Posted on 10/07/2023 1:26:03 AM PDT by Jonty30
That’s why I try to make an art of cutting through the confusion cloud. By simply stating that fascism, socialism, liberalism, and communism all make the arguement that big government is evil, it doesn’t matter where fascism lies on the political line graph.
That was my understanding of the difference - fascism was more oligarchical.
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That’s my understanding too. As economic platform, fascism is halfway between Private property and communism. One can own something and do what they want with it. One can own nothing because all belongs to the State. One can own something if the State allows it, and what you can own the State tells you what you can and cannot fo with it.
If the government mandates that everyone must own this and can’t own that (maybe electric instead of gas powered cars), then the makers of the mandated product and the politicians get in bed together... corrupt politicians and oligarchs.
Yes, I’ve had this debate many times. Some are determined to avoid admitting that the national SOCIALISTS were........wait for it.....Socialists.
Nevermind the numerous quotes from ole Adolf himself who openly said he was a socialist.
Nevermind the acknowledgments at the time from the likes of Time Magazine that what the Nazis were doing was not very different from what the State Socialists aka Communists in Russia were doing.
Nevermind that they believed in the same flawed “shrinking markets” (socialist) theory and that they had the same goals.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=go2OFpO8fyo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dlXqFgqOviw
https://mises.org/library/why-nazism-was-socialism-and-why-socialism-totalitarian
https://www.lewrockwell.com/2001/09/adam-young/the-nazis-were-socialists/
https://wallbuilders.com/the-nazis-really-were-socialists/
ie Corporatism. Y'know like when government regulatory agencies have been captured by big business via business paying their cost of operation and hiring top bureaucrats to cushy well playing jobs and vice versa.
Like, the military with defense contractors.
Like the CDC/FDA and Big Pharma
Like the intel agencies and Big Tech.
Like the Agriculture department and Big Agriculture.
IOW, its exactly like what we have now.
Rule of thumb and prerequisite when Dems make a statement or label something, it is always the exact polar opposite of what they spout.
The Nazis limited the amount of profit a "private" company could make and would simply seize your business if you didn't do as you were told by the government.
THE big difference between the National Socialists and the State Socialists aka Commies is the State Socialists would stupidly parachute in some party bureaucrat who had no idea what he was doing to run a business while the National Socialists would keep the existing owner or manager who actually knew his business in place to run things.....so long as he made the products the government wanted made and within certain price bounds the government set.
Thus National Socialism worked a bit better because it left people in charge who had a clue of how to run things instead of some party flunkie but basically it was the same otherwise. Your "private" property in Nazi Germany or Fascist Italy wasn't really private. You had no rights the state was required to respect. They could and did seize your property (and you were lucky if that's all they did) the second you didn't do as you were told.
Fascism is not about policy, it’s ALWAYS about control. The more party seeks to control the population has a closer it gets to fascism. A party that wants to arrest you for using the (right)”wrong” pronoun, confiscate your stovetop or ceiling fan, mandate you “choice” of power source for your vehicle, register your currency to track your purchases snd limit what you can eat. Is already fascist.
Excellent history. Thank you.
It is interesting seeing socialists and communists praising Hitler in 1939 to 1941 and suddenly declaring Hitler to be enemy number one. Even before 1939 many socialists were fans of fascism. In Orwell's 1984, the quick shift over who was the enemy without anyone being allowed to mention that the change occured was making fun of the quick change by British communists in 1941.
Fascism is not an ideology. It’s an organizational method. Theoretically it can exist on the political right or left. Ultimately, fascism is a strong alliance between government, media and big corporations. The political left in America certainly has achieved that triad by of power. Historically, fascism has been used in left-wing governments. And, I’m still not sure why the NAZI’s were considered a right wing force. I guess they were right of Stalin.
It goes beyond that now:
- we have the gov pushing media companies to act as propaganda agents
- big companies echoing gov interests for favoritism like the gay agenda
-those who don’t “cooperate” are punished, such as the recent lawsuits from the feds against musk that came out of nowhere after he denied them use of his satellites.
My theory is that it’s relative. You can be politically to the right or left of any position. There are conservatives who are to the right of me and there are conservatives who are to the left.
Objectively, fascism is big government socialism, so that makes it on the left in absolute terms. However, liberals claim that it’s right-wing because, to them, they are to the left of fascism which makes them communists or nearly so.
For many years (once I began thinking of it) I view the political spectrum not with Fascism at one side and Leftism at the other, but anarchy at one end and full totalitarianism at the other.
Communism and Fascism are very close to each other at the totalitarian end of the spectrum, and this makes sense. Even in the earlier 20th Century it was recognized by both Communists and Fascists that people could easily make the jump from one totalitarian ideology to the to the other.
Mussolini started out as a socialist. And we now know he was funded by MI5.
I wonder how many of this new generation even know what national socialism is.
Nazi...
The German abbreviation for National Socialist German Workers Party.
Oh, those Right Wing tricksters!
Pretending they are Socialists and support Worker rights!
thanx for this background info
based on how they operate, it all makes sense now
Too much thinking about the Roman Empire. :)
I forgot to mention that Hitler carefully studied - and imitated - the take over of the Russian government by Communist revolutionary Vladimir Lenin in 1917.
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