Posted on 06/25/2008 7:24:15 AM PDT by svcw
Just a thought.
It occurred to me that those on FR need a place to discuss religion, religious thought, denominal issues all things religious without worrying about hurt feelings or bruised egos.
This would be a bare knuckle discussion.
If you have thin skin or are easily offended it would be better not to participate.
That is why there exists one of God’s other gifts, one that walks hand in hand with the gift of his son. That is the gift of free will. God did not desire to have blind followers, so from the time of creation he allowed man to choose. They can choose to follow the true God or they can choose to be wrong and be drawn to the many offerings of the Evil One...
Good post! It reminds me of a true story re: C. S. Lewis. He was late for a meeting of Oxford dons, and when he arrived he asked what the big argument was about. A colleague informed him that the dons were trying to define what most differentiated Christianity from other religions. Lewis said, “Oh, that’s easy. Grace.”
And may He also be with you. Many blessings!
Why would your faith be incorrect or unnecessary? Wouldn’t the fact that God made you unique, be enough?
Don’t you think God is capable of anything, even creating each of us with our own true faith, designed by Him, just for them?
I suppose they are faiths, but I’m not an expert, so I may be wrong...but I do believe that God created them, knowing what they will believe.
Why should what was done on 9/11 be overlooked? Those people killed thousands and they should be held accountable here on earth. As for accountability after death, I have no idea, that’s up to God, who created them, knowing what they were going to do.
Why is trying to please everyone a slippery slope? Maybe for us humans, yes. For God, I doubt it is.
I do not know why liberalism is the way it is...other than God must have a reason for it.
I am sincerely glad to hear that!
who has not hit rock bottom
Do you mean by man's standard, ie lying in the gutter drunk 24/7 and selling you body to buy crack cocaine?
I would suggest that all non-regenerate souls have hit rock bottom by God's standard, and we are the dry bones in that valley in Ezekiel 37:
1 The hand of the Lord was upon me, and he brought me out in the Spirit of the Lord and set me down in the middle of the valley; it was full of bones. 2 And he led me around among them, and behold, there were very many on the surface of the valley, and behold, they were very dry. 3 And he said to me, “Son of man, can these bones live?” And I answered, “O Lord God, you know.” 4 Then he said to me, “Prophesy over these bones, and say to them, O dry bones, hear the word of the Lord. 5 Thus says the Lord God to these bones: Behold, I will cause breath to enter you, and you shall live. 6 And I will lay sinews upon you, and will cause flesh to come upon you, and cover you with skin, and put breath in you, and you shall live, and you shall know that I am the Lord.”
Breath to enter? Sinews and flesh to come upon you? Bones that were lying piled in a valley? Sounds like the teaching of the word of the Lord caused those bones to be regenerated, or born again!
Not convinced about the state of the nonbeliever? Ephesians Chapter 2 teaches that before we came to faith we were dead, until God brought us back to life, or born again:
2:1 And you were dead in the trespasses and sins 2 in which you once walked, following the course of this world, following the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that is now at work in the sons of disobedience— 3 among whom we all once lived in the passions of our flesh, carrying out the desires of the body and the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, like the rest of mankind. 4 But God, being rich in mercy, because of the great love with which he loved us, 5 even when we were dead in our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ—by grace you have been saved—
And consider Nicodemus who asked Christ what he must do to be saved. Nick, like you and I, had to be born again, and that comes from above:
John 3 3:1 Now there was a man of the Pharisees named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews. 2 This man came to Jesus by night and said to him, “Rabbi, we know that you are a teacher come from God, for no one can do these signs that you do unless God is with him.” 3 Jesus answered him, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of God.” 4 Nicodemus said to him, “How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother's womb and be born?” 5 Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. 6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. 7 Do not marvel that I said to you, ‘You must be born again.’ 8 The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear its sound, but you do not know where it comes from or where it goes. So it is with everyone who is born of the Spirit.”
All Christians are born again. Not in the TV evangelist way, but in the way that comes only from above.
____
In case anyone's wondering what I did just there, it's the equivalent to citing the Supreme Court as authority. In legalese, it would be described as "Court ruled miscreant was acting as a drama queen when . . . ."
If it didn't matter to you, you wouldn't be arguing about it.
When I look at a sunset or beautiful mountain range, I ask myself "why is this so lovely?". It is because there is a creator who wants us to enjoy his creation. That is the emotion of a loving and kind Father, not a overbearing and demanding one. So as it is for grace, such a gift comes from the love of a caring Father, and the only faith that displays a God with that level of love for those he created is Christianity.
I’m not arguing about it, I’m stating what I believe. How others respond is up to them.
How do you know the problem with man is sin? How do you even know if sin exists? Perhaps man made-up the concept of sin, in order for us to have laws and and structured societies. Didn’t God create us knowing everything that we are going to do? Why would He create a sinner?
What do you mean it’s what God thinks of you? Don’t you believe that God knows everything about you, before you are even born? How could God, the creator, think about you any other way than the way He created you?
If everything is correct, then there is no wrong...
Folks if we all had a button we could push that would take us to Heaven right now...how many of you would push it?
What does each of you preceive Heaven is like?
What about Hell?
Thanks
Well said Ejonesie.
I have to take a break for a while but will hopefully be back later on, just didn’t want anyone to think that I didn’t want to respond to them anymore ;)
God revealed our sin problem in the Bible. If you read it, you can learn all about it for yourself.
What Lewis meant by ‘what God thinks of you’ is this: if a person has accepted Jesus’ offer of salvation, then God looks at that person through the blood and sacrifice of His son, and He sees a clean, forgiven person who is ready and able to spend eternity with Him. If a person rejects Jesus’ offer, God looks at that person and sees the rotting filth of sin.
Re: God’s omniscience. He truly is omniscient, but that doesn’t remove our choice. Suppose time machines existed and I got into one, traveled forward to Nov 5, 2008, and saw who had won the election; then I put the machine in reverse and returned to the present. I would now have foreknowledge of the event, but my knowledge would not change the way the event would come about. People would still have to make up their minds and vote. All I did was see the results of that process before it had occurred.
Is there something wrong with a safe a benign statement?
That’s great that you believe the way you do, but why can’t others believe as they do, and be correct also? Why is your belief the only one that can be correct?
You have not answered why there cannot be a truth for each of us, all you have said, is that God said so, and that there isn’t more than one truth.
I ask how do you know that, and you say ‘because God said so’, I ask how you know God said so, and you say, ‘because it’s in the bible’. I ask how do you know the bible is the only truth, and you answer, ‘because God said so’. See, you haven’t really answered.
I have to leave in 45 min, but I’ll be here every day during the week and occasionally on weekends, so if you can come up with something that isn’t circular, let me know.
Well said. There is so much beauty in creation, and I do think God loves it when we notice and thank Him for it. In one of Conan Doyle’s stories, Sherlock Holmes points a flower out to Watson. He tells him that it is the evidence of God. Most of creation, he explains, is functional, but it’s the beautiful extras that so thrill our eyes and minds that reveal the hand of God. In that case, I believe Conan Doyle was right.
You started out by stating that this is what we all ought to agree on.
Nope, no survey, it’s just what I enjoy doing. Sort of like a community service.
I have no idea what happens after death. I would hope that there is something else, but I cannot comprehend what it could be.
No, I’m mostly just soliciting answers. When I hear something different or unique, I’ll let you know.
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