Posted on 07/23/2003 10:03:09 AM PDT by justshutupandtakeit
I don't know if he went into a yankee death camp...er...POW camp, but I do know off the top of my head that a black sailor was among the crew that surrendered into yankee custody from the CSS Shenandoah in late 1865.
Got any evidence of that? Didn't think so.
That is about as wacko a picture of Southern Society as it would be possible to construct. In fact is sounds--in the first part--like something out of one of the ranting pamphlets of the Abolitionists. The facts are quite different, however. If a Southern Plantation owner were to have treated one of his servants in the manner of a Nazi, Stalinist or Maoist regime, he could have been criminally prosecuted.
As for your suggestion that it was O.K. to randomly grab someone, and chain them up? Please share with the rest of us, that law. Or am I misunderstanding what you are saying?
William Flax Return Of The Gods Web Site
Had you known that off the top of your head then I'm surprised that you didn't also know that the Shenandoah didn't surrender to anyone. Captain Waddell took her to England, arriving in Liverpool on November 6, 1865 where he turned the ship over to British authorities. The crew was paroled by the British government and were never in U.S. custody at any time.
That is why every Socialist regime has embraced some form of egalitarian insanity. Why they have murdered members of the old leadership, confiscated private property, or so restricted the uses of the private property of the old elite, as to make it little different than public property.
Socialism is the politics of the collective, the whole--a movement that spouts nonsense about the equality of human potential; that scape-goats successful elements, on which to blame the woes of others in the mob being recruited for the collectivist purpose. There is nothing remotely conservative about any of that.
That you could offer such a looney tunes theory, but confirms that you are playing word games, but in reality have embraced the values of the advocates of mob rule. Transfer the staging of the Nuremberg Party Congresses to one of the States, have the Fuehrer talk like Thaddeus Stevens, substitute Southern patricians for Jews as the targetted scape-goat, and you would be cheering your head off with all the other "patriots."
You would also find a reason, I am sure, to assure us that you and your fellow Nazis were Conservatives, or Progressives, or Liberals, or Idealists, or just whatever seemed appropriate at the moment in time.
William Flax Return Of The Gods Web Site
The Shenandoah wasn't a confederate privateer (a vessle in possession of a letter of marque from the CSA). It was a military cruiser paid for and commissioned into service by the Confederacy under the authority Stephen Mallory, confederate Secretary of the Navy. and that one black guy could have been a Jamaican or African.
Unlikely. The black sailor was named Edward Weeks, an indisputably anglo-saxon name. What little is known about him indicates that he was originally either a slave or servant of a fairly well to do family headed by George Canning, who was London born, and his wife, who was a North Carolinian. Later in life he was employed by Canning, who became a close friend and who died from an earlier civil war wound in Weeks' arms. Canning was a confederate when he signed on with the Shenandoah and is believed to have served at Shiloh. Weeks, who was significantly older than Canning, signed onto the crew at the same time and with equal pay at the insistence of Canning.
Again, show me, among the tens of thousands of rebel soldiers caputured, one black man.
Just did.
I pointed this out as well, to people like Grand_Old_Partisan - how much they sound like Julian Bond and tha NAACP.
" Captain Waddell, the commander of the Shenandoah, states that the last vessel he spoke to was the Barracouta, of Liverpool, bound for San Francisco. He met this vessel at sea on 3rd of August, and leamed from the captain that the cause of the South was irretnevably lost. Captain Waddell, on hearing this news, expressed his intention to proceed to England, and arrived off this port yesterday morning. He then took a pilot on board, and, fmding the intelligence he had received from the captain of the Barracouta as to the subjugation of the South undoubted, he desired the pilot to take his ship alongside one of her Majesty's vessels of war, if there were any in port. The Shenandoah was taken up the river at high water, and, according to the instruction given to the pilot, she was moored alongside the Donegal. A crew from that vessel was placed on board her, and the customs authorities having been communicated with, some officers belonging to that department were also placed in charge. Soon after the surrender of the vessel, Captain Waddell and several of his officers and crew went on shore." - Liverpool Mercury, Nov 7th, 1865
"I have, therefore, sought this port as a suitable one "to learn the news," and, if I am without a Government, to surrender the ship, with her battery, small arms, stores, tackle, and apparel complete to Her Majesty’s Government, for such disposition as in its wisdom should be deemed proper." - Capt. Waddell of the Shenandoah surrendering his ship to Earl Russell, Nov. 5, 1865
Sounds like a surrender to me.
Captain Waddell took her to England, arriving in Liverpool on November 6, 1865 where he turned the ship over to British authorities.
"[A]bout 6 o`clock last night a telegram was received from Government by Captain Paynter, of her Majesty’s ship Donegal, to whom the Shenandoah was surrendered" - Liverpool Mercury, Nov 9th, 1865
Sounds as if he surrendered to to one of their naval vessles.
The crew was paroled by the British government and were never in U.S. custody at any time.
It appears that they were paroled onto shore in Liverpool, though I cannot find what happened to any of them upon return to America. Waddell did intend that his surrender to the British would result in the ship's placement into United States custody:
"I think that as all the property of the Confederate Government has reverted, by the fortune of war, to the Government of the United States of North America, therefore this vessel, inasmuch as it was the property of the Confederate States, should accompany other property already reverted." - Waddell's surrender letter to Russell, Nov. 5, 1865
The southern US was in a war of succession, not insurgence - a fact that you willfully ignore. Wonder why that traiter Lee appears on postage stamps. Face it, you are blowing smoke out of your ass again. What happened to your Democrat buddy Wlat? did he get banned again?
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