Posted on 01/29/2017 6:11:21 PM PST by SkyPilot
http://www.google.com/#q=http:%2F%2Fwww.fursvp.com%2Fgroup%2Ffoxfarm%2F
From the menu and "We'll need to check your ID if you drink" comments - pretty likely minors were commonly in attendance.
Meanwhile -
[Pennsylvanian fur’s body found buried in boyfriend’s yard]
Quite the family friendly "culture".
You'd think whoever runs this...
https://www.fursvp.com/
...would warn folks about pedophiles associated with the "FoxFarm" group - but instead, they just deleted the "FoxFarm" group with no mention of the arrest of the "FoxFarm" group's leader - Fenske (Lupinefox).
That's interesting - when they knew enough to delete the group.
>>I seem to recall Alefantis posting a pic of himself with a panda head on.
It would be a lot easier to believe that this is not a replay of the 1980s SRA hysteria if someone could produce the name of even one person claiming to be a victim of pizzagate.
Without a victim, who do the pizzagate believers plan to charge? And for what crime, exactly? I’ve suggested that we charge them all with Bad Taste in Art, which is about all that the evidence so far produced will support.
Two separate grand juries were presented with the Franklin case and neither one believed that there was enough evidence to warrant an indictment. The bar for a grand jury is much lower than what a court will insist upon. And two of the individuals claiming to be victims were themselves convicted of committing perjury.
I’d be curious to learn who this common figure between Franklin and McMartin is. McMartin is the granddaddy of fake SRA cases so I’m not sure why a connection between the two would enhance Franklin.
Folks should read the Franklin books and make up their own minds. Also, they should watch Conspiracy of Silence. The fact that a bicameral, bipartisan panel of the Nebraska legislature held hearings on the matters and found credible evidence, that their private investigator’s plane blew up in midair after gathering a batch of evidence from one of the perps, and that some of the accused were later convicted of pedophilia, should all be of interest.
Ritual abuse is quite real.
Illinois, Idaho and California passed ritual abuse laws at least 20 years ago. IIRC, those laws are still on the books and the text can be found online. I invite folks to read the Idaho statute. If the activities described in the statute are “fake”, how did the law manage to pass? why is it still on the books?
Ritual abuse is real in many places. Franklin wasn’t one of them.
The Nebraska legislature referred the case to the Douglas County grand jury which did not find evidence of child abuse but did charge two of the accusers with perjury.
A separate federal grand jury looked at the case and they also didn’t find evidence warranting an indictment, but like the Douglas County grand jury they indicted one of the accusers with perjury.
Discredited cases like Franklin and McMartin aren’t doing the cause of ending child abuse any favor. They just increase cynicism and make prosecutors less inclined to believe new charges where there might actually be real evidence of real crime.
” If the activities described in the statute are “fake”, how did the law manage to pass? why is it still on the books?”
What are you talking about?
No one is saying that there isn’t child abuse and that there shouldn’t be a law against it.
The issue is fake accusations of abuse, just like with any other crime on the books.
It would only be a replay if innocent people were charged, prosecuted and jailed for a crime they did not commit. I’m thinking of the young NJ lady who was jailed for raping children with an imaginary sword - she was freed through the help of WSJ writer Dorothy Rabinowitz. A classic study in hysteria! In the pizzagate theory, no one has been charged with anything. Just a lot of nasty smoke blowing around.
“Ritual abuse is real in many places. Franklin wasn’t one of them.”
The funny thing is that the case involved in this thread, the Idaho ritual abuse statute, the testimony of the sexually/ritually abused McMartin children, the testimony of the sexually/ritually abused children in the Franklin case, and many other references on the issue all describe similar types of cult (involving pedophilia, child porno, drugs, costumes, cross dressing) behaviors.
Name one ritual abuse case that you believe to be real (you say they are real in many places?). Tell us. Everything you have written in your posts would seem to indicate that you believe that ritual abuse is made up.
Thanks for the research and information. This bastard needs to be put away for a long time. Can you believe he made bail and walked out of jail?
A caged fox leaves no tracks?
Tag and release...
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-security-drones-idUSBRE95I1NW20130619
The only actual cases of ritual abuse that I know of involve psychotic parents who were convinced that their children were possessed.
Pedophilia certainly exists. Brutal child abuse like the Gabriel Fernandez case exists. There is the rare self avowed Satanist like Richard Ramirez the Night Stalker. But I don’t know of a single case of Satanic Ritual Abuse that has ever stood up to scrutiny.
I suspect that the seeds of SRA credulity were sown in 1968 and 1973 with Rosemary’s Baby and The Exorcist. But the two characters that really lit the fuse were Lauren Stratford and Mike Warnke, both of whom were exposed as complete frauds in 1990.
I’m not as familiar as you are with the origins. As a member of the Skeptic Society and an admirer of Dorothy Rabinowitz and a student of my very commonsensical mother, I immediately doubted the ritual abuse stuff that started in the late 70s, early 80s as well as the “repressed memory” theory that ruined the lives of men who were accused, falsely, by their daughters of rape. Something that moron Roseanne Barr did.
“As a member of the Skeptic Society”
What is your view of the Bible?
In post #87, you wrote “ritual abuse is real in many places”
In post #88, in response to my post #86, you wrote “No one is saying that there isn’t child abuse and that there shouldn’t be a law against it.” We are not talking about child abuse, we are talking about RITUAL abuse, which is the specific subject of the state statutes.
In post #90, when pressed to give an example, you wrote “The only actual cases of ritual abuse that I know of involve psychotic parents who were convinced that their children were possessed.”, a position which is diametrically opposed to the one stated in post #87.
So you blame the parents. That is consistent with the position taken by cult members and Satanists themselves.
I ask again: if there is no such thing as ritual abuse, why are there state statutes on the books in California, Illinois and Idaho which deal very specifically with ritual abuse?
Lauren Stratford and Mike Warnke were a big deal in some Christian circles in the 70s and 80s. And on national television once their stories became famous. Both offered up vivid stories of experiences with satanic rings, as victim or participant. They gave talks, wrote books, sold tapes about their firsthand knowledge of satanic ritual abuse.
Some friends of mine were investigative journalists for a Christian magazine that began looking into their stories. They found that when you tracked down the names and places mentioned by these two that their stories fell apart. They were both frauds and the magazine exposed them in some heavily researched articles in 1990. Stratford turned out to have had a history of mental illness. Warnke didn’t have that excuse, he knew what he was doing and he was making good money selling his BS to an eager audience.
But before they were exposed they really got the satanic ritual abuse idea planted, and Stratford even managed to insert herself in the McMartin case, which itself was a product of the panic that they had unleashed- Stratford claiming that she and the elderly Mrs McMartin had been lesbian lovers. This was just more of her insanity.
Anyway echoes of that SAR hysteria continue on today. People make unsupported claims that come right out of the stories spun by these two, or really three since there was a third player, one John Todd. Anytime you hear stories of ritual abuse start looking to see if there is any real evidence being offered, or if there is just a lot of excitement and a good story and a bunch of dots being connected.
“So you blame the parents. That is consistent with the position taken by cult members and Satanists themselves.”
So name some of these Satanists and cult members who have done that. Surely you can provide some examples of this claim of yours. Unless you are just making it up to bolster your claim.
“I ask again: if there is no such thing as ritual abuse, why are there state statutes on the books in California, Illinois and Idaho which deal very specifically with ritual abuse?”
Well that’s a good question, since there is no such California law on the books.
There was a sentencing enhancement for ritual abuse passed in 1995, penal code 667.83, but even that was repealed in 1997. Whatever source you are using for your information is 20 years behind the times.
But as to your question about why those laws were passed, the laws were passed in response to the same ritual abuse hysteria that had generated the McMartin case shortly before. Politicians respond to current events, they aren’t philosophers.
A question you should answer is why did only 3 states pass such laws? How come the other 47 didn’t?
I joined the Skeptic Society years ago in my outrage over people going to jail over insane claims made by children, guilt-ridden parents and loony prosecutors. They were trying to educate the public over false prosecutions. I don’t have to support everything they believe in if that’s what you’re getting at.
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