Huck Finn Petition Goes to School Board

The Oregonian ^ | 10/29/02 | Clifton R. Chestnut

[MacDorcha]

you are correct on two counts. i am arrogant, and i realize(note, NOT assume) that my message is more important than my grammar. as for the rest of it, yes, "o" IS archaic. kudos for recognizing it! still don't know if you even realize i PREFER the archaic to the modern. OH GOD NO! I MISSED AN "E" IN A WORD!!! you still haevn't addressed the simple fact ive pointed out every time now. i do not give a flying rats excremint about impressing the likes of you, who seems to be the only person on the whole of freep who cares any way. get over your self. we all view our selves as more important than those unknown around us, but aren't you a little excessive on the presuming?

a wise man once said "why question the ways of genius? who would a simple mind be to find fault with something i don't fully understand myself? maybe they know something beyond my capabilities."

in short, shut up. i'm sure you're a very nice peson, but as long as you're telling me to change my ways, i'm NOT going to listen. so just stop trying.

[Rebel_Ace]

I now sit in stunned silence, rapt in awe at your staggering intellect.

What at first appeared to me to be merely poor, sloppy and lazy writing is in fact a work of genius. How stupid of me. Thank you ever so much for explaining to me that you are indeed a genius, operating on a plane far above my meager means to understand.

Now I must go to work out a method to tell the difference between poor, sloppy and lazy writing and works of genius, for those times when the genius does not explain it to me. This might take a while, since a lot of writing I see from fourth graders looks a lot like works of sheer genius at this point.

[Devil_Anse]

How refreshing to see that the people here get it. "Huckleberry Finn" IS The Great American Novel. Remember that book that came out several years ago (not you, Mac, since you're so young), "Everything I Ever Needed To Know, I Learned In Kindergarten"? I never read that one, but I feel that I could say, "Everything I ever needed to know, I learned in 'Huckleberry Finn.'"

My children don't need to study it in school, although one of them has had it assigned. I've read it to them several times, beginning when they were in grade school. (They won't let me read to them anymore.)

I found a lot of wisdom on this thread; one of my favorites is "The world didn't begin the split-second you were born." I wish more people would remember that.

As for this 17-yr-old, I'd imagine he's yet another enthusiastic young know-it-all who is simply trying to garner some special attention, and maybe get to go on "The O'Reilly Factor" or something. I thought the same thing about that 19-yr-old idiot who said he was an "atheist," and who now was insisting that he be allowed to keep his position as a Boy Scout leader.

How many children have been assigned to read "The Autobiography of Malcolm X"? My son read it w/o being assigned it. Guess he realized that if one is too delicate to read something with a little bias or "offensiveness" in it, he is too delicate to learn a damn thing.

[AnAmericanMother]

Wow. The PC crowd never ceases to amaze me - in their feverish search for "hate speech" to stamp out, they miss the entire point and wind up trying to stamp out one of the most eloquent attacks on slavery and racial prejudice ever written.

When Twain was writing Huck Finn, the negative attitudes expressed by some of the characters in the book (not Twain himself) were far from dead, and Twain attacked them with gusto. Some are obviously flawed (Pap, the Duke and the Dolphin, the two feuding "aristocratic" families), some less so (Miz Watson and Tom Sawyer himself). The only characters that are good and true to the core are the despised Huck, scapegrace son of the town drunk, and his protector and friend Jim, the "non-person".

I think the objection to the use of the "n" word is just a stalking horse. Why would a bunch of river rats speaking what Twain called the "ordinary Pike County dialect" use anything but the common colloquial term of the day? Using something else destroys the authenticity of the language, which Twain took great pains over . . . read his introduction, in which he explains the different dialects used in the book.

The real problem the PC crowd has with this book is its absolute rejection of cant and hypocrisy, and the fact that the mighty (including those of a liberal turn of mind) are cast down from their seats and the humble and meek exalted.

My daughter's 8th grade class read Huck and her teacher (wisely IMNSHO) took on the PC attitude head-on. He had the kids research and write an essay taking one side or the other of the "read Huck or not" debate, explaining the reasons supporting their position. My daughter took the middle ground of "yes, read it, but discuss the issue of the language and what it meant in that day and time, and what Twain was trying to do." (There were two black kids in her class, BTW, they thought it was much ado about nothing and were good sports about the whole thing.)

[AnAmericanMother]

Hi Devlins. Long time no read.

Thus Mr. Clemens:

NOTICE

PERSONS attempting to find a motive in this narrative will be prosecuted; persons attempting to find a moral in it will be banished; persons attempting to find a plot in it will be shot.

BY ORDER OF THE AUTHOR,
Per G.G., Chief of Ordnance.

EXPLANATORY

IN this book a number of dialects are used, to wit: the Missouri negro dialect; the extremest form of the backwoods Southwestern dialect; the ordinary "Pike County" dialect; and four modified varieties of this last. The shadings have not been done in a haphazard fashion, or by guesswork; but painstakingly, and with the trustworthy guidance and support of personal familiarity with these several forms of speech.

I make this explanation for the reason that without it many readers would suppose that all these characters were trying to talk alike and not succeeding.

THE AUTHOR.

(Of course, Mr. Clemens was pulling everybody's leg, as per usual.)

[Glutton]

Censoring this classic would be evil. Being politically correct isn't correct for those who use their brains and common sense.

I am irritated this is happening up in stumptown.

[Devil_Anse]

Great to see you! I might have known I'd find the real scholars on this thread!

Speaking of "Huckleberry Finn," there is a passage in it that I've wondered about sometimes. I know that just about every word out of our dear Mark Twain's mouth was satirizing SOMETHING, but what was he satirizing in this passage? I'm referring to his description of the Grangerfords, the feuding family with whom Huck lived for a time (until most of them got killed off.) Huck describes the Grangerfords as not having a trace of red in their complexion. He makes a big point of this--that the Grangerfords are apparently brown-haired or black-haired people, with pale skin, "not a trace of red in it."

We know that Huck sometimes will miss a point and will very solemnly tell us things as truth, that we know are ridiculous. (Such as his pointers on how to keep bad luck away.) So I think Twain was satirizing some point of view or other, when he had Huck make so much of the fact that the Grangerfords had "not a trace of red" in their complexion. But WHAT point of view?

Have you seen that fairly recent edition which includes about 3 episodes that weren't in the original book? One of them has something to do with Jim and a corpse; I can't remember the other two, must go look that up.

[ChadGore]

WIN ONE FOR THE GIPPER

Vote on Tuesday.

Do the right thing.

[Devil_Anse]

"And did young Stephen sicken,
And did young Stephen die?
And did the sad hearts thicken,
And did the mourners cry?

No, such was not the fate of
Young Stephen Dowling Bots..."

Sigh. What a great loss the literary world sustained, when Emmeline Grangerford was cruelly struck down!

[Devil_Anse]

Cheer up, Rebel_Ace. You can always just read "Ulysses."

The beauty of this is, ol' Mac (oops, I mean, young Mac) is still in danger of being assigned "Ulysses." The rest of us "WWII-era" (Hey, I originated in the Eisenhower era! Watch it!) rocking-chair jockeys can rest assured that, having completed our educations, we are not in danger of being assigned "Ulysses!"

[xp38]

I think it was Hemingway who is quoted as saying American literature begins with Huckleberry Finn.

[PeaceBeWithYou]

. What we have here is an ignorant- contrarian-attention-seeker-type. If you ignore him he will go away.

[AnAmericanMother]

You are too kind! Always a pleasure to meet a scholar! (curtsy)

My "Annotated Huckleberry Finn" with the three new chapters in it is unfortunately at home, while I am at work (work is the curse of the reading class, I guess). It's the same sort of book as the "Annotated Alice" and the "Annotated Mother Goose", with the text on the inner half of each page and copious footnotes, illustrations, etc. on the outside half.

My educated guess would be that Huck, in awe of these "high toned" people, was anxious to make clear that there was no Indian blood in the Grangerfords -- because they certainly were behaving like savages.

Twain got away with an awful lot by putting it in Huck's mouth. The scene where he and Jim discover Pap's body (Huck not knowing it is Pap) makes it perfectly clear by details that he died in a house of prostitution. (My daughter thought that it must be a very "low" house to admit the likes of Pap, and I agreed that it probably was not a "petit maison" in St. John's Wood.)

[AnAmericanMother]

"O no. Then list with tearful eye,
Whilst I his fate do tell.
His soul did from this cold world fly
By falling down a well.

They got him out and emptied him;
Alas it was too late;
His spirit was gone for to sport aloft
In the realms of the good and great."

ooo! My eyes! My eyes!

[Devil_Anse]

The Death of Pap

They left him there to stiffen up,
His death they did not tell,
His spirit, if such he ever had,
Is burning now in hell!

Isn't it a shame that Emmeline wasn't around to eulogize Pap?

You're right about Pap's dying in the house of prostitution. Well, I had knowed that, but I had forgot it. (Actually, it never occurred to me--which surprises me, since I can usually see sleaze easily, even sometimes when it isn't there!) I guess I was thrown off by the fact that the man apparently had been playing cards before his death. Of course such a thing would have been a regular activity in a cat-house.

[MacDorcha]

you completely missed an earlier post... as was pointed out, Einstein himself had trouble doing things like finding his home, most fourth graders already know how to do that. obviously you can't compare or even attempt to be sarcastic about something you'll never know. oh, and by the way, a Freudian Psychologist would disect some of your statements and begin by stating things such as, "sarcasm and humor being at the very core of truth, it may be apparent that this person ACTUALLY is intimidated, but his own pig-headed arrogance blinds him to his own true feelings." and this would be said in refferendum towards "How stupid of me. Thank you ever so much for explaining to me that you are indeed a genius, operating on a plane far above my meager means to understand." but that's just what my teacher says. and yes, she's a republican psychology teacher. (no libby bs)again, i really don't care if you cant handle something other than the standard pattern. soem of us like being different. i'm still noting all you have done is attack my letters, not my actual logic.

[MacDorcha]

yes, i am young, but yes, i do remember "all i need to know..." heck, im a pink floyd fan, and actually know most of the words to alot of oldies. call me old fashioned. but hey, why mess with perfection? i agree perfectly, the world is going down the crapper, but that doesn't mean we have to go with it. do as devil_anse says his kid did, pick up a book!(especially one that schools wont allow, that probably means they allow free thinking...)

[B Knotts]

Reason #2390815 to get your kids out of publik skool.

[Hemingway's Ghost]

All American literature comes from Mark Twain.

[MacDorcha]

i'd read "Ulysses" two years before i had been assigned it. before they were assigned, i've also read: "1984", "Animal Farm", "The Illiad", "MacBeth", "BeoWulf", "Romeo and Juliet", "The Hobbit", and plenty that i've forgotten. i read for the fun of it. the whole WWII-era is fascinating, but i do tend to prefer the older, classical readings. thanks for assuming yet again. ::sigh:: i feel like i'm older than most of the people on here. didn't you guys get sick of being presumed idiots by others based purely on your youth? what on Earth makes ya'll think i like it?