Dinosaur Shocker (YEC say dinosaur soft tissue couldn’t possibly survive millions of years)

Smithsonian Magazine ^ | May 1, 2006 | Helen Fields

[ahayes]

Sorry, my letter's post #63. This thread is growing faster than I thought!

[Elsie]

Oh look, an anti-evolutionist who didn't bother to read the article ...

OH?

Do you KNOW this by distance-viewing?

[Elsie]

And most people believe that God created evolution.

 

Why?  The God that most Americans 'believe' in, is like THIS:

 

 

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Isa 48:3 ... I have declared the former things from the beginning; and they went forth out of My mouth, and I shewed them; I did [them] SUDDENLY, and they came to pass.

 

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Indeed!!

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Genesis 1

 

 1.  In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
 2.  Now the earth was  formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters.
 3.  And God said, "Let there be light," and there was light.

 

 

This is a GOD who creates by speaking; but; how LONG did it take?

 

Now Jesus was a man who had God-like powers.  Was HE God?   The Book says so.......

 

 

 

 

NIV Colossians 1:13-17
 13.  For he has rescued us from the dominion of darkness and brought us into the kingdom of the Son he loves,
 14.  in whom we have redemption,  the forgiveness of sins.

 15.  He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation.
 16.  For by him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things were created by him and for him.
 17.  He is before all things, and in him all things hold together.

 

 

NIV Revelation 4:11
 11.  "You are worthy, our Lord and God, to receive glory and honor and power, for you created all things, and by your will they were created and have their being."

 

 

NIV Revelation 10:6
 6.  And he swore by him who lives for ever and ever, who created the heavens and all that is in them, the earth and all that is in it, and the sea and all that is in it, and said, "There will be no more delay!

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Notice that when this man speaks, things happen RIGHT NOW!   Not after some times passes and the body heals itself.

 

 

 

NIV Matthew 8:2-3

 2.  A man with leprosy  came and knelt before him and said, "Lord, if you are willing, you can make me clean."
 3.  Jesus reached out his hand and touched the man. "I am willing," he said. "Be clean!" Immediately he was cured  of his leprosy.

 

 

NIV Matthew 21:19
   Seeing a fig tree by the road, he went up to it but found nothing on it except leaves. Then he said to it, "May you never bear fruit again!" Immediately the tree withered.

 

 

NIV Mark 1:41-42
 41.  Filled with compassion, Jesus reached out his hand and touched the man. "I am willing," he said. "Be clean!"
 42.  Immediately the leprosy left him and he was cured.

 

 

NIV Mark 5:41-42

 41.  He took her by the hand and said to her, "Talitha koum!" (which means, "Little girl, I say to you, get up!").
 42.  Immediately the girl stood up and walked around (she was twelve years old). At this they were completely astonished.

 

 

NIV Mark 10:51-52

 51.  "What do you want me to do for you?" Jesus asked him.   The blind man said, "Rabbi, I want to see."
 52.  "Go," said Jesus, "your faith has healed you." Immediately he received his sight and followed Jesus along the road.

 

 

NIV Luke 5:13

  Jesus reached out his hand and touched the man. "I am willing," he said. "Be clean!" And Immediately the leprosy left him.

 

 

NIV Luke 5:24-25

 24.  But that you may know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins. . . ." He said to the paralyzed man, "I tell you, get up, take your mat and go home."
 25.  Immediately he stood up in front of them, took what he had been lying on and went home praising God.

 

 

NIV Luke 8:44

  She came up behind him and touched the edge of his cloak, and Immediately her bleeding stopped.

 

 

NIV Luke 13:12-13

 12.  When Jesus saw her, he called her forward and said to her, "Woman, you are set free from your infirmity."
 13.  Then he put his hands on her, and Immediately she straightened up and praised God.

 

 

NIV Luke 18:42-43

 42.  Jesus said to him, "Receive your sight; your faith has healed you."
 43.  Immediately he received his sight and followed Jesus, praising God. When all the people saw it, they also praised God.

 

 

NIV Acts 9:33-35

 33.  There he found a man named Aeneas, a paralytic who had been bedridden for eight years.
 34.  "Aeneas," Peter said to him, "Jesus Christ heals you. Get up and take care of your mat." Immediately Aeneas got up.
 35.  All those who lived in Lydda and Sharon saw him and turned to the Lord.

 

 

NIV Matthew 8:13
 13.  Then Jesus said to the centurion, "Go! It will be done just as you believed it would." And his servant was healed at that very hour.

 

 

NIV Matthew 15:28
 28.  Then Jesus answered, "Woman, you have great faith! Your request is granted." And her daughter was healed from that very hour.

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Now if this same personage, who does things in an instant;  how LONG would it take Him to CREATE all that we find around us???

[2nsdammit]

Of course you will. You wouldn't want to allow any thoughts into your head that may make you doubt your folk tale...

I could probably find a "scientist" that will claim the world is flat, too. That doesn't make it right....

[GourmetDan]

"Now you know what... if a scientist actually proposed a theory that was different from Evolution but explained what we see in the fossil record and what we see today that is perfectly fine."

The fossil 'record' is an 'interpretation of evidence', not evidence itself. Do you not know the difference?,/p>

There are so many out-of-order fossils that 'reworking' has to be regularly invoked to explain them. Apparently, fossil can be 'reworked' either up or down!

http://dml.cmnh.org/2001Oct/msg00394.html

That and 'overthrusting' to explain pre-Cambrian limestones on top of Cretaceous shale.

http://www.pathlights.com/ce_encyclopedia/12fos10.htm#Lewis%20Overthrust

Now how's that for explaining anomalous evidence? Just make it say whatever you want it to!

The 'fossil record' is so mixed up that various theories have to be invoked to 'fix' it where it doesn't agree with the TOE.

[From many - one.]

"...Now if this same personage, who does things in an instant;  how LONG would it take Him to CREATE all that we find around us???"

An instant. Doesn't match Genesis. What's your point?

[GourmetDan]

I see you're spreading the same old misrepresentations about Setterfield's work that have been around since the beginning.

Go here to see all of these objections answered. Nothing gets 'fried' except some misconceptions about cdk.

http://host380.ipowerweb.com/~setterfi/discussionindex.htm

[BrandtMichaels]

"Isn't it amazing how it appears that all cultures developed codes of law without the assistance of the Bible?"
Why yes, things like this had previously amazed me as too until I understood mankinds' need for revisiing history.

Here's another poser - how did language originate? Did it start with 1 language or many? Possibly you've heard that Hebrew is/was the most highly-evolved of all known languages? Science used to laugh at the Biblical idea that man is composed of dust until recently.

Also which is more amazing - the dates on your research items or the dates ascribed to evolution? Just as we do today, mankind has always done, leave behind some trace of their existence. So please show me anything mankind recorded that is over 10,000 years old. I won't consider anything using dating theories that contain assumptions (i.e. cave painting on a '65 million year old rock').

[Right Wing Professor]

Some of the tougher biopolymers (especially chitin, lignins and proteins) may degrade very slowly in a fossil. Some arthropod fossils from 25 million years ago contain a small amount of chitin (3), although insects preserved in amber from about the same time period show complete diagenetic alteration (fossilization) in spite of the superb morphological preservation (4). Likewise, in spite of the excellent morphological preservation of this fossil Dr. Schweitzer clearly states that it is unknown at this time whether the actual original cellular and organic material is present. The preservation of intact organic material from a long-extinct species would be a wonderful scientific find, however it is most likely that Dr. Schweitzer and other molecular paleontologists will have to settle for studying the typical biomolecule degradation products found in fossils (5). It may actually be that some fraction of organic matter was preserved, and the supplemental material Dr. Schweitzer published indicates that this may be true as the sample extracts showed some affinity for antibodies against bovine osteocalcin and chicken type I collagen. This leads to the exciting possibility of extracting collagen or other structural proteins from the T. rex sample and comparing these to avian proteins to help clarify the evolutionary relationship between birds and theropod dinosaurs. However, it is unfortunately more likely that the sample will prove to be fully mineralized and lacking any utilizable amount of untransformed biomolecules. If this is so AIG will have egg in its face after its trumpeting of the T. rex sample as "unfossilized soft tissue" ("Still Soft and Stretchy," 25 March 2005).

I wonder has she done MALDI-mass-spec on some of the material, yet. That would be a pretty good indication of the state of the organic material.

[Elsie]

Ahh.. I can see that you did. Have you gotten a response from them?

[PatrickHenry]

“They twist your words and they manipulate your data.”

I'm shocked. Shocked!!

[R_Kangel]

Is there any way we can clone these cells to reproduce the animal?

I for one would like to see a park dedicated to cloned species of such animals.

[ahayes]

Nope. :-( It's been 6 weeks and they're ignoring me. Dave says they might reply in a month or so.

[js1138]

Searching for the ‘magic bullet’
Why do creation-defenders often seem to be too quick to jump onto the latest ‘evidences’?
by Ken Ham

In 1986 a number of leading creationist researchers decided that the evidence of supposedly human and dinosaur footprints, found together at the Paluxy River in Texas, had serious problems. They decided that, pending further research to establish the correct interpretation of the prints, they could no longer be safely used as evidence supporting the fact (based on the biblical account of creation) that man and dinosaur lived at the same time.

http://www.answersingenesis.org/creation/v25/i2/bullet.asp

[aruanan]

invoking the hand of God to explain natural phenomena breaks the rules of science.

Ha ha ha.

After all, she says, what God asks is faith, not evidence. “If you have all this evidence and proof positive that God exists, you don’t need faith. I think he kind of designed it so that we’d never be able to prove his existence. And I think that’s really cool.”

A thoroughly modern Millie, even to, unbeknownst to her, her modern definition of faith. An example of what happens when religion and philosophy are no longer seriously studied.

[P8riot]

By Helen Fields

I honestly thought it said "by Helen Thomas", and that this was from The Onion.

[GourmetDan]

Actually, I corresponded w/ Mr. Chadwick on this issue a coupld of years ago and he confirmed that you must *assume* the history of a rock in order to 'interpret' the pollen correctly.

Not knowing the history and guessing makes 'pollen dating' as irrelevant as any other dating method.

That's what the 'scientists' won't tell you.

[Tokra]

What she looked at was only a few thousand years old, but if you worship EvolutionCreationism, you can't MUST believe it.

The creationists are just as dogmatic (actually MORE dogmatic) than the "evolutionists" they accuse of being dogmatic. (say that 3 times very fast.)

[GourmetDan]

“They twist your words and they manipulate your data.”

I'm shocked. Shocked!!

What exactly was the misrepresentation?