Free Republic

It pains me to disagree, but I think the giant is dead.

Most “cunning” is more like it

If McCain is the nominee I can only assume the Republican Party no longer represents concervative views and I will renounce my membership register as an Independant.

I don’t know who I will vote for, but I cannot bring myself to vote for McCain.

How do mormons choose their new leader? See post #114. There's a link to the official explanation from the LDS Church.

At the moment, no. But I’ll excercise my First Ammendment rights anyway, so long as I have a forum.

I'm fully aware of the Adam-God theory. What Brigham Young preached on Adam-God, even if it were official doctrine (more on that later) is a far cry from claiming the LDS Church teaches Adam or God had sexual relations with Mary. That is just a bald faced lie and is a favorite piece of anti-Mormon propaganda intended to misrepresent Mormon teachings.

As for the Adam-God theory as taught by Brigham Young, much has been written about the comments. In short, it is not, nor has it ever been official, or unofficial LDS doctrine.

The Church has always had an official canon. During Brigham's Young's lifetime it was the Bible, Book of Mormon, and Doctrine and Covenants. President Young never attempted to incorporate any statement of the Adam-God theory into this canon. It is certain that none of Brigham Young's successors ever considered the Adam-God theory to be an official or unofficial doctrine of the Church. It was never presented in priesthood councils for ratification by Brigham Young or anyone else, nor did Brigham Young declare that it was a direct revelation from God. There is also no evidence that general authorities of the Church ever supported actions taken against anyone who disbelieved the Adam-God theory.

During the last decade of the 19th Century, interest in the subject elicited response from such authorities as Wilford Woodruff, George Q. Cannon and Joseph F. Smith. These men acknowledged that they were personally familiar with President Young's theory but discouraged teaching and speculating upon the subject. The status of the "Adam-God theory" was summed up in 1897 in a private letter outlined by President Wilford Woodruff and written by Apostle Joseph F. Smith:

President Young no doubt expressed his personal opinion or views upon the subject. What he said was not given as revelation or commandment from the Lord. The doctrine was never submitted to the councils of the Priesthood nor to the Church for approval or ratification, and was never formally or otherwise accepted by the Church. It is therefore in no sense binding upon the Church. Brigham Young's "bare mention" was without indubitable evidence and authority being given of its truth. Only the scripture, the accepted word of God," is the Church's standard. (Letter to A. Saxey, January 7, 1897, LDS Archives).

During the first quarter of this century, there arose a new generation of Church authorities who had not participated with Brigham Young in the councils of the Church and were therefore not personally familiar with his views. Among these, such men as B. H. Roberts, Charles W. Penrose and Anthon H. Lund began advocating the idea that Brigham Young had been misinterpreted. This has been the position taken by most leaders in this century. However, from the fruits of his research, in the 1980s Elder Bruce R. McConkie acknowledged the existence of Brigham Young's views on Adam, although he did not accept them.

Furthermore modern-day prophets have declared that the Adam-God theory is false. In 1976 President Spencer W. Kimball stated the following:

We wam you against the dissemination of doctrines which are not according to the scriptures and which are alleged to have been taught by some of the General Authorities of past generations. Such for instance is the Adam-God theory. We denounce that theory and hope that everyone will be cautioned against this and other kinds of false doctrine (Church News, Oct. 9, 1976).

So it appears that Brigham Young was wrong about this particular subject.

What is that? A prophet of God is wrong? Can that be? Yes, it can. That only poses a problem for those who believe prophets to be completely infallible. Without going into detail, The Bible has many examples that bear out this fact.

Now, back to your statement that the Church believes God had sexual relations with Mary. That is one of the most rediculous anti-mormon claims I have ever heard. It would be laughable excect that I find it personally offensive.

For a good discussion on the official teachings of the church, go here...

http://www.lightplanet.com/mormons/response/qa/virgin_mary.htm

If my memory serves me well I’ve been in that very canyon several times. It was so many years ago I can’t be sure of name, but it sounds very familiar.

You make an excellent point. I once heard a statistic that over 70% of people who get married, stay married to their first spouse. It's the repeat offenders that drive up the divorce rate to 1 in 2.

I’m for strengthening families, but given that the 1 in 2 is a joke, considering how many have multiple multiple marriages. Most people I know who have divorced once, wind up divorced many times, regardless of the reasons for their initial divorce.

I thought the same thing. There’s more to that history than meets the eye.

I’ve been to Skutumpah a number of times. The area is quite scenic no doubt, as is the entire region, but I don’t think it rivals Bryce, Cedar Breaks or Marble Canyon in scenic beauty. There are however, some nice slot canyons there that are easily accessible.

The implication that hundreds of people would have died anyway in the comfort of their homes is just rediculous. Your bias is obvious.

Why are you attributing all the deaths that happened over a span of many years to the Illinois mob when in actuality many of those deaths would have occured even in the warmth and comfort of Mormon homes in Nauvoo. Mormon propaganda?

Did someone say Manfred Mann?

Okay, point it out. Please site the chapter and verse of the LDS documents that teaches "Adam was God and had sexual relations with the virgin Mary"?

Thanks

You said...

This opens up a whole can of worms for Mormons. The nurse quotes Brigham Young, a "prophet" according to the LDS Church. Simple enough, right? Nope. Point out to a Mormon that Brigham Young taught that Adam was God and had sexual relations with the virgin Mary to conceive the Christ child, and they will say "no way did he say that". Show them chapter and verse from LDS documents and they will say "he wasn't speaking as a prophet". Show them that he said "thus saith the Lord" and was indeed speaking as a prophet, they will say "well, that teaching was never cannonized".

I think one day we all will be surprised to learn how literal the Bible is. I believe God created man in his own image. To believe humans evolved from lesser beings is to believe humans are not the children of God.

"For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring." Acts 17:28

My small bit of revenge is to mail back those empty self-addressed envelopes.

Mailing the postage paid envelopes back to the credit card company doesn't hurt them at all. As the article states, they simply pass the cost on to consumers as higher fees. If you use credit cards you're only hurting yourself. If you don't use credit cards, you're hurting those that do.

Just a question, where in the Bible did God or Christ ever put the doctrines of the gospel up for a vote?

So, according to that line of thought, unless I've used drugs, I'm not qualified to form an opinion that they're bad?

Polygamy: Mitt Romney said he hates it.
Guess he's tried it then, to have such an opinion about it?
It's an ignorant person who dislikes that about which he knows nothing.

Well, The GOP leaderhsip has turned their backs on conservatives, so why not?

I wish people who obviously know little about LDS doctrine would stop pretending to be experts on the subject.

1. LDS doctrine teaches ALL will be resurrected.

2. LDS doctrine teaches that the level of exaltation one achieves depends on their own personal worthiness, not because of the actions or choices of someone else, including their spouse.

The election is still over a year and a half away. Anything can happen between now and then. The story is far from over.