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[Luther] wrote in 1525 to Erasmus of Rotterdam, with whom he had been debating the Sovereignty of God's grace (in election and salvation) and the freedom of man's will:

"I give you hearty praise and commendation on this further account - that you alone, in contrast with all others, have attacked the real thing, that is, the essential issue. ... you, and you alone, have seen _____THE HINGE ON WHICH ALL TURNS____, and aimed for the vital spot.

1 posted on 06/14/2002 7:52:48 AM PDT by Matchett-PI
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To: OrthodoxPresbyterian; Jerry_M; CCWoody; the_doc; theAmbassador;JeanChauvin;drstevej; RnMomof7...
Bump to those interested!
2 posted on 06/14/2002 7:58:40 AM PDT by Matchett-PI
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To: Matchett-PI;RnMomof7;CCWoody;Wrigley;Jerry_M;DittoJed2;OrthodoxPresbyterian;rwfromkansas;rdb3...
Luther understood...the principle is indeed "double or nothing." Either God is sovereign over all things which comes to pass, or He is not sovereign at all.

Amen. "Mistress Reason" is a trap we all fall prey to. But God is God, and His reason is all that matters.

Something very clearly happened in Lutheran doctrine between 1546 and 1580.

Yep. It's the same thing that happened, little by little, to all the Protestant denominations, culminating in groups like the World Council of Churches, which have purposely diluted the truth of God's sovereignty in order that men might rule over other men and God, Himself.

Luther and every Calvinist would agree on at least one point: God's counsels nor purposes are never arbitrary.

TO CORIN AND ALL ARMINIANS: Please note the use of the phrase "God's counsels." It is a phrase used often to describe God's aid or intent; it is not "councils," as pertaining to a group of men, i.e. World Council of Churches.

TO ALL: A personal note this morning, tagged onto this appropriate thread. I'd like to thank you all for the commraderie, devotion and vast knowledge that have been offered on these religious posts. I've struggled with an important work project for months. I've worried and prayed; prayed and worried.

But first thing every morning I'd log onto Free Republic and be reminded of the comfort of God's grace.

As I've argued the side of God's authority in all things, I have become stronger in my faith. As I've told some of the Arminians, it's a sublime assurance, knowing that God is in charge of my destiny, and if it is His will, it will be my will. And I wish this comfort for them, as well.

So this morning, when I received the news I've been working and praying for, I wanted to share my happiness with you all. I'm sorry for the lack of details. But for now please know I thank you all for your good companionship, and for your devotion to Christ's eternal blessings.

Thank you, God, for my undeserved joy.

5 posted on 06/14/2002 9:37:02 AM PDT by Dr. Eckleburg
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To: Matchett-PI
OUTSTANDING!! I'm keeping a copy of this for further study, but the initial readthrough was great!

May discussion of this remain civil and peaceful. God bless.

6 posted on 06/14/2002 9:50:18 AM PDT by Frumanchu
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To: Matchett-PI
This is simply beautiful.
10 posted on 06/14/2002 10:57:37 AM PDT by rdb3
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To: Matchett-PI
Therefore, when God had before him the entire human race, he viewed mankind as fallen....The implications of this are such that God had no need to create the reprobate with fresh evil in them, as if it were possible for Him to be the author of evil, but rather, His decree of reprobation was passive. God simply "passed over" the reprobate in the exercise of His saving mercy.

Testing my very limited knowledge of Calvinist arcana, does this quote mean that (according to the author) Luther was an "infralapsarian"?

Secondly, I've always wondered (well, not 'always' technically) if infralapsarians believe that the single or double decree (whichever) took place after the fall in Eden in time/space history or before? That is, did Adam have a free will or not? Just curious how the 'lapsarians' of various stripes handle Adam.

11 posted on 06/14/2002 1:39:53 PM PDT by winstonchurchill
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To: Matchett-PI
I've only skimmed over the article, but it looks like a good one. Pretty busy right now as most of my summers are, hope to get back to it in the future and read it in my detail.
22 posted on 06/15/2002 3:10:38 AM PDT by ReformedBeckite
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To: Matchett-PI
The Reformation was more than a simple rebellion against teachings of the Roman Catholic Church; it was truly a rediscovery of biblical doctrines that had gradually been lost due to mishandling and negligent teaching.

Wow: an actual admission that Biblical doctrines were, over time, gradually lost.

Score one for Joseph Smith and the Restored Gospel.

The health of the church today requires re-thinking on the issue of God's sovereignty. With semi-Pelagianism and Arminianism the norm rather than the exception in the modern church, the tough issues must once again be grappled with. There must be another reformation.

A reformation can never restore that which has been lost. What is truly needed is a restoration. And only God can bring about a restoration.

Perhaps this should start with a "rediscovery" of the doctrines of times long past.

More confirmation that important doctrines have been lost. Such blatant honesty is truly surprising. I guess he wasn't expecting any LDS readers.

Perhaps there must be a revival of reading ancient documents and treatises to discover the secrets long obscured.

That's a curious request, given how the author ends this essay: how does a revival of the reading of ancient documents and treatises square with the "sola scriptura" viewpoint? The author would appear to be appealing to extra-Biblical documents here.

The church must see its place in history through the light of the past. The author, however, does not speak now of that ancient light of St. Augustine, now dimmed and wearied with age. God continues to raise up new lights for the continual reformation of His church. The light now shining is not Augustine, but Martin Luther himself.

Is the author now claiming that the Christian world would be better off if Augustine hadn't muddied the waters?

Sola Fide, Sola Gratia, Sola Scriptura, Soli Deo Gloria

But don't forget about searching those ancient manuscripts: it could be a real help.

57 posted on 06/18/2002 12:41:29 AM PDT by CubicleGuy
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