Cobb (County, GA) dads enter fray over evolution in schools

Atlanta Journal-Constitution ^ | 9.8.02 | MARY MacDONALD

[Conservative til I die]

OK, so the theory of gravity, is faith based then as well? Or the theory of calculus, mathematics, etc, all scientific findings are called theories.

No, because calculus, mathematics, gravity, chemical properties, magnetism, electricity, etc. etc. can all be tested over and over again with definite results. Evolution is closer to astrology, where a scientist finds a bone in the ground and makes gigantic inferences and extrapolations based on that infinitesmal finding.

[Aric2000]

THe working definition of an athiest is someone who does not believe in the existence god.

QED, I am NOT an atheist. Just because I do not believe in your religious mythology does not mean that I am an atheist, just because I want my children learning their religious beliefs from me, does not make me an atheist, just because I do not wish my children to learn about your myths and religion, does not mean that I am an atheist.

It does make you a bit of an extremist though, and perhaps a cultist would be a good definition for you.

A cult.

1 : formal religious veneration : WORSHIP
2 : a system of religious beliefs and ritual; also : its body of adherents

You seem to fit that definition quite well.

[Conservative til I die]

Typical trick: WHen you don't like what someone says, call them a liberal.

[Aric2000]

Where did I say that I hate god, that was an awfully far reaching assumption.

I do not want creationism taught in public school. It is not the public schools place to teach religious mythology. It is your job as a parent to teach that, if that is what you want your children to believe, NOT THE GOVERNMENTS!!

[Lucius Cornelius Sulla]

I see, maybe you would be happier in a country like Saudi Arabia or Iran.

Since I am talking about your opposition to Christian teaching, it looks like you have more in common with those folks. Your fanaticism approaches the Iranian mullahs.

[Lucius Cornelius Sulla]

Sorry, when you start talking about a religious theocracy in this country, you are being the treasonous one.

It is you who are attempting to impose a secular religious theocracy in this country. I am talking about terminating the government provision of education, and totally privatizing it. Where is there any theocracy in that? It looks like you have been smoking some good dope!

[AnnaZ]

OK, so the theory of gravity, is faith based then as well?

Hmmm... I always thought it was the law of gravity. And every morning, when I get out of bed and my feet naturally go to the floor, I believe it, no matter how badly I wish I could fly.

[Lucius Cornelius Sulla]

You seem to fit that definition quite well

As it happens, since you hate both God and most of his creatures, you seem to fit the definition of an enemy of the human race. In this way, you are an ally of Osama binLaden. This country knows how to deal with enemies of the human race.

[Lucius Cornelius Sulla]

I do not want creationism taught in public school.

I do not support it either. NOTHING should be taught in public school.

[Conservative til I die]

There is nothing wrong with teaching that there are other theories, if the theories are given a proportionate amount of time (for creationism, maybe 10 minutes and one page in a textbook?). Nothing wrong with it at all, if it is neutral and not an endorsement of creationism.

My own textbooks in high school mentioned primitive and alternate theories. There wasn't much to right because the theories themselves contained no math or quantitative findings.

If that makes you so scared, then you've got deeper issues than devotion ot the purity of science.

[Aric2000]

I just don't want relirious beliefs taught in school, I have no problem with you teaching yoru children whatever religion you care to have them believe. Where that makes me some kind of religious dictator is beyond me. Your logic is not logic at all.

You do not agree with what I say, but have no way to refute it, therefore you call me names.

That is a liberal tactic, are you therefore a liberal? I thought not, but your arguments are getting to the point of fanatascism, which is sad, very sad.

You don't like public school, neither do I, we agree on that, but as long as we have them, they had better not be teaching religious mythology. That is your job as a parent to teach that to your kids, not the governments.

[Othniel]

Gotta weigh in on this.

1) No matter how you cut it, something cannot come out of nothing. The evolutionists who claim that there was nothing there, and then suddenly there was, are either a few blades short of a propellor or insane. The thing that was made cannot be a part of its own making. It is logically impossible.

2) The whole evolution research (if you'll permit a horselaugh at this point) is working backwards, kind of like detectives trying to find out how someone was murdered. Problem is, there is so much sloppiness on dates, how long something might take, and whatnot, that exactness is impossible. Moreover, evolution cannot stand up to the scientific method because it is *not* repeatable.

3) Any attempt that Arric2000 might say about diversity within the scientific community is a fraud. There are a lot of theories out there from well-esablished people who are shunned because the theories don't fit the norm. One guy, for example, makes a great case for the core of the earth being a nuclear pile about 5-8 miles in diameter, but the *new* textbook on earth science I've seen ignores this fact, even though the theories been around for years. Open minds? Don't hold your breath, pal.

In a book "Bones of Contention," it is stated (and not disproved by anyone I've read critiquing it) that the skulls, etc., that the scientists "study" are actually resin casts of the original. The bone evidence is scant, and when set against other evidence, shows that any kind of "evolution" was not progressive, and that there were different kinds of alleged ancestors living in the same locale at the same time. Yet we're supposed to sit back and let our kids be subjected to such unscientific drivel? I think not.

The public schools need to expose kids to both sides of the issue. There are too many holes in the theory of evolution to present it as a law (like the law of gravity, which is repeatable) or a fact (like chickens lay eggs). Who knows? Maybe our kids might come out of schools actually able to look at an issue and think about it.

One more thing. Given the millions of steps for evolution to occur, I submit this Triple Dog Dare to Arrac2000 (or whatever the name is) and to other proponents of evolution: Get a tupperware bowl and lid, or a butter tub, or something with a lid. Take apart a Lego minifig (head, torso, legs)and put pieces in bowl. Cover with lid and shake. Check every 5 seconds. Let me know when the parts come together to "evolve" into a fully-made, fully-functional minifig. I won't hold my breath.

[diode]

And perhaps abortion as well? Strict adherence to the shibboleths of evolution undergirds an atheistic/materialist point of view, making the surgical extermination of fetal life more tenable. An as a matter of fact, none of the medical advances you describe were necessarily derived from an evolutionary model as you seem to imply. Regards

[Tribune7]

Do you believe that public schools should teach from the perspective that God's existence is a truth?

[Doctor Stochastic]

At least you admit that your belief in God is based on counting noses rather than faith and logic isn't important.

[Aric2000]

As it happens, since you hate both God and most of his creatures,

Geez, you fanatics really reach, and I mean WAY out there.

I do not hate god, I do not hate christianity either. if you wish to teach your children christianity, then please, BE MY GUEST, BUT, as long as there is public school, religion should not be taught in science class. PERIOD!!

Creationism is religion, evolution is science, no matter how many times you repeat the lie that evolution has no scientific basis, does NOT make it true. That is again, a Clintonesque trick. Lie and lie and lie, and pretty soon people will believe it is the truth.

If you want your kids taught creationism in school, then send them to private school. End of story.

If you want your children to get a faith based education, then send them to private school, if they have to go to public school because you can't afford it, then maybe you ought to teach it to them at home. It is a parents responsiblity to teach religion, NOT the governments.

I should know better then to debate with a bunch of religious fanatics. You twist my arguments because I am not a creationist, but we actually agree that the government has no place in school, although putting public teachers to death is a little extreme, is it not?

THe government has no place in my childrens education, that is why I homeschool, but I am not a christian, so that makes me satan carnate, even though we agree on the basic issue of government schools, there shouldn't be any. BUT, as long as there are, and as long as we do have government financed and government run schools, creationism and other religious beliefs have no place there.

[diode]

And perhaps abortion as well? Strict adherence to the shibboleths of evolution undergirds an atheistic/materialist point of view, making the surgical extermination of fetal life more tenable. An as a matter of fact, none of the medical advances you describe were necessarily derived from an evolutionary model as you seem to imply. Regards

[nmh]

"Well, he doesn't sound terribly religious -- but he wants to cloak himself in his faith so that his opponents cannot attack him. And since when is scepticism about evolution inherently Christian? Has he read his holy book? I believe the Jewish faith mentions Adam and Eve and the creation of the world by God. If he is a Jew, why doesn't he believe?"

Since you've read the Bible, you also know, the Jewish people have always had a problem with obedience. Sure they're supposed to believe in creation but like ancient times, they abandon God's Word for vain philosophy.

[nmh]

He can't help how he looks but he can help his simpleness. He happily wallows in ignorance and acts out when threatened. Proverbs has a lot to say about the "simple".