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If you don't have your own birth certificate directly from the state of Hawaii, how will you know its genuine and not photoshoped

No, everyone needs his own copy ordered directly from the state of Hawaii so he can have it authenticated by an expert of his choosing.

Really?

How old was the baby? Where did she go?

The opinions and experience recorded in the links I provided were not mine, and were delivered by professionals with the exception of the moms, of course.

In 1970, the average length of stay for all hospital deliveries was 4.1 days in the United States!

That's like 9 years after 1961, or are you suggesting that there were no changes between 1961 and 1970.

I'm sorry that having your child was such a traumatic experience for you. In most cases, it's not.

Having a first baby for most women I have known (are you a man?), and me too, is a big, life changing experience. Along with the physical changes, not to mention discomfort, and hormonal adjustments comes a new tiny person to care for and a host of questions and concerns. That doesn't make it traumatic, it makes it big and new and exhausting - the kind of thing women like to have their mothers around for to ask questions of and get support.

I was born long before the 1960's and my mother never spent more than four days in the hospital for any of her many children!

I'm sure you're telling the truth. That doesn't mean your mother would have been willing or able to get on a plane a short time after giving birth to her first child for a trip half way around the world.

The point to noting hospital stays in the '60s is to point out that there is a bit more to the birth of a first child than birthers seem to think.

Really!

Women stayed in 14 days when I started my own family and then it came down to 10 and now after a normal delivery, if it's in the morning, the woman will go home in the evening.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/6187220.stm

When I trained (in the 1960s)nearly all the mothers stayed in for 10 days.

http://midwifemuse.wordpress.com/2009/04/07/early-days-breastfeeding/

Both of my sources are from the UK and are, I'm guessing, more relevant to practices in a British colony than statistics gathered in Brazil. (It looks like a Brazilian source - you haven't provided a link)

The second cite is an interesting read if you want to get a feel for why I think it is highly improbable that Ann grabbed her newborn, and hopped on a plane for the long flight back to Hawaii shortly after giving birth.

Og gosh; my head hurts!

Hawaii changed the age of consent in 2001 from 14 to 16.

If Obama's mom and Barak Sr. were married when he was born, then Barak Sr would be named on the birth certificate as "father" without regard to whether or not he was the actual sperm donor - so no reason there to hide the BC.

If keeping the family from ridicule were a motive, then Ann's family could have used the middle class solution of the time - sent Ann off to "school", or to "visit relatives", and placed the baby in an orphanage after its birth. No one need ever be the wiser. After all, according to your scenario, they were ashamed and didn't really care about him.

Have you?

No.

I have been pregnant however, and do remember late pregnancy was uncomfortable and awkward. The idea of sitting in one of those seats on a plane for hour after hour, not to mention the necessary frequent trips to the back of the plane to pee is enough to make me seriously doubt the Kenyan birth scenario.

The story putting her back on a plane to make the long flight returning to Hawaii within days of Obama's birth is to stretch credulity to the breaking point. If physical discomfort and inconvenience of such a trip weren't argument enough against it, then consider this, women in 1961 were kept in the hospital from one to two weeks following delivery. Birthers have Obama's mom giving birth in Kenya and returning to Hawaii in less than the normal hospital stay of eleven days (longer for a first-time mom) in 1961.

The story is just not credible on so many levels - this just scratches the surface.

Have you ever been a pregnant teenager? Been on a long flight late in pregnancy?

Obama senior had a wife and child in Kenya, do you suppose he wanted to take his new pregnant wife to meet his old wife and child?

The story is far fetched.

How’s the research coming?

There seems to be pretty wide spread agreement that Sun Yat-sen got a Certificate of Hawaiian Birth in 1904 as you will discover.

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2471/3770741121_692890423e_o.jpg

Some interesting reading from a site that seems to have no interest in Obama or his birth certificate.

http://www.asianamericanmedia.org/separatelivesbrokendreams/sunintro2.html

Yes, I remember him too. He was a great admirer of Hitler.

If a COLB was obtained for Sun Yat-sen, in that case what difference would it make if it was him or General Chiang Kai-shek vis-a-vis this issue; to wit, just like SatinDoll said "Many people born in Asia have or had COLBs."

What Sun Yat-sen had was a "Certificate of Hawaiian Birth", acquired in 1904, 38 years after his birth, not a COLB (Certificate of Live Birth). Certificates of Hawaiian Birth are no longer issued.

A CoLB is only issued when the baby's Hawaiian birth is recorded within the first year of life, Obama's birth was recorded 4 days after the fact.

Had Obama been born outside the US, he would have gotten a Certificate of Foreign Birth. So, SatinDoll says Chiang Kai-shek had a COLB issued by the state of Hawaii, only it was Sun Yat-sen and he was issued was a Certificate of Hawaiian Birth. How many facts does one have to get wrong before you think it makes a difference?

"Law of nations" as it appears in the US Constitution

To define and punish piracies and felonies committed on the high seas, and offences against the law of nations

Are you suggesting Obama is a pirate?

Yes, I know the phrase “Law of Nations” appears in the Constitution. I don’t however know what you’re talking about.

Are you talking about the Law of Nations written by a Swiss philosopher?

We’ve seen this happen before. Doesn’t take long before the engagement is over and another conspiracy is born.

We know that she did see him again.

Abortions most certainly were available in pre-Roe days - just not legal in the US. Mexico was a popular destination for abortions at the time.

Usually an unmarried pregnant girl was sent away to "visit relatives", the baby put up for adoption, and the girl returned home with no one the wiser - everything was very secret.

Last, but not least was the shotgun wedding.

That's an advantage in being over the hill - you know how things were in the olden days.

I didn't say it was.

That isn't true, was shown to be false long ago, and I'm surprised you still believe it.

Being born in Hawaii the requisite number of years ago gave Obama the right to run for the office of president. Winning the election gave him the right to be president.