Posted on 10/09/2004 1:09:21 PM PDT by doug from upland
...riiiiiggggghhhhttt. Nice to compare the waiting list for a vehicles to people waiting for a life saving organs.
BTW, hybrids are pretty much only good for city driving. If you plan to have a lot of highway driving (most people), then the fuel efficiency won't be as great as everyone is saying.
The Kerry health plan will take care of that little problem.
You beat me with that same response by one minute!
I see a potential cottage industry here....
How about somebody retrofitting some Honda Civics or Toyota Tercels with a generator adapted from home use, with a small three-cylinder gasoline or Diesel power unit, with a DC electric drive motor, and a bank of batteries? In quantity, once the kinks got worked out, the retrofit could be done for, oh, about $10,000. There may be a problem getting approval on safety requirements, but as a home-built I understand that some of the less important aspects are waived.
the next hybrid plants are going to be in China.
Correct! The hubris system is just extra weight REDUCING highway mileage at highway speeds.
You will NEVER be paid back for making the conversion, retrofitting a conventional driveline with a hybrid system. It is just some way for tinkerers to fill their time and do a little invention along the way.
Personally I would prefer to go to a steam-powered vehicle, burning methane (compressed natural gas) as fuel, with a fully closed, recirculating steam-water cycle using regeneration heat exchangers. The technology was worked out 80 years ago, and with newer materials to work with, the potential for further development could be highly promising.
Light, simple, low noise level, and highly efficient. All definite bonus points.
My husband traveled 30 miles each way in his Prius mainly on highway 680 in the Bay Area of California and got great gas mileage. He averaged about 700 miles on an 11 gallon tank of gas. That's over 60 mpg.
I thought that depended on a variety of factors. A small engine which is putting out 20% of its maximum power will use less fuel than a twice-as-powerful engine that's putting out 10% of its maximum power. If the hybrid circuitry allows a car to obtain acceptable performance using a smaller engine than would otherwise be required, that would improve engine efficiency. As to whether the increase in energy required to move the car down the road would offset the improvement in engine efficiency, I could imagine that could go either way.
The technologies I personally think hold the most promise are:
The approach I've read about that would seem to offer the best tradeoff of efficiency versus complexity would be to delay the closure of the intake valves during the compression stroke. Unfortunately, because this approach pushes some exhaust gasses temporarily into the intake manifold, I'm not sure regulators would be too keen on it (even though the exhaust gasses that get pushed out one stroke should be inhaled on the next). Other approaches with variable displacement would seem to offer even better potential improvements, but at a cost of much greater complexity. A 'hybrid' approach I've thought about but never heard of being implemented would be to use some means (such as a small 'slave' cylinder sitting atop the main cylinder) which would allow space above the piston between the compression and power strokes, but not between the exhaust and intake strokes. Perhaps too complicated or prone to wear.
But still better mileage than most cars since they are smaller, lighter and have smaller engines.
What are your thoughts on using either variable displacement or delayed valve closure as an adjuct to throttling? From what I've read, such approaches could singificantly improve the efficiency of engines run at low to moderate power levels (thus reducing the "efficiency penalty" of large engines).
"smaller, lighter and have smaller engines"
Right! Lose the extra 500 pounds of electromotion and get even better highway mileage. Leave the hybrids for city driving.
On June 29, the Sun Journal printed a letter from a chap who wants to take tax money from folks who buy SUVs and re-distribute it to folks why buy hybrid cars. Should the government punish folks who are not smart enough to buy a hybrid car? Better yet, we should ask if buying a hybrid car is a smart idea.
According to this chap, he bought a hybrid car, a Toyota Prius, for $21,500. It gets 50 miles per gallon, weighs 2765 pounds, and has a 70 horsepower engine. It also lugs around 38 nickel-metal hydride batteries behind the rear seat. Warning: Don’t try to pass a tractor-trailer truck on a two-lane road.
This chap is enamored with the “savings” his 50 m.p.g. Toyota Prius offers. However, for $10,770 dollars less, almost half-price, he could have bought a Toyota Echo with 108 horsepower, a 54 percent increase over the Prius. 108 horsepower will get you around that semi a lot safer.
In addition, according to the EPA, the Echo gets 41 miles per gallon. At today’s gasoline price of $1.40 per gallon, the $10,770 cost savings the Echo offers will buy 7,692 gallons of gas. Those 7,692 gallons of gas, at 41 miles per gallon, will carry the Echo 315,372 miles. If one drives 10,000 miles per year, the Echo’s savings will be evident for the next 31.5 years. Also, the Echo only has one battery to toss in the land fill at the end of its useful life. Perhaps consumers who avoid today’s hybrid cars are not so ignorant after all.
I agree that hybirds, being smaller and lighter, and having a smaller engine does wonders to mileage.
But that's true for a lot of small cars (hybrids being a slightly better advantage given that the technology). Doesn't mean people should turn in their SUVs for these hybrids. Especially concerning safety.
Now, the SUV hybrids, I'm certain that even some improvement will do great when gas prices hit $3. But still, I don't think even these SUVs will live up to their expectations.
10 to 1 compression ratio, BUT 20 to one expansion ratio. Real Atkinson (1890's) engines. Google it.
Turbo-compounding does much the same thing. I have rough designs and a non working model of some of these engines.
$50 battery in Echo, $4000 battery in Prius, such a difficult choice.
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