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60 years ago: Hitler's desperate last push, The Battle of the Bulge
AP Wire | December 12 2004 | Richard Pyle/AP

Posted on 12/12/2004 8:58:43 AM PST by knighthawk

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To: MEG33

Definitely. But the war could've been won by Christmas 1944 as originally believed if it hadn't been for Eisenhower and Bradley. Bradley got stuck on the Cotentin Peninsula, then Eisenhower came up with the "brilliant" idea of a broad front.

JCH Lee didn't help any, either.


41 posted on 12/12/2004 10:00:31 AM PST by Terpfen (Gore/Sharpton '08: it's Al-right!)
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To: Terpfen

http://www.faqfarm.com/History/WWII/8427
Just a quickie look.
What were Hitler's key mistakes during the war?


42 posted on 12/12/2004 10:00:54 AM PST by MEG33 (Merry Christmas!..,,God Bless All Who Serve Our Country)
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To: mainepatsfan

Would you mind linking me to some good Market-Garden analyses? I know the general reasons why it was a failure, but I don't nkow the specific details behind it.


43 posted on 12/12/2004 10:01:29 AM PST by Terpfen (Gore/Sharpton '08: it's Al-right!)
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To: MEG33

Thank you!


44 posted on 12/12/2004 10:01:54 AM PST by Terpfen (Gore/Sharpton '08: it's Al-right!)
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Comment #45 Removed by Moderator

To: Paleo Conservative

One of my favorite scenes in the movie "Patton" is when Bradley has to break the news to Patton that Montgomery's army is going to be given the bulk of the supplies. Patton say's, "Hell I know I'm a Prima Donna. I admit it! What I can't stand about Montgomery is he won't admit it!!".


46 posted on 12/12/2004 10:03:47 AM PST by mainepatsfan
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To: Terpfen

Hitler was a moron when it came to military matters. He had some great generals but when they would tell him what an idiot he was he would fire them and get someone who was just a yes man. The number of mistakes he made are too numerous to count.


47 posted on 12/12/2004 10:07:30 AM PST by mainepatsfan
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To: Terpfen

There is war and then there is the political war...(All wars are political. (De Gaulle "took Paris?")..There was dealing with Montgomery(Brits) and dealing with Stalin...I know why we did a lot of things(sick of war for one thing ..commie sympathizers another) but I know how long we lived with the consequences.


48 posted on 12/12/2004 10:07:55 AM PST by MEG33 (Merry Christmas!..,,God Bless All Who Serve Our Country)
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To: mainepatsfan
I only shudder to think how today's media would have covered the battle. The New York Times would be demanding a cease fire with Hitler.

More to the point, if FDR were like W, he'd be taking the complaints seriously! That's the tragedy. The NY Times only has influence as clueless Republicans ALLOW them to have influence, or pay them any mind at all.

Memo to the Bush WH - cancel your subscriptions to the Wash Post and NY Times, and stop watching CNN. Please - someday soon. As the commercial says - just do it.

49 posted on 12/12/2004 10:08:59 AM PST by sevry
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To: Terpfen

Have you read "A Bridge Too Far" or seen the movie?


50 posted on 12/12/2004 10:09:26 AM PST by mainepatsfan
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To: mainepatsfan

No to both.


51 posted on 12/12/2004 10:11:29 AM PST by Terpfen (Gore/Sharpton '08: it's Al-right!)
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To: knighthawk
In the wintry darkness, American soldiers sang ''Silent Night'' and heard Germans singing ''Stille Nacht,'' the same carol.

Beautiful song and an interesting anecdote. If competent writers and directors ever take to Hollywood again, this would make an interesting scene in the reenactment of those 'last 10 days'.

52 posted on 12/12/2004 10:11:36 AM PST by sevry
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To: Terpfen

http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?t=56274
Google Market Garden...This was just one thing I found.


53 posted on 12/12/2004 10:12:20 AM PST by MEG33 (Merry Christmas!..,,God Bless All Who Serve Our Country)
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To: wolf24

You know what they would have said:

"This just proves the military has been lying to us. The Germans are no where near defeat."

"There is no way to win this war."

"Hitler has outwitted the Pentagon!!"


54 posted on 12/12/2004 10:12:23 AM PST by mainepatsfan
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To: beebuster2000
funny you should mention that. my dad was in combat in the pacific in ww2. he never, never, would talk about it, and no one even talked about not talking about it. thats one of the major things that bugged me about kerry babbling on about his 4 months in vietnam.

Yeppers, and the one thing your father would never have done was trash his fellow soldiers, and lie about a "seared memory" (Cambodia, Christmas) that never happened.

My late father-in-late was at Hickam Field, Dec. 7, 1941. He was later deployed to Henderson Field on Guadalcanal as an Army Air Force navigator and fought on until 1944, when he was shipped to San Diego with one of those strange jungle rot diseases that cost him over 80% of his stomach. He never talked about the war either.

It's no wonder that the Swift Boat men came after Kerry with all guns blazing.

55 posted on 12/12/2004 10:14:55 AM PST by xJones
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To: sevry

FDR would have called the publisher of the newspaper up and threatened to throw his ass in jail if they didn't knock it off.


56 posted on 12/12/2004 10:16:03 AM PST by mainepatsfan
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To: MEG33
The war , like every war was not run perfectly

Just ask the Nisei.

57 posted on 12/12/2004 10:16:07 AM PST by sevry
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To: Terpfen

That's a good place to start with a broad overview of what the plan was and why it failed.


58 posted on 12/12/2004 10:21:49 AM PST by mainepatsfan
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To: sevry

There's a good scene in Band of Brothers about that.


59 posted on 12/12/2004 10:22:40 AM PST by mainepatsfan
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To: Terpfen
The more I find out about Eisenhower, the less I like.

Read "The Politician" by Robert Welch. Chapter 4:Operation Keelhaul is one of the most hair raising things I've ever read.

FMCDH(BITS)

60 posted on 12/12/2004 10:24:25 AM PST by nothingnew (Kerry is gone...perhaps to Lake Woebegone)
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