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Ninth Circuit gives green light for much larger travel ban (Yes, you read that correctly)
The Hill ^ | June 24, 2017 | Nolan Rappaport

Posted on 06/24/2017 6:40:53 PM PDT by 2ndDivisionVet

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To: Keyhopper

And maybe they’ll catch something weighty when they do get fire.


41 posted on 06/25/2017 2:37:34 AM PDT by Yosemitest (It's SIMPLE ! ... Fight, ... or Die !)
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To: M. Thatcher

It’s written by a lawyer, without regard to the typical reader who might pick up the article. Some of the analysis is worth reading but he really needed to have a simplistic three-liner to start the piece and explain the bulk of the decision.


42 posted on 06/25/2017 2:42:26 AM PDT by pepsionice
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

There is a reason the 9th Circus is the most overturned court. They always violate the law.


43 posted on 06/25/2017 3:40:25 AM PDT by Freedom_Is_Not_Free (Trump: What to do now I can't repeal Obamacare? I know, lets start a war with Russia!)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Trying to do a combination of a small extra delay, and pre-wipe some of the egg off their faces before SCOTUS overturns another of their asinine rulings?


44 posted on 06/25/2017 3:46:36 AM PDT by trebb (Where in the the hell has my country gone?)
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To: DrDude
A third travel ban will be based on foreign country vetting not meeting standards for information, set by US State Dept., Department of National Intelligence, and Immigration. This ban will cover more than 6 countries. Because this ban will not be issued by a Trump EO, the courts will not have resort to the rule of law invoked to strike down the first two, that legal rule being, "because the order was issued by Trump."

Three sentences instead of one. Hopefully meets your wishes even though it violates the terms of your request.

45 posted on 06/25/2017 3:59:56 AM PDT by Cboldt
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To: NutsOnYew
-- 9th Circuit is walking back their opinion before the SCOTUS slaps them down. --

No, the article is speculation about what will happen in the future, independent of any further processing of the litigation now before SCTOUS.

46 posted on 06/25/2017 4:02:14 AM PDT by Cboldt
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To: MadMax, the Grinning Reaper

Bump - invaluable history. Few have the inclination to look it. If the information isn’t spoon fed, most people don’t get the information. That facet of human nature enables the press to mislead.


47 posted on 06/25/2017 4:05:42 AM PDT by Cboldt
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To: Freedom_Is_Not_Free
US v. Stewart, (9th Cir, 2003)

Section 922(o) makes it unlawful to "transfer or possess a machinegun." Notably absent from this provision is any jurisdictional requirement that the machinegun has traveled in or substantially affected interstate commerce. We decide whether this statute, as applied to Stewart, offends the Commerce Clause. ...

Because these firearms were genuinely homemade, we find that Stewart did not obtain his machineguns by "us[ing] the channels of interstate commerce." Thus, although Rambo found section 922(o) to be generally valid under the Commerce Clause, Rambo's reasoning does not cover Stewart's case. ...

We reverse Stewart's conviction for machinegun possession under section 922(o) as an unlawful extension of Congress's commerce power and affirm his conviction for possession of firearms by a felon.

SCOTUS ordered the 9th Circuit to reverse this decision, using the Raich case as rationale to uphold the criminal conviction of Stewart.

48 posted on 06/25/2017 4:13:01 AM PDT by Cboldt
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To: Cboldt
No, the article is speculation about what will happen in the future, independent of any further processing of the litigation now before SCTOUS. (sic)

You are probably correct. I was just referencing this statement regarding the 9th removing part of their own injunction:

but it vacated the portions of the injunction that relate to the government doing an internal review of its vetting procedures, which could lead to a much larger ban

I get that this clears the way for future establishment of bans, somewhat. I was just commenting on the timing of the announcement.

49 posted on 06/25/2017 5:57:21 AM PDT by NutsOnYew
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To: NutsOnYew
-- You are probably correct. I was just referencing this statement regarding the 9th removing part of their own injunction --

The District Court, in the 9th Circuit decision, enjoined the administration from studying the issue!

See Section 2(a) of Executive Order 13780, as well as section 5. The Court prohibited the government from undertaking the orders described in those sections, too.

The article that is at the top of this thread is a stand-alone article. The 9th Circuit hasn't made any new announcement. The last word from it is its order upholding in part and striking in part, the injunction asserted by the lower federal court.

In other words, the 9th Ciruit removed part of the injunction weeks ago, as part of its FIRST and ONLY OPINION on taking the case relating to EO-2.

50 posted on 06/25/2017 6:08:17 AM PDT by Cboldt
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To: Cboldt

Got it. Thanks.


51 posted on 06/25/2017 7:04:03 AM PDT by NutsOnYew
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To: MadMax, the Grinning Reaper; Cboldt
Thanks for the great info! More here:

Terrorism in America: The Developing Internal Security Crisis

---

COLLAPSE OF I NTELLIGENCE GATHERING CAPABILITY

Through the Freedom of Information Act, as well as through court proceedings, organizations like the American Civil Liberties Union, the Socialist Workers Party, and the Political Rights De fense Fund have been able to for c e disclosure of hitherto closely held information regarding the use of confidential informants by law enforcement agencies, including the Federal Bureau of Investi gation, thereby effectively crippling intelligence gathering by the law enforcement communi t y to the extent that it relates to internal security work. 12 These actions ma! perhaps be more full! appreciated when one considers that the current campaign against Lamestic intelligence gathering for internal security purposes was initiated in 1970 as t he ACLU' s "Political Surveillance Project with "dissolution of the nation's vast surveillance (i.e., intelligence) network a top priority This project was designed to operate in three ways a research project, litigation and legislative action It is signi f icant that the research director for ACLU's anti-intelligence gathering efforts is Frank J. Donner, three times identified in sworn testimony before congressional committees as a member of the Communist Party (the ACLU rescinded its ban on Other organizat i ons which have provided attorneys for this drive include the National Lawyers Guild, the Center for Constitutional Rights, and the National Emergency Civil Liberties Committee. Both the NLG and NECLC have been officially cited many times as Commu nist fro nts, and the CCR has been described as an offshoot of the Guild.

The other two groups cited above the SWP and PRDF are of particular importance because of their effectiveness in bringing about the destruction of domestic intelligence gathering activity.

The SWP is generally portrayed in the broadcqst and print media as a socialist organization whose members, at worst, hold "unpopular views: tied to this portrait is the alleged failure of the govern ment to find, during some 38 years of surveillance, any e vidence of provable illegality on the part of the SWP and .its members, an al legation which appears to ignore the fact that in 1941, some 18 Communists in 19671 According to the Rouse Cdttee on Un-American Activities in its February 16, 1959, report on C o mmunist Legal Subversion, Donner was identified as a member of the CPUSA by Herbert Fuchs, Mortimer Reimer and Harry Cooper in sworn testimOny before the Conunittee on December 13, 1955, December 14, 1955 and March 1, 1956, respectively. All three were fo r mer Communist Party members who, based on first-hand knowledge, testified to Donner's having been a member of a Communist cell comprised of lawyers employed by the National Labor Rela eons Board in Washington D.C during the 1940's; On June 28, 1956, Donne r appeared before the Cdttee and "invoked the first and fifth amendments when he was questioned concerning Communist Party membership and affiliations."

According to the sam8 docuxmnt, Donner "was recently named general counsel for the United Electrical, R adio and Machine Workers of America characterized as a Communist-controlled union, which was ousted by the CIO in 1950 and has been actively associated with three of the Communist Party's most important front or ganizations: the National Lawyers Guild, th e American Committee for Protection of Foreign Born, and the Emergency Civil Liberties Committee.

Donner has served on the advisory board of the Organizing Committee for a Fifth Estate (OC-51, whose magazine Counterspy has been widely credited with helping by publicizing his identity in its pages bring about the murder in December 1975, of CIA agent Richard Welch in Athens, Greece More recently, 13 top leaders of the SWP were prosecuted and jailed in Minneapolis Minnesota, under the terms of the Smith Act f or advocating the over throw of the United States government by force and violence. Also in 1947 and 1948, the Attorney General of the.United States offi cially found that the SWP was an organization which seeks "to alter the form of government of the Uni t ed States by unconstitutional means It would certainly seem that the facts are sharply at variance with the currently-popular impression

NATURE AND ROLE OF SOCIALIST WORKERS PARTY

Based on available evidence, including internal documents published by the o rganization and intended solely for its own mem bership, the SWP is not merely a "socialist" organization. It is a revolutionary Communist group which adheres to the theory of the permanent revolution" enunciated by Leon Trotsky, one of the prin cipal fig ures of the Bolshevik Revolution of 1917. Further, the SWP teaches candidates for full party membership that the,ultimate necessity will be the violent overthrow of the United States gov ernment, although, for tactical reasons, the SWP does generally oppo se terrorist violence as it is often rather haphazardly carried out Basic SWP doctrine is well expressed in the declaration of The main specific task of the S.W.P. is the mobilization of principles adopted at the organization's founding conference in 1938 : the American masses for struggle against American capitalism and for its overthrow In a similar vein, the declaration avows that the party's goal is "the overthrow of the capitalist state and the dictatorship of the proletariat Again, the SWP "always mak e s clear that war cannot be permanently prevented unless the imperial ist government of the United States is overthrown and its place taken by a Workers' State II That the Socialist Workers Party is in reality a revolutionary Communist organization believi n g in the ultimate need for armed violence to overthrow the existing order is made abundantly clear in.the following extract from a resolution adopted at the party's 1940 national convention The Bolshevik party of Lenin is the only party in history which s u ccessfully conquered and held state power. The S.W.P., as a combat organization, which aims at achieving power in this country, models its organization forms and methods after those of the Russian Bolshevik party, adapting them, naturally to the experienc e of recent years and to concrete American traditions 14 The S.W.P. as a revolutionary workers party is based on the doctrines of scientific socialism as embodied in the principal works of Marx, Engels Lenin and Trotsky and incorporated in the bas'ic docum ents and resolution of the first four Congresses of the Communist (3rd) International and of the con- ferences and congresses of the Fourth International.

Related to this entire concept is the following extremely re vealing statement made by the SWP's Nati onal Secretary in an address to the party's 1973 national convention You know, our ideas aren't originally American ideas. Our ideas are basically Russian. That's what Comrade Cannon LJames P. Cannon, founder of the SWP/ always emphasized. And if you look up at the baiiners of Lenin and Trotsky there, you will see the two main Russians whose ideas theyare As indicated above, the SWP's disavowal of terrorist violence as it is often carried out is based on tactical considerations. It is not that the SWP oppo s es violence as such, whether it be terrorist or otherwise; rather, the organization disavows violence Lncluding terrorist violence, that is not under its direction, or that is not fully justified by a specific set of circumstances. Thus, the issue becomes , instead of a question of ethics, one of utility within the context of a given revolutionary situation or, put another way, terrorism is, rather than a question of abstract morality, something to be used according to the dictates of the objective realitie s of the moment. It becomes, to quote a famous aphorism attributed to Soviet leader V. M. Molotov in another con text a matter of taste Such is the clear import of a statement by one of the SWP's key leaders as published in 1973 in the Fourth International ' s International Internal Discussion Bulletin The word "terrorism" is commonly used to mean the politics of those who believe that violent actions against individual bourgeois figures can bring about social change, precipitate a revolutionary situation or e lectrify or help mobilize the masses even if under taken by isolated individuals or groups. Terrorism in that sense is rejected by the Marxist movement. But under the conditions of civil war, terrorist acts can have a.totally different political import. T h eir iso lated nature fades. In the process of an insurrection terrorist acts mxn be advantageous to the workers movement. They mayalso be damaging. But terrorist acts that are not part of a generalized mass armed struggle remain isolated and are detriment a l to the workers movement Emphasis in original 15 In addition, the SWP is a constituent part of the Trotskyite Communist Fourth International of the importance of basic Trotskyite revolutionary ideology that despite the fact that the majority leadership w i thin the SWP opposes terrorist violence on tactical grounds, the SWP remains committed to the Fourth International and the International's leadership, which supports overt terrorist violence in many countries, especially in Latin America where Trotskyism a nd terrorism are by no means mu tually exclusive phenomena. This is made dramatically clear by the language of a resolution passed at the Ninth World Congress of the Fourth International in 1969 It is interesting as an illustration Take advantage of every opportunity not only to in crease the number of rural guerrilla nuclei but also to promote forms of armed struggle especially adapted to cer tain zones (for example, the mining zones in Bolivia) and to undertakeactions in the big cities. aimed both at str i k ing the nerve centers (key points in the economy and trans port, etc.) and at punishing the hangmen of the regime as well as achieving propagandistic. and psychological successes the experience of the European resistance to Nazism would be helpful in th is regard).

Such is the true nature of the media-popularized "socialist group which, with its lawsuits and FOI actions, conducted chiefly through the PRDF, which operates as a front for the SWP rather than merely as an independent legal action organization , has done as much as any other organization to immobilize intelligence gathering through the use of informants. It is clear that, according to any even marginally rational standard, there is more than enough presump tive evidence available towarrantsurve i llance of the SWP as a po tential source of revolutionary violence within th.is nation might assume that .the law enforcement community does engage in such surveillance of the SWP, and this certainly has been the case in the past; however, because of guid e lines promulgated by former Attorney General Edward Levi in April 1976, the FBI has ended its 38-year surveillance of the SWP One The true nature of both the Socialist Workers Party and the Fourth Inter national has been documented, in elaborate detail, i n two publications which are literally indispensable to an understanding of this question testimony of Herbert Romerstein in hearings Trotskyite Terrorist International Subcommittee to Investigate the Administration of the Internal Security Act and Other I nternal Security Laws of the Committee on the Judiciary, U.S. Senate, 94th Congress, 1st Session, July 24, 1975, and a volume by Representative Lawrence P. McDonald on Trotskyism and Terror: The Strategy of Revolution (Washington, D.C ACU Education and Res earch Institute, 1977 They are the 16 Despite the SWP's adherence torevolutionary Communist ideology and despite the SWP's demonstrated support for the pro-terrorist leadership of the Fourth International, there are today no FBI in formants operating with i n the organization. This is because under the Levi guidelines surveillance by informant must be directly re lated to the actual or imminent committing of violence There is FBI surveillance, albeit to a far more limited extent than was the case in the past , of the Communist Party, USA, based on a recognition of the Party's close ties to the Soviet Union, although even this surveillance is no longer a part of the.Bureau's domestic security activity

52 posted on 06/25/2017 4:28:28 PM PDT by Fedora
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