Posted on 09/06/2023 11:07:49 AM PDT by Red6
Reported that they has asked Poland for help in locating some of the 14 million that left Ukraine when the war started, in an effort to force them back to Ukraine.
meanwhile, Putin is forced to do another conscription ... from non-European Russia, of course
and Russia places barrier troops behind the front lines, to shoot any deserters ... just like the ol’ Soviet Union did in WWII
sounds like a lot of Russian troops aren’t really that interested in the Ukraine fight either
so when’s the Russian Victory Parade?
as elusive as the Sasquatch ... and about as possible ...
LOL
They’re running out of men to throw into the meat grinder. Now they’re trying to grab women to throw in. This is just sad.
———-
Don’t forget the estimated 160,000 Ukie males that fled Ukraine. Poland has been asked to return them, by force if necessary.
Poland I believe already finalized the law or is voting on it…..they are not really to happy about the huge costs ( $ billions) housing and feeding them.
The Ukies in Poland and other countries after a year and a half are “ The dinner guests that refused to leave”…they aren’t voluntarily going back to a destroyed infrastructure, economy, society…..Interpol HAS been given all the names of war aged Ukie males so I suspect they will begin “ repatriating “ them soon.
“Putin is the warmonger who started this war”
A moral issue.
How cute.
why have a victory parade when they are having too much fun lobbing missiles into the bunkers containing the pedophile NATO advisors?
Once Ukraine wipes out their babes on the Front Line, why would any Straight Western Country still support them.
...come to think of it, there aren’t any Straight Western Countries left, other than Hungary, and they’re neutral in this war.
Pack em full of powder and send them in a howitzer...help with the ammo shortage.
Don’t know for sure.
They use terms like mobilize, register, and enlist very loosely (all the same for a journalist).
But from the sound of it, they are compelling service for women with certain skills soon (1 October).
Likewise, Poland is looking at extraditing men back to Ukraine:
https://thetimeshub.in/poland-announced-the-extradition-of-ukrainian-men-what-is-known/3852/. Have not heard what the Germans and others are doing.
What the media is not reporting (first hand knowledge) is that many of these men are kids, i.e. they were under age before the war began and their family got them out of Ukraine, now they are over 18 and Ukraine wants its cannon fodder. I ran into such a boy at the Frankfurt main train station (Germany) just recently.
It will be interesting to see how long we can keep this going.
The fact that it’s not our people bleeding or being forced to fight helps. You’d have an immediate repulsive public reaction if it were Americans fighting and dying there.
Furthermore, the MSM is basically owned or beholden to the same people that wanted this war in the first place (our ruling oligarchs), and this is true in Europe and the US, so they are all in agreement (unlike Iraq where the German and French media went anti-war even before wars begin) and you have practically no dissent.
Finally, Biden is a Democrat and that helps. The MSM is mostly pro Democrat and if it were a Republican in office they’d be much more inclined to point out all the negatives.
The only cracks you’re seeing is that some of the folk in the West are begining to see that this is costing them. You’re seeing limited use of this issue in opposition politics but the establishment Republicans were all on board as well early on.
Ukrainians are fighting an invasion from Russia, they are not “cannon-fodder”, the Russian soldiers and prison draftees are, the Ukraians have no choice but to fight.
Oh, ok.
https://www.ft.com/content/3d6041fb-5747-4564-9874-691742aa52a2
https://seekingalpha.com/article/4453644-blackrock-stock-largest-asset-manager-keeps-growing
When people die while others get rich, you’re economic “cannon fodder.”
When it’s about the rich, what they wanted, it was unnecessary, with a predictable result, that makes those people dying political “cannon fodder.”
The rich wanted Ukraine and sent in cannon fodder to kill and conquer the people of the nation who are resisting and defending their homeland.
I think I understand what you’re saying.
Yes. I agree.
I don’t think the Ukraine wanted this war. I don’t think the average German, Frenchman, American, or Russian wanted it either. Who really wanted this? https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/ukrainian-president-zelenskiy-holding-talks-with-biden-adviser-says-2021-12-09/
Who were the people that were pushing for this really?
All the big multinational corporations and financial institutions investing big in Ukraine, both from North America and Europe.
For them EU membership is access to markets, a common framework and stability in policies, while NATO provides the physical security. Furthermore, for us specifically, NATO is the mechanism through which we exercise some influence over Europe.
I don’t think the average Ukrainian or Russian were sitting at home excited, wringing their hands and cheering on the prospect of war in October 2021. The wheels of this war were set in motion by greed and people whose names we’ll never hear about in the news, but stood to benefit, and have influence over the political process.
Biden is a political whore. Someone selling political influence his entire career. In his first month in office he already made sure the PRC (trade tariffs and restrictions), big tech, pharma, and a whole laundry list of special interests and individuals were happy. Ukraine was just another block to check.
Putin and the Russian rich wanted Ukraine and he invaded it, now the victims are fighting for their lives and their freedom.
A timeline helps:
1. WE SET THIS ALL IN MOTION in October 2021: https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/ukrainian-president-zelenskiy-holding-talks-with-biden-adviser-says-2021-12-09/
2. Russia goes in a world tour, repeatedly stating that they will NOT tolerate more missiles, fighters, tanks, bombers, and troops of ours playing on their border:
3. By end of November the Russians are moving forces in large numbers to the border of Ukraine, conducting live fire exercises, etc.
The Russians should not be expected to swallow a shit pill we would not swallow if in their shoes. In fact, we have not historically and our “shere of influence” and “red line” is far further from our border, larger and with a lower threshold. We see the Pacific Rim as ours, we see Central and South America as ours, Europe as ours... if the Soviets dare put missiles in Cuba, sovereign or not, we threatened a war, even if 90 miles of water separate our two nations, Washington DC is far further from Cuba and there were no such thing as hypersonic missiles...: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cuban_Missile_Crisis
We put the Russians in an awful position, either acquiesce to a horrible security situation, or go to war, and in short time since we were deliberately moving as fast as possible.
Why can Russia not accept Ukraine in NATO, at least not without assurances and limitations?
-Ukraine and Russia have the same rail gauge.
-They are connected by major hardball roads.
-Ukraine has airfields capable of supporting strategic bombers and logistics: B52/2 C5.
-Ukraine is big and can hide things in large forested areas.
-With a complex and large infrastructure, big economy, and landmass, Ukraine can support the permanent basing of US and other NATO troops.
-Land tied to other NATO nations (Poland, Romania, Slovakia, Hungary), and with major sea ports, logistics is easy.
-Situated to the South West, and extending East, Ukraine is in close proximity to the bulk of Russian ICBMS (boost phase), and along their flightpath (mid course) intercept. With a hypersonic missile, ***6 minutes time of flight to Moscow.*** This is why us bailing on the ballistic missile treaty plays a role today. We would have an immense first strike advantage:
https://www.armscontrol.org/act/2002-07/news/us-withdraws-abm-treaty-global-response-muted
-With areas of flat and open terrain, Ukraine allows a large mechanized force to be shoved into Russia.
-Ukraine would hand the Black Sea’s control to the US.
Now, you can assume that the Russians are just mean evil people, led by an irrational mad man that wants to rebuild the Soviet empire, with no facts, time table, nor realistic motiv. Or you can consider that maybe the Russians aren’t so entirely stupid, that we are asking them to accept something we would never accept, that a timeline doesn’t match up with the random act of un-aggravated aggression, nor do the Russians have a motive to damage one of their major trade partners, etc...
Ukraine is a colossal policy failure which led to a war and likely long term proxy campaigns against each other. Eventually, American kids will die.
Afghanistan was a policy disaster, and Ukraine is no better. Only in Ukraine you have economic interests both in the US and Europe that wanted this.
This is IMHO: Ukraine was a “half baked” idea conjured up by the same geniuses which gave us Afghanistan, idiots like Jake Sullivan. It was supposed to make important people happy, those that were behind Biden.
The ONLY difference between the disaster in Afghanistan and Ukraine is that Biden isn’t taking a black eye and bloody nose regards Ukraine. He and his clowns should, but they aren’t.
There was no reason for this war. It was an extremely high risk gamble with a relatively low pay off (except for Biden) since Ukraine would have likely been in the EU had this war not happened and even with the blessing of the Russians. Ukraine already was enjoying training, arms, Intel sharing, even some exercise with NATO nations etc. Making this into a “winner takes all” situation, ignoring Russia’s security concerns, caused this war, and it has a predictable outcome.
Answer this, what was wrong with the trajectory we were on (arm, train, share Intel with Ukraine) all the way until October 2021?
I know when Russia’s rich invaded Ukraine and launched the biggest European war since WWII to conquer new lands, population, and wealth.
Realize, the same folks that caused this war also hold the power to end it: the US administration.
Since you pretend to be on Ukraines side, ask yourself if Ukraine is better off today?
-Ukraines economy is down > 1/3 in GDP.
-Inflation is over 26%
-EU membership was in reach before the war, now it’s just talk.
-Millions of refugees, many not to return.
-Infrastructure is damaged.
-Thousands dead.
-More crippled and permanent drains on the state.
-Loss of land and people in the East, an industrial area and sea port also gone.
-Internal instability.
Besides BS casualty reports our own government knows to be fake but won’t refute, stories of ghosts of Kiev, Snake Island, girls with blue and yellow ribbons in her hair sucking a lollipop and holding a shotgun, another glorious counter offensive, and a real life action figure president that comes in an olive drab T-shirt, what ACTUAL success, benefit, advantage has come out of this war for Ukraine?
1. Real simple question, was it worth it: https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/ukrainian-president-zelenskiy-holding-talks-with-biden-adviser-says-2021-12-09/
2. Another real simple question, who made that decision to bring Ukraine into NATO?
3. And a final question, if you look at it analytical, did it EVER make sense in terms of ROI and risk, to make that decision to bring Ukraine into NATO?
This was a colossal failure by the Biden administration.
The rest is just spin.
Wrong: for “us” it’s the rich pushing EU and NATO.
For Russia it was overwhelmingly security concerns regards NATO and having missile defense, missiles, troops, armored forces, fighters, bombers, our ships based in Ukraine.
Get this into your skull, NO ONE (China, Russia, or the US) want another major world power putting their bases on their border. We simply are so arrogant, and see Russia as weak, that we no longer care what they say. We feel we can steamroll them, and we have been, may it be in all their frontier nations, along their border, with treaties we simply decide to break (ballistic missile treaty), Minsk (cheated), and no NATO East expansion (lied).
Just an offer for you, and only you.
Put your money where your mouth is.
How about a bet?
***$100 that 1 year from now, Ukraine will not be in NATO, will still have lost land, not be in the EU, and their economy will still be in shambles?
If you’re so sure of yourself, if you know that Ukraine will take back that land and become a NATO member, it’s an easy $100 for you.
Think about it this way: if you’re unwilling to take the bet, and you know Ukraine has little chance of regaining its lost territory and won’t be a real NATO member for a while, what are the folks dying today, dying for? https://youtu.be/ZmInkxbvlCs?feature=shared
I understand there sometimes are circumstances where war is unavoidable, where death and destruction are necessary. I am by no means a pacifist.
-But this war was 100% avoidable.
-It was unnecessary.
-It was predictable.
-The outcome was predictable.
-***Worst of all, it was a war where despite all the sovereignty, democracy and human rights BS talk, WE put the the Russians in a position where they have legitimate security concerns and which WE would never accept today and have not historically.***
Our actions, what we initiated/set in motion, will have long lasting consequences for us too, may they be economic (the push for a new reserve currency, the growth of BRICS), and in security matters (Russia arming and providing Intel to folks that want to hurt us in the future - the proxy war games of the Cold War will make a return). Right now we feel like we’re masters of the situation, in control, and that they can’t really get us back, but they will. The world is constantly changing and it’s only a matter of time.
Do not be surprised when our boys suddenly get shot down by an advanced MANPADS or one of our ships has a big hole in its side someplace... Payback is hell. And of course when that day comes, words like “terrorism” will come flying from our pie hole, then it’ll suddenly be all different and what we did in Ukraine of course will be forgotten, because that’s just how we are. Of course our NATO allies if not in a position to personally benefit will forget us too.
This is a war where the MSM should be ripping this administration a new @sshole, but because it’s our corporate media, owned by our rich that wanted this, because the Euros are with us, and because he’s a Democrat, he gets a free pass.
Imagine these stories dominate our MSM: how we are financing a mercenary army. How we trained and equipment groups with a Nazi ideology. How many of these mercenaries come from poorer countries like Colombia and Brazil. How we sent Depleted Uranium ammunition to Ukraine. That our state department is essentially condoning the movement of fighters and money, Ukraine is recruiting from their state department offices in the US, and > 200 Americans have lost their lives. How we blew up a gas pipeline of an allied nation and what that is doing to them economically... But no worries, we have news, the Russians have propaganda.
No wonder you guys are so nutty, why are you writing all that rambling crazy to me?
In your nutty imagination, you created some imaginary person to post to with ideas, positions, and opinions that you created in your own mind to argue with.
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