Continuing The Bigotry

Captain's Quarters Blog ^ | 06/10/07 | Ed Morrisey

[billbears]

Thank you for clearing that up. I won't be voting for Romney but hold nothing against him either. He could believe in the Great Pumpkin for all I care. The one thing I look for in conservative leadership is a person that will cut government to the bone and be willing to give specific departments he will be cutting.

This nonsense of 'cutting' government we're getting from Republicans in the past decade or so is just that, nonsense. I don't want to hear how letting government grow at a lower rate is cutting. It's not. And that's what the majority of the Republican candidates are advocating

[greyfoxx39]

Evidently it is alright to reflexively vote FOR a candidate based on religion, but to vote against them for the same reason is verboten.

[greyfoxx39]

Should we let Mormons be the only ones to disseminate information about their own history?

Is this what is to be expected?

Yep!

Why do you think the LDS church has acquired so many historical documents and locked them away in archives?

[FastCoyote]

“eventually resorting to jackboot”

Note the word “eventually”, it is an adverb, a modifier. I think those grammatical constructs are learned in about the 5th grade.

[Degaston]

>> as a means to propagate more anti-Mormon bigotry
>> at the expense of Mitt Romney

Whoa!! There might be some anti-Mormon bigotry out there. But for the most part the “anti-Mormon” dialogue is in response to the undeniable bigotry that is deeply ingrained in Mormonism. How do you personally feel Reaganesque about the bigotry in the Book of Mormon? Do you denounce it? Or do you accept the bigotry of that book? Do you denounce Brigham Young’s bigoted racism? Or do you think he was a true prophet of God?

IMHO the last people who should be calling anyone a bigot are Mormons who believe in the Book of Mormon or who believe that Brigham Young was a true prophet.

[curiosity]

anti-Semitic group Nation of Islam

They're not just anti-Semitic. They're a bunch of black supremicists, anti everyone who isn't black. Though it's true, their hatred of Jews is particularly strong.

[ComeUpHigher]

You’re fretting about bigotry in the Book of Mormon?

You better check the Bible before you cast stones at the Book of Mormon:

(Gen. 9:20-27)

And Noah began to be an husbandman, and he planted a vineyard:

And he drank of the wine, and was drunken; and he was uncovered within his tent.

And Ham, the father of Canaan, saw the nakedness of his father, and told his two brethren without.

And Shem and Japheth took a garment, and laid it upon both their shoulders, and went backward, and covered the nakedness of their father; and their faces were backward, and they saw not their father’s nakedness.

And Noah awoke from his wine, and knew what his younger son had done unto him.

And he said, Cursed be Canaan; a servant of servants shall he be unto his brethren.

And he said, Blessed be the LORD God of Shem; and Canaan shall be his servant.

God shall enlarge Japheth, and he shall dwell in the tents of Shem; and Canaan shall be his servant.

(Ex. 21:2-6)

If thou buy an Hebrew servant, six years he shall serve: and in the seventh he shall go out free for nothing.

If he came in by himself, he shall go out by himself: if he were married, then his wife shall go out with him.

If his master have given him a wife, and she have born him sons or daughters; the wife and her children shall be her master’s, and he shall go out by himself.

And if the servant shall plainly say, I love my master, my wife, and my children; I will not go out free:

Then his master shall bring him unto the judges; he shall also bring him to the door, or unto the door post; and his master shall bore his ear through with an aul; and he shall serve him for ever.

(Exodus 21:20-21)

And if a man smite his servant, or his maid, with a rod, and he die under his hand; he shall be surely punished.

Notwithstanding, if he continue a day or two, he shall not be punished: for he is his money.

(Lev. 25:44-46)

Both thy bondmen, and thy bondmaids, which thou shalt have, shall be of the heathen that are round about you; of them shall ye buy bondmen and bondmaids.

Moreover of the children of the strangers that do sojourn among you, of them shall ye buy, and of their families that are with you, which they begat in your land: and they shall be your possession.

And ye shall take them as an inheritance for your children after you, to inherit them for a possession; they shall be your bondmen for ever: but over your brethren the children of Israel, ye shall not rule one over another with rigour.

And for those who think it only appears in the Old Testament, consider the following:

(Colossians 4:1)

Masters, give unto your servants that which is just and equal; knowing that ye also have a Master in heaven.

(1 Peter 2:18-21)

Servants, be subject to your masters with all fear; not only to the good and gentle, but also to the froward.

For this is thankworthy, if a man for conscience toward God endure grief, suffering wrongfully.

For what glory is it, if, when ye be buffeted for your faults, ye shall take it patiently? but if, when ye do well, and suffer for it, ye take it patiently, this is acceptable with God.

For even hereunto were ye called: because Christ also suffered for us, leaving us an example, that ye should follow his steps:

And for those of the female persuasion, the Bible says thus:

(1 Corinthians 14:34-35)

Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law.

And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.

(1 Tim. 2: 11-12)

Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection.

But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.

[Dante3]

If it has, I haven’t heard it.

[MHGinTN]

This post (#147) is typical of apologists' efforts to sow doubt. We 'Inmans' have met that with our own revelations of Mormonism doctrine and foundations (such as Smith's specious rewriting of the Book of Genesis, to write in a prophecy he dreamed up of his advent * http://scriptures.lds.org/en/jst/contents *). Is this sort of doubt sowing to be opposed or just ignored by those who see it for the agenda it represents? [I recall something about milk and meat and strengthening the weak in the faith rather than judaizing them. Your scriptural milage may vary.]

[Elsie]

Is it a term of endearment, do you think?

If you're named Petunia or Porky; probably...

[Elsie]

What’s going on in the Republican Party in Utah?

HMmmm...

It seems that folks who complain that someone might NOT vote for a person because of their religious beliefs; have overwhelmingly voted for someone beCAUSE of their belief!

[Elsie]

gmta!

[Elsie]

How do you personally feel Reaganesque about the bigotry in the Book of Mormon? Do you denounce it?

Sorry; but he CANNOT!!

Remember; these are the WORDS OF GOD!

You take out one link, and the whole thing collapses!

[Elsie]

Take THAT!!

(While you’re busy defending the Book, we’ll just slip away!)

—MormonDude

[Elsie]

http://scriptures.lds.org/en/jst/contents

[Enosh]

"This post (#147) is typical of apologists' efforts to sow doubt."

In post #147, Twinkletoes, er... CUH, essentially calls God a bigot. Much of that was original Hebrew Law given to Moses by God.

Come Judgment Day, while being thrust into the lake of fire, I can just see Twinkletoes, er... CUH, shouting "Bigot! Bigot" at Jesus.

[colorcountry]

LOL! p**, I would never have guessed.

[MHGinTN]

Careful, I've posted that link before and been derided for posting anti-Mormon materials. LOL That chapter 50 from Genesis in the Smith translation/addition to the Bible is interesting and shows a certain brilliance I don't think Smith had of his own, making it more convincing that he was under the powers of a demon. he didn't just add to the chapter, he wove his created prophecy into the existing text and then added more to point to himself 'inthese latter days'.

Of course, we're not to point these things out because that makes us bigots and hatemongers. To turn someone away from the road to destruction is unsettling to the tolerance and peace some demand so that they will not be confronted with the use of eternal destiny. [ Something about neither hot nor cold and being spit our comes to mind ...]

[nowandlater]

Tsk. Tsk. Take a look at the mountain evidence in Jewish tradion for a annointed seer called Joseph. Oh well, can't blame you, it so easy to grab onto something without doing the research! [2] Daniel 2:44; 7:27. [3] The Hebrew word targum (plural targumim) means “translation” and refers to the Aramaic translations of the Bible made after the Jews, during the Babylonian captivity, had adopted Aramaic instead of Hebrew as their native tongue. [4] Martin McNamara, Targum Neofiti 1: Genesis (The Aramaic Bible volume 1A, Collegeville, MN: The Liturgical Press, 1992), 182. According to Jasher 68:1, Moses’ sister Miriam, when still a child, predicted, “Behold a son will be born unto us from my father and mother this time, and he will save Israel from the hands of Egypt.” [5] For a discussion, see John A. Tvedtnes, “Joseph’s Prophecy of Moses and Aaron,” FARMS Update 143, Insights 21/1 (January 2001). [6] Michael Maher, Targum Pseudo-Jonathan: Genesis (The Aramaic Bible volume 1B, Collegeville, MN: The Liturgical Press, 1992), 166. [7] The original Patriarchal Blessings Book, kept by Oliver Cowdery, is in the LDS Church archives. [8] Midrash Rabbah Genesis 97, commenting on Deuteronomy 33:22, reads, “R. Hama b. R. Hanina said: This alludes to Messiah the son of David who was descended from two tribes, his father being from Judah and his mother from Dan, in connection with both of which ‘lion’ is written: JUDAH IS A LION’S WHELP; Dan is a lion's whelp (Deut. XXXIII, 22).” H. Freedman and Maurice Simon, eds., Midrash Rabbah (reprint, London: Socino Press, 1961), Genesis vol. 2, 906. [9] We note, however, that Brigham Young declared that “Joseph Smith was a pure Ephraimite” (Journal of Discourses 2:269). [10] Cleon Skousen, The Third Thousand Years (Salt Lake City: Bookcraft, 1964), 156f.; Kirk Holland Vestal and Arthur Wallace, The Firm Foundation of Mormonism (Los Angeles: LL Company, 1991), 205-211; Joseph Fielding McConkie, His Name Shall Be Joseph: Ancient Prophecies of the Latter-day Seer (Salt Lake City: Hawkes, 1980); Prophets and Prophecy (Salt Lake City: Bookcraft, 1988), 56, 58-60; Joseph Fielding McConkie, “Joseph Smith as Found in Ancient Manuscripts,” in Monte S. Nyman, ed., Isaiah and the Prophets: Inspired Voices from the Old Testament (Provo: BYU Religious Studies Center, 1984), 11-31; Matthew B. Brown, All Things Restored: Confirming the Authenticity of LDS Beliefs, (American Fork: Covenant, 2000), 34f.; Michael T. Griffith, One Lord, One Faith: Writings of the Early Christian Fathers as Evidences of the Restoration (Bountiful: Horizon, 1996), 94-96. Griffith errs in saying that the prophet of whom Moses spoke in Deuteronomy 18:15-18 was Joseph Smith. The scriptures make it clear that this prophet was Jesus Christ (1 Nephi 22:20-21; 3 Nephi 20:23; Joseph Smith History 1:40). Griffith’s is evidently unaware of these passages (in one of which Christ himself says he is that prophet) and he argues that it must be Joseph Smith because “Jesus was and is much more than a prophet.” While we can agree with this statement, we can also say that he was and is much more than a Christ or Messiah, since these terms merely means “anointed one” and were applied to Old Testament kings. It is somewhat strange that Griffith’s declaration is found in a passage in which he is trying to establish that Joseph Smith is the “Messiah” of Joseph! [11] Judges 9:8, 15; 1 Samuel 2:35; 9:16; 10:1; 15:1, 17; 16:1-17; 24:6, 10; 26:9, 11, 16, 23; 2 Samuel 1:14, 16; 2:4, 47; 3:39; 5:3; 12:7, 17; 19:11, 21; 22:51; 23:1; 1 Kings 1:33-35, 39, 45; 19:15-16; 2 Kings 9:1-13; 11:12; 23:30; 1 Chronicles 11:3; 14:8; 16:22; 29:22; 2 Chronicles 6:42; 22:7; 23:11; Psalms 2:2; 18:50; 20:6; 45:7; 84:9; 89:20, 38, 51; 105:15; Lamentations 4:20; Habakkuk 3:13. [12] Exodus 29:4‑9; see also Exodus 28:41; 30:30; 40:12-15; Leviticus 8:12-13, 30; 21:10-12; Psalm 133:1-2. [13] 1 Kings 19:16; see 1 Chronicles 16:22; Psalm 105:15. According to 2 Nephi 25:18, there was to be only one Messiah, but this passage must be understood in reference to the fact that there is only one anointed Savior. At the beginning of his ministry, Christ read the passage about the anointing in Isaiah 61:1-2 and declared that it referred to him (Luke 4:18-21; cf. D&C 138:42). [14] For the Jewish tradition, see Joseph Klausner, The Messianic Idea in Israel from Its Beginning to the Completion of the Mishnah (New York: Macmillan, 1955), chap. 9, “Messiah ben Joseph and the War with Gog and Magog,” 483-501; Joseph Heinemann, “The Messiah of Ephraim and the Premature Exodus of the Tribe of Ephraim,” Harvard Theological Review 8/1 (January 1975): 1-15; Hugh J. Schonfield, Secrets of the Dead Sea Scrolls: Studies Towards Their Solution (New York: Thomas Yoseloff, 1957), 68-72, 74-76, 80-82, 129-130, 153; Isidore Singer, Managing Ed., The Jewish Encyclopedia (New York: Funk & Wagnalls, 1901), 1:683; 8:511-512; D. Berger, “Three Typological Themes in Early Jewish Messianism: Messiah Son of Joseph, Rabbinical Calculations, and the Figure of Armilus,” Journal for the Association for Jewish Studies 9 (1984), 141-64. One of the best all-round books on Jewish concepts of the Messiah is Raphael Patai, The Messiah Texts: Jewish Legends of Three Thousand Years (Detroit: Wayne State University Press, 1979), especially chapter 17 (“Messiah ben Joseph”). Unfortunately, he does not include the Dead Sea Scrolls. [15] For Joseph Smith’s Josephite ancestry, see History of the Church 6:16-17. [16] Jews still leave an empty chair at the table for Elijah during the Passover ceremony at which they believe he will return to earth. Elijah’s visit to the Kirtland Temple in 1836 corresponded with the Passover. [17] In addition to the texts examined here, the Messiah of Joseph is mentioned in Tanhuma Buber Wa-Yiggash 3, Midrash Psalms 60:9; 87:4; Targum Song of Songs 4:5; 7:4. [18] Louis Ginzberg, The Legends of the Jews (Philadelphia: Jewish Publication Society of America, 1948), 5:299 n. 201. [19] The passage cites part of Zechariah 12:10, which reads, “And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him, as one mourneth for his only son, and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that is in bitterness for his firstborn.” Latter-day Saints and other Christians would see this as a prophecy of Jesus Christ, though there is some dispute about the meaning of the Hebrew text. We also believe that Zechariah 14:4 refers to the Savior. The talmudic passage correctly declares that the words of Psalms 2:7 (“Thou art my Son; this day have I begotten thee”) are addressed by God to the Messiah son of David. [20] The King James version of the Bible calls them “carpenters.” [21] Midrash Rabbah Song of Songs 2:33 lists the four as “Elijah, the Messiah, Melchizedek, and the War Messiah.” H. Freedman and Maurice Simon, eds., Midrash Rabbah Song of Songs vol., 125. [22] For a discussion of the two messiahs in the Dead Sea Scrolls, see Solomon Zeitlin, “The Essenes and Messianic Expectations,” Jewish Quarterly Review 45 (1954): 107; John J. Collins, The Scepter and the Star: The Messiahs of the dead Sea Scrolls and Other Ancient Literature" (New York: Doubleday, 1995). See also “The Messiah, the Book of Mormon, and the Dead Sea Scrolls,” chapter 46 in John A. Tvedtnes, The Most Correct Book: Insights from a Book of Mormon Scholar (Bountiful, UT: Cornerstone/Horizon, 1999). [23] Matthew 11:12-14; 17:10-13; Mark 9:11-13; Luke 1:13-17; D&C 27:6-8; 84:26-28. [24] The Dead Sea scrolls are noted for describing a Messiah of David and a Messiah of Levi or Aaron, but not a Messiah of Joseph. Though fragments of the various Testaments of the Twelve Patriarchs were found among these scrolls, none of those fragments cover the specific passages cited here. [25] James H. Charlesworth, The Old Testament Pseudepigrapha (Garden City: Doubleday, 1983), 1:824. [26] Ibid., 1:826. [27] Brigham Young said, “When Martin was with Joseph Smith, he was continually trying to make the people believe that he (Joseph) was the Shepherd, the Stone of Israel. I have heard Joseph chastise him severely for it, and he told me that such a course, if persisted in, would destroy the kingdom of God. Who else ever said that Joseph Smith was anything but an unlearned son of a backwoodsman; who had all his lifetime, ever since he would handle an ax, helped his father to support his little family by cutting wood? Thus the Lord found him, and called him to be a Prophet, and made him a successful instrument in laying the foundation of His kingdom for the last time. This people never professed that Joseph Smith was anything more than a Prophet given to them of the Lord; and to whom the Lord gave the keys of this last dispensation, which were not to be taken from him in time, neither will they be in eternity” (Journal of Discourses 2:127). [28] Martin McNamara, Targum Neofiti 1: Exodus and Michael Maher, Targum Pseudo-Jonathan: Exodus (The Aramaic Bible, vol. 2, Collegeville, MN: The Liturgical Press, 1994), 283. However, in Targum Neofiti on Numbers 11:26, we read that Gog and Magog are to fall “at the hand of King Messiah,” who is of the tribe of Judah; ibid. Martin McNamara, Targum Neofiti 1:Exodus and Michael Maher, Targum Pseudo-Jonathan: Exodus (The Aramaic Bible, vol. 2, Collegeville, MN: The Liturgical Press, 1994), 74. In Targum Pseudo-Jonathan on Numbers 24:17, it is “the strong King from the house of Jacob from those of the house of Jacob shall rule and the Messiah and the strong rod [Isaiah 11:1] from Israel shall be anointed, he will kill the leaders of the Moabites and make nothing of all the children of Seth [Numbers 24:17], the armies of Gog, who in the future will make war against Israel [Ezekiel 38-39; Revelation 20:8-9]” (261). [29] James H. Charlesworth, The Old Testament Pseudepigrapha (Garden City: Doubleday, 1983), 1:298. [30] Charles C. Torrey, “The Messiah Son of Ephraim,” JBL 66 (1947): 267-8. [31] Harry Sperling et al., The Zohar (New York: The Rebecca Bennet Publications, 1958), 5:276. [32] Rabbi Aryeh Kaplan, transl. of Rabbi Yaakov Culi, The Torah Anthology (MeAm Lo’ez) (New York/Jerusalem: Maznaim, 1984), 537 and note 5. [33] Many scholars believe that the term rendered “bough” for Joseph in Genesis 49:22 refers to a wild ass. Actually, the word is the normal Hebrew term for “son,” just as the word rendered “branches” in the same verse really means “daughters.” [34] For Daniel’s prophecy of the fall of Babylon, see Daniel 5 and John A. Tvedtnes, “Nebuchadnezzar or Nabonidus? Mistaken Identities in the Book of Daniel,” The Ensign, September 1986. [35] For the story of Mordecai, see the Old Testament book of Esther. The Medes and Persians united under the kingship of Cyrus the Great, whose father was king of Persia and whose maternal grandfather was king of Media. [36] H. Freedman and Maurice Simon, eds., Midrash Rabbah Numbers vol., 558. [37] For the Samaritan belief, see William E. Barton, “The Samaritan Messiah,” The Open Court 21/9/616 (September 1907), 528-538; Jacob, Son of Aaron, High Priest of the Samaritans, “The Messianic Hope of the Samaritans,” The Open Court 21/4/611, 272-296; James Alan Montgomery, The Samaritans: The Earliest Jewish Sect (New York: Ktav, 1968 [orig. 1907]), 239-251; Alan D. Crown, The Samaritans (Tübingen: J. C. B. Mohr, 1989), 272-276; John Bowman, Samaritan Documents Relating to Their History, Religion and Life (Pittsburgh: Pickwick, 1977), especially “Phineas on the Taheb,” 267-281; John Bowman, “Early Samaritan Eschatology,” The Journal of Jewish Studies 6/2 (1955): 63-72; Isidore Singer, Managing Ed., The Jewish Encyclopedia (New York: Funk & Wagnalls, 1905), 10:674. I am indebted to Matt Roper for bringing most of these to my attention. [38] G. R. S. Mead, The Gnostic John the Baptizer: Selections from the Mandaean John-Book (London: John M. Watkins, 1924). [39] A. E. Cowley, Expositor, 5th series 1 (1895): 163, cited in Matthew Black, the Scrolls and Christian Origins: Studies in the Jewish Background of the New Testament (New York: Charles Scribner’s Sons, 1961), 159. The antiquity of the belief is evidenced by the fact that a pretender Taheb appeared on the scene in the days of Jesus. Josephus wrote of a Samaritan who claimed that he would reveal to his people the location of the sacred vessels hidden by Moses atop mount Gerizim. His plans were upset when Pontius Pilate sent troops to break up the crowd (Antiquities of the Jews 18.4.1). http://www.meridianmagazine.com/jsbicentennial/051223js.html

[MHGinTN]

Surely you are smart enough to understand that your post in no way authorizes Joe smith to rewrite the Book of Genesis and write himself in by adding hundreds of words to that chapter 50. ... Well, perhaps you can’t understand that else you wouldn’t posts such a paragraph and assume it is somehow relevant.