Posted on 05/13/2011 11:38:30 AM PDT by LowNslow
My Thoughts On The Marine Killed By Pima County SWAT
Jonn and many of our readers have already discussed this but I am going to add my two cents.
I am admittedly very upset and disturbed by this story for a number of reasons. I understand that all the facts in the case have not been forthcoming but that is mostly because the Pima County Sheriff’s Office, which as Strike FO pointed out is run by the illustrious Sheriff Dupnik, is trying to cover their ass. Additionally, they are repeatedly changing their story, which should tell everyone following this hat Pima County SWAT knows they have screwed up.
(Excerpt) Read more at thisainthell.us ...
Where Dupe-nik is concerned, those aren’t mutually exclusive.
Either way, IMHO, citizens who have the time and means would be well advised to start investigating the Pima County Sheriff’s office with a microscope using all purely legal means.
Kind of like a nice hobby.
Possibly of help to an investigator.
http://www.rcfp.org/ogg/index.php?op=browse&state=AZ
Open Government Guide
May I ask a different question?
Do we really want, or need our government to be this powerful?
LLS
That is a very interesting site thanks.
Comment from the site:
“I’m not inclined to blame the cops going through the door, those guys deal with life and death everyday. If I went through a door on a high risk warrant and saw a dude in a shooting stance with a rifle I’d shoot him too.
That said if you hit the wrong house and it gets some innocent, law abiding citizen killed people’s jobs should be over. The guy who gave the green light on this raid needs to be turning his gear in.”
Here is my problem with this very common response.
1. “The guy who gave the green light for the raid should be turning his gear in.” No the only way to end these kinds of raids is to hold ALL involved criminally responsible. Not manslaughter. Murder One. For the cops, for the judge, for the supervisor. Everybody. Guess what. Everybody gets careful.
2. “I’m not inclined to blame the cops going through the door, those guys deal with life and death everyday.”
I deal with life and death everyday. I drive 1000 miles a week and have for many many years. It’s dangerous. I also deal with high voltage. It’s dangerous. It’s also a public service. You don’t see me killing people and claiming special dispensation do you?
The cops, the D.A.’s office, the Judge that signed the warrant should be held criminally responsible for wrongful death. I know that takes all the fun out of knocking heads, busting down doors and chasing tail, but it’s the answer. Remove the special status of Law Enforcement, prosecutors and judges. It will make them real careful.
When I became a reporter two years ago for my own newsblog, the first thing I did was memorize Louisiana’s Open Meetings and Public Records Law. I’ve had to cite them more than once to school board presidents, mayors and county chairmen.
IMHO, the moment a police agency is involved in a case such as this the responsibility for investigating it should be turned over to another agency, preferably from an entirely different jurisdiction. Pending getting someone on the scene who does not work with, or for, those involved in the incident the scene should be secured by officers from a local agency that is not involved in the incident.
It defies common sense to have those who might have committed errors, or crimes, or those who work with them, investigating themselves.
Situations such as this are highly charged and can be very confusing to begin with, it makes no sense for those who have a stake in the outcome of an incident do the investigation and even have control over the evidence surrounding the incident.
The average, law abiding citizen is truly caught in the middle in 21st century America. On one side is the criminal who often do as they please and then fight like hell not to be held responsible. On the other side you have officers whose hands have been so tightly tied that they feel compelled to bend the rules in order to get their job done.
As a matter of fact, it seems to me, again IMHO, that there is virtually no oversight in America these days. As budgets have gotten tighter and tighter the first thing to go has been the jobs of those who are supposed to keep an eye on things.
If I had my way, and I seldom if ever do, I would make it the law that of any agency’s budget a hefty percentage would HAVE to be used to assure oversight of it’s operation.
The unions will not allow that.
Incidentally, rcfp.org is a “mainstream media” organization as described on it’s “about” page, linked to here:
http://www.rcfp.org/about.html
While the information on the website is useful, this note about the “About” page is an fyi...
re: unions will not allow that
Sigh, that’s another, entirely separate, rant.
This story is reprehensible and must be exposed to the entire country. Big time investigation required.
Dupnik’s subconscious is exploding!
Please note on this blog they are trying to set up a widow’s fund to support the Marine’s wife and children.
bump!
Are you saying that these episodes of police misconduct we read about today are because police's hands have been too tightly tied?
If your answer is "yes", how would you untie them?
I am not referring to the fact their hand is limited, it surely should be when they have the potential for doing so much harm. I was pointing out that some officers feel they can't get the job done without cutting corners. But it's always been that way. The problems come up when fellow officers are expected to fault the way a situation was handled. It has become acceptable for an agency to conduct an investigation, most if not all of which is done under very tight wraps, and then release a statement that those involved acted within department policy.
In many instances the road to redress for a wronged citizen is purposely made rough to discourage anyone taking it.
In a situation where you have a perp, a victim, and the authorities it's the victim who has the fewest rights and the longest road to redress. And that was the point of my post, that we citizens are caught in the middle. On one hand you have the criminal who is under no particular control at the time of the crime and on the other hand you have the police who have the luxury of present their side after careful grooming, usually under a total blackout and with no particular time limit imposed.
So often the only reason a citizen ever prevails is because someone happened to photograph the incident. And now jurisdictions all over the country are passing laws to severely restrict the rights of those who would record an arrest or encounter.
There is so much opportunity for mistakes and abuses that it behooves us as a society to work very hard to make sure the actions and behavior of our officers is subject to a fair, objective review. That's not the case in many instances.
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