurred in, I know I-77 runs up from NC to VA into WV and beyond, but I don’t know where the tunnel is specifically.
VA is a little more hardassed about it, but this violation can be reduced. A “prayer for judgment” for a young driver with no previous violations, is one route in NC. Improper equipment is another, requiring you to go have your speedometer calibrated.
The errors/omissions on the citation itself is another route.
Barring all this, rescheduling the hearing until the State witness, the officer himself, is unavailable to the Court, is the last resort.
The lawyer will be cheaper in the long run than allowing your insurance to get hold of it and jack out her insurance. In my experience, when I was an account exec and driving a great deal, is that these “ticket lawyers” typically run anywhere from $175.00 to $250.00.
You want it reduced to a nonmoving violation, if a prayer for judgment is not possible.
Yes, VA does recognize defensive driving courses, and will take points off your driving record for completing one. I think you can do it once every two years. You will be in class with some real losers but it’s worth it in the long run. AAA usually sponsors the courses as well as private firms.
You can get this tossed but you will need to be in court to do it.
Technically under the law, there is no “unjust” argument to make... unless she wasn’t going faster than the 65... so don’t try.
All you can do is take it straight to the judge (WITHOUT a lawyer) and argue that unsafe conditions (boxed in by tailgating speeders and the semi) warranted the decision.
Now... if she was being tailgated by the unmarked police car, that is entrapment. Cite specific local driving regulations requiring so many car lengths of distance for highway speeds, and point out that the officer was tracking at an unsafe proximity.
Remain respectful, and rely upon the leniency and fair mindedness of the judge. Paying for a lawyer sends the wrong message, and is not worth the cost of the fine if she has to pay it. What costs more is the hit on the driving record and the effect it has on insurance. If you fight it legally, the judge will probably want to make it stick.
Also, stay away from the fundraising argument.
Good luck
If your ticket shows an incorrect license plate number, then produce the registration and point that out. And if the officer cannot even correctly copy down a plate number, which is in big letters/numbers on the rear of the vehicle, then perhaps he read his radar wrong.
Sloppy police work.
As EPU said in post # 2 - Hire a lawyer.
I’m 54 and got only 1 speeding ticket in my life - about 4 years ago. Similar as you. Minding my own business when the HP Bear pulled up behind me and hit the lights. Said I was doing 70 in a 55. The car I was driving at the time shook like a bear over 62ish mph.
He had to go to an overpass and turn around to get me. I was hit with the lights just past a corner with an off ramp screened by trees.
I think the car he was after got off and as he rounded the corner he spotted my car - typical mid size forest green 4 door sedan - Saturn.
Anyway - paid big bucks to a law firm located next to the court house and they got it dropped.
I’m not seeing how this speeding ticket was “unjust”, as “unjust” implies that she isn’t guilty of the crime ...
(1) It sounds like she was speeding, broke the law, and deserved the ticket;
(2) Cops are permitted to pick the most convenient law-breaker to stop.
You may be able to get out of it by showing up to court and hoping the cop no-shows ... but you’ll waste a day of your life doing so. Even then, if the cop shows up, you’ll have to plea bargain or you’ll likely lose at trial. Barney Fife cops in small towns are far more likely to show up than city cops (this type of revenue generation is often what keeps small towns on highways afloat).
You can hire a lawyer, who may be able to get you out on a technicality ... but he’ll likely bill you for traveling to the boonies, and it’ll probably cost more than the ticket.
Overall, you’re better off getting your daughter to pay the ticket (she was the one who sped) ... it likely isn’t worth the hassle of another trip, and you very well may lose anyway.
SnakeDoc
If she was going 77 in a 65 zone, the ticket is legit. Most states permit a margin of error of 5 mph, but you can never trust this, since your speedometer could be off. If it is measuring low, and you think you are withing the 5 mph margin of error, you may not be.
Governor Casey of PA, who objected to the legislature raising the speed limit to 65 on rural interstates, let it be known that the 5 mph margin of error applied only to speed limits of 55 and below, that going 66 in a 65 zone could get one ticketed.
Py the fine and count yourself lucky that you and your daughter are safe.
“I do not doubt that she was going the 77 mph in a 65 mph zone as claimed”
She broke the law. It shouldn’t matter if everyone else was doing it, too.
And I agree with Sacajaweau - passing on a steep hill with a semi behind you??
She should pay the ticket.
As one officer asked: “When you went fishing, did you ever catch them all?”
It doesn’t matter that she was passing a vehicle you consider unsafe, she sped the 77mph and she happened to be the one. Sometimes you are the meeny, sometimes you are the miney and sometimes you are the mo.
EXACTLY! When I took my CDL’s, I learned from the former trucker/instructor... they’ll go 10 or 15 over unless they know something you don’t know. Then you better slow down too.
BTDT. Mr. G was slouched down and the kids were out of view asleep so it appeared I was alone at night. I knew it was a speed trap area and was going below the limit. The trooper actually let it slip he clocked me below the speed limit at the sign change coming into town. Mr. G even showed him his LE ID but to no avail. The jerk was determined to issue the ticket and that was that.
There’s no use fighting. Most times the judge and officer are in cahoots so you’ll be wasting your time and attorney fees. Pay the fine and have her take a defensive driving course so her insurance doesn’t go up. As someone already said, it might have turned out worse if you weren’t there.
She was doing 12 mph over the speed limit. Pay the ticket and move on.
I asked for advice on a speeding ticket here on FR about a year ago. I was caught doing 85 in a 55 zone out-of-state. I got a lot of smart-aleck advice, but a couple of good tips.
I ultimately hired a lawyer that was local to the region where the infraction occurred. It WAS important that the lawyer was local to where the court was located. The lawyer was able to get the fine reduced such that the cost of the lawter’s fees ($400) plus the cost of the fine ($200) was the same as the original fine ($600). But the real advantage is that the out-of-state infraction did not appear on my driving record and there was no change in the cost of my auto insurance. I’m out $600, but its over and its like it never happened.
My otherwise good driving record was a factor in getting the fine reduced. I suspect that your daughter’s good driving record will also be a factor.
I learned that about truckers a long time ago. I was a young sailor driving from home (eastern NC) to Fort Gordon, GA for a service school in May of 1979. I got in between two trucks on the freeway between Columbia and Augusta (I think) and was moving down the road fast. Then the trucks started slowing down. I pulled out to pass the one in front then thought better of it and slipped back in between. As we rounded a curve I saw the 4-car speedtrap up ahead.
I lived in that area for years and know exactly where you’re talking about. And yes, it is a notorious speed trap through that section of highway. If you really want to beat this ticket, then hire a local lawyer and go to court. You’ll win since the trooper did not get the license number correct on the ticket.
However, it will cost more than simply paying the ticket (which is what the troopers and traffic courts count on), so it’s up to you if you want to take a stand on principle, or just pay it and move on.
Just FYI, I had a similar situation with a Frederick County deputy three years ago, who gave me a speeding ticket even though he did not get a radar reading. It was based on his perception about how fast I was going. I hired a local lawyer for a $100 bucks, went to court, and beat it, even though it was only a $90 ticket. Still, I had the satisfaction of knowing that I beat the crooked cop in court, which was well worth the extra $10.
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