Powell Says He Disagrees With Bush on University of Michigan Affirmative Action Case

tbo.com ^ | 1-19-02 | ap

[No Truce With Kings]

"If UM awards extra race points to affluent blacks that would be so unfair that I doubt even Powell could support it."

I heard the Powell interview on Face the Nation this morning. He did not specifically support the UM case, but rather the concept of affirmative action.

I think it is a stretch -- one the author of this article wants you to make, btw -- to say that support for affirmative action is equivalent to supporting the discrimination practiced by the University of Michigan. I think that this is a case of the press trying to get Bush and Powell to play a game of "Let's you and him fight."

[Mfkmmof4]

I think it says more that they can disagree and work together. We should support that especially with the likes of those who accuse Bush of being a racist and Powell as being a house slave. Think about it!

[LO_IQ]

The Strange Case of the Two Eduardos

Eduardo L. Estrada is a high schooler with olive skin and jet black hair. Eduardo comes from a household with $25,000 income in a mostly Latino neighborhood.

Eduardo L. applied to admission to University of Michigan, and he was given 20 extra points during the admission process solely for being of Latino descent.

Eduardo F. Estrada is a high schooler with olive skin and jet black hair. Eduardo comes from a household with $25,000 income in a mostly Asian neighborhood.

Eduardo F. applied to admission to University of Michigan, and he was given NO extra points during the admission process solely for being of Philipino descent.

University of Michigan affirmative action program does not consider Asian-Americans as an underrepresented minority; only African-Americans, Latinos, and Native Americans receive the extra 20 points solely because of their race or ethnicity.

You can make case about affirmative action for African-Americans, but can you make a persuasive case for discrimination against almost identical people solely on the basis of the country of origin?

[John Valentine]

I supported affirmative action when it was first implemented back in the Nineteen-sixties and I had the understanding at the time that such action was a temporary remedy to jump start a badly broken system.

I never expected that it would become a permanent fixture of our political landscape.

As you say, if the subtext of the message is that Black Americans will ALWAYS need a break then affirmative action becomes an insult to human pride- and it becomes counter-productive, since expectations for blacks will be lower and performance will always tend to match the expectation. I'm sure that this phenomenon can be seen up close and persoanal in many back families right now.

[fooman]

I have always wanted to play in the NFL. Should we give under represented races extra downs? Or maybe RB an automaatic +3 yards.

How about weights for over represented groups?

You know Kurt Vonnegant (sp) was right in Harrison Burgeon that handicaps such as these are absurd.

[Treeless Branch]

The left wants AA due to "diversity." Noone ever questions them however about why diversity is so important.

You know why? Because there is no reason. The left will say diversity brings differing viewpoints. My response: Why would I care what an ignorant (Sorry but that is true) student cares? The left: they have different beliefs than whites, these beliefs are inherently special. Response: that is ridiculous, those minority beliefs are majoirty beliefs in universities where 90% of faculties are liberals.

[Thebaddog]

I respect his opinion. the real question to me is whether his son should be eligible for affirmative action as his father certainly has been able to open doors for him that advanced his career. And he's certainly entitled to do it for his son.

[ExSoldier]

"Thanks to this idiot, we have the current crisis in Iraq.

Truer words were never spoken, my friend! I have a buddy who is a retired SpecOps senior officer and he said that Powell is universally DESPISED by both the officers and most of the troops who served under him.

The only reason he's a republican is because that was the party in power when he retired! He's a globalist propagator of the New World Order who absence from the world stage at least in the front row won't be missed.

[olliemb]

I disagree with you. I think difference of opinion is good-diversity in the cabinet with different opinions. President Bush certainly does not want yes men. It is nice to see that opinions do differ yet they can still be Republicans. Bush was talking about the points, not that race should not be a factor. He did say that he agreed with diversity but did not like the point system as the point system was unconstitutional favoring one race over another therefore creating a quota system just with points. Bush thought diversity could be accomplished thru interviews, one on ones, history of applicant and any shortcomings, etc. Bush has always called it affirmative access

[olliemb]

Zulu, totally disagree with your rantings.

[optimistically_conservative]

Does anyone know if the Univ. of Michigan admissions formula awards 20 points to black applicants regardless of their economic background?

Affirmative Action and The University of Michigan's Admissions Policy

2001 Guidelines for the Calculation of a Selection Index for all Schools and Colleges Except Engineering

Confidential

Socioeconomicallv Disadvantaged Student or Education

The University is committed to a rich educational experience for its students, which should include interaction with students of all socioeconomic backgrounds. A diverse, as opposed to a homogeneous. student population enhances the education experience for all students. Consequently. 20 points will be awarded to an applicant who:

is sociocconomically disadvantaged. with indicators such as parents’ occupations. single parent upbringing, a deceased parent, necessary excessive work hours while attending school. overcoming extraordinary obstacles, such as abuse, or homelessness; or

is a student educated in a high school serving a population that is predominantly sociocconomically disadvantaged.

Underrepresented Racial/Ethnic Minority Identity or Education

The University is committed to an educational experience that involves students interacting with other students of different races and ethnicities than their own. Consequently, 20 points will be awarded to an applicant who:

is a member of a federally recognized underrepresented race or ethnicity, which is also underrepresented on the UM Ann Arbor campus; or

is a student educated in a high school serving a population that is predominantly comprised of federally recognized underrepresented races and/or ethnicities, which are also underrepresented on the CM Ann Arbor campus.

Scholarship Athlete

In anticipation of their contributions to the University and in recognition of the tradition and national prominence of Michigan intercollegiate athletics, applicants being officially recruited and considered for athletic scholarships should have 20 points added to their score.

Provost’s Discretion

At the discretion of the Provost (only), up to an additional 20 points may be awarded to an applicant.

Professional Diversity

Over time, some professions have become composed predominantly of one gender or another. The School of Nursing has identified a need to enroll more members of an underrepresented gender to enhance its educational environment and to improve the diversity within its profession. A counselor should award 5 points to those applicants who are men applying to the School of Nursing. (See the Guidelines for Calculation of an Engineering Selection Index for the Professional Diversity points awarded for women applicants to the College of Engineering.)

[Taxman]

Time to find another SECSTATE!

[optimistically_conservative]

Screwed up the Michagan Review links above:

Affirmative Action and The University of Michigan's Admissions Policy

2001 Guidelines for the Calculation of a Selection Index for all Schools and Colleges Except Engineering

[mass55th]

"I have read some of Powell's position papers on leadership and he clearly is not an "afirmative action general..."

He might be in favor of affirmative action, but correct me if I'm wrong...isn't he against gays in the military?

[wingnuts'nbolts]

The article is right, Secretary Powell has always believed in affirmative action and at the 2000 convention he said so in a speech. So it is no surprise and he is entitled to think that way. So is Condi. They both are exemplary people. I do believe President Bush takes exception to the manner in which the University of Michigan has the program structured which becomes a quota system. Not necessarily the whole concept of afirmative action.

[Norman Arbuthnot]

Thanks for the info.

So, it seems that if you are a "member of a federally recognized underrepresented race or ethnicity, which is also underrepresented on the UM Ann Arbor campus" you get 20 points regardless of the fact that you may benefit from other advantages.

You could be the son of Michael Jordan or Tiger Woods, have attended private schools your entire life, scored 1500 on the SAT's and STILL have 20 points extra points awarded to you on basis of race alone. I don't know how anyone can defend that. Granted, there probably aren't very many students who fall into that catagory, but I think that example illustrates how flawed the U of M policy is.

[Brian Allen]

<< ..... [Powell] ... is terminally infected with the political military/pentagon CYA, be all things to all people disease. No one rises into the JCS [Regardless of pigmentation] without being a craven political manipulator. AMF. >>

The definative example of all that is wrong with quota hiring and quota promotions and an impeccable example of the Absolute Veracity of the Peter Principle, the big-headed bureaucratic hotshot, Powell is a Republican Party/Bush family house pet who will continue to soil the rug until he is put outside for good.

Mr Powell is a bad-news RINO liberal.

[optimistically_conservative]

The comparison the Michigan Review uses is the case below:

In 1960, realtors in Grosse Pointe, MI created a “point system” to rate potential home buyers. Potential buyers were ranked by their race, nationality, occupation, and “degree of swarthiness.” Any non-Northern Europeans required a higher rating to move into the community. Once publicly reveled, the system was an outrage to whites and blacks alike. Only 4 years later, it became one of the examples used to justify the Civil Rights Act of 1964, which among other things stated in Title VII:

“§2000d - No person in the United States shall, on the ground of race, color, or national origin, be excluded from participation in, be denied the benefits of, or be subjected to discrimination under any program or activity receiving Federal financial assistance.”

The Grosse Pointe system was abolished and the Civil Rights Act was passed. Yet despite these gains in equality, the University of Michigan still has its own “point system” for prospective college students. Ever since ridding itself of its strict racial quotas, the University of Michigan has simulated quotas to the best of their ability by awarding certain minority applicants 20 of the necessary 100 points on account of their race. Better put, members of "underrepresented" minority heritages and skin colors applying to the University need only 80 points to be accepted, while everyone else is required to have over 100.

[Pukka Puck]

But she also said race can be a factor in colleges' selection process. The brief the Bush administration filed with the Supreme Court was silent on that issue of whether race can be a factor under some circumstances.

"It is important to take race into consideration if you must, if race-neutral means do not work," she said.

"I think there's nothing wrong with that in the United States," Rice said. "It does not mean that one has to go to people of lower quality. Race is a factor in our society."

Rice contradicts herself. If race-neutral means do not manage to obtain the necessary quota, then she thinks it is acceptable to consider race in order to meet the quota. It is obvious that this most definitely does mean going to people of lower quality. If black or Hispanic people were available of equal ability and skills to those of other races, then race-neutral means would obtain them in equitable numbers.

My once very high respect for Rice just plummeted. Obviously the principle of equality under the law is not as important to her as perpetuating the racial spoils system.