The Swarming Boat Problem –What Does it Mean? (A threat to our Navy)

Technology and Security ^ | Feb 12 2012 | Stephen Bryen

[headstamp 2]

Time to go back to the 50 cal. Quad mounts.

[oldsalt]

I can recall being on board Enterprise on Yankee Station in '66 and watching the sunrise ...and looking at all junks and small boats crowded all around us. We were fairly close inshore,the North Vietnamese coast was a smudge on the horizon.

Those junks were supposedly fishing,but were really there to sound off when we launched a strike. Our defense against them wasn't there until they welded some .50 cal mounts on the catwalks all around the flight deck. The only high-speed contacts I remember were one early AM blips that sent us to GQ. Six high speed surface contacts were eliminated by diverting an A-6 Intruder from an en route night strike inland to the area of the contacts...which disappeared after a dump of maybe 22 bombs on their position.

Then point is you make do with what you've got or improvise.

[Angry_White_Man_Syndrome]

Those 4 gun mounts can be fitted with much more that 7.62.

[Nervous Tick]

>> One wonders why, despite the depth of concern and the years the Navy has had to deal with the threat, very little (if anything) has been done to build proper countermeasures.

Let me just take a wild stab at this one: Because we promote to leadership positions admirals whose main ambition is to see that our submarines are “manned” entirely by lesbian “sailors”?

[meatloaf]

I would hope we’re smart enough to keep the our carriers out of range of small boats. That doesn’t mean we couldn’t be surprised by a bunch towed far out to sea beyond their expected range. If pirates do that, Iran certainly can. Unfortunately, Israel is the wild card. With us mostly out of Iraq, they have an easier route to Iran. We could end up being bystanders who take a hit after Israel attacks Iran’s nuclear facilities. I don’t expect us to escape taking a hit. I’ve said before I wouldn’t be surprised if we lose a carrier. There’s too much fuel and ordinance to not suffer serious damage and even a loss.

[Eldon Tyrell]

http://www.baesystems.com/ProductsServices/bae_prod_bofors_mm_mk_three.html

Yup -

For exactly this purpose. Demos are awesome.

The article is kind of silly - talking about the gattling gun.

[Thrownatbirth]

The old Terrier SAMs worked very well against small surface targets. We took out a 30 degree swath of rubber boats at 5-6 miles during a MISSILEX.

Kind of a scary flight profile though. It looked like it was arcing right back at you.

[RedMDer]

We have an election coming and FR must be up and running and healthy if we are going to make a difference. All contributions are for the Current Quarter Expenses. In other words, FR could go away if the expenses for this quarter are not met. Where would you go? Click here or mail checks to: Free Republic, LLC - PO Box 9771 - Fresno, CA 93794

We have an election coming and FR must be up and running and healthy if we are going to make a difference. All contributions are for the Current Quarter Expenses. In other words, FR could go away if the expenses for this quarter are not met. Where would you go? Click here or mail checks to: Free Republic, LLC - PO Box 9771 - Fresno, CA 93794

[Last Dakotan]

Because we promote to leadership positions admirals whose main ambition is to see that our submarines are “manned” entirely by lesbian “sailors”?

Yeah, and cower in fear when female Senators question whether they should receive their pensions.

[PapaBear3625]

Those 4 gun mounts can be fitted with much more that 7.62.

Yes, they can be fitted with .50 and 40mm grenade launchers, but at 3,000 rounds per minute, the 7.62 mini gun will shred a speed boat quite nicely. The tracer stream also makes it easier to guide onto the target from a moving boat.

[Angry_White_Man_Syndrome]

Yes, but with a max effective range of 2000 meters compared to 1000 for the 7.62 a 50 cal is the way to go. This even more important when dealing with suicide mission targets. Now having 7.62 ready if they get past you outer line is good but nothing compares to the stopping power and range of a 50 cal on a small boat.

[PapaBear3625]

You have higher confidence than I do about the ability of a sailor on a moving, bouncing boat to hit a dodging speedboat at 2,000 meters using a non-gyro-stabilized gun. Our sailors are really good, I’m not sure they are that good.

[PapaBear3625]

One thing I might like to see on our patrol boats, for use against speedboats: TOW missiles with gyro-stabilized computer-assisted sights.

[Pilsner]

Normally they’re well offshore where little craft like this wouldn’t venture, right?

In narrow water ways, there is no "well offshore." Our warships will be threading their way civilian shipping, including trading, fishing and pleasure vessels of all kinds, a lot off it making short trips along the Gulf coast, or across it. If the Navy knows in advance when, and where,the Iranians will attack, I don't doubt that our aircraft and helicopters could easily destroy Iranian fast boats by the hundred. But I also think it is preposterous to think that the lack of guns on our warships isn't a big deal, because we have enough helicopters to give all of our warships 360° protection, 24-7.

[newnhdad]

all they need is one. There is no defense against a swarm attack of a few dozen smaller craft and probably a few dozen missiles launched at the same time. If we know this, they know this. Imagine what losing a carrier would do to our Navy. A Navy already tasked with reducing forces.
It will only take one hit for Obama to withdraw from the region. He’s just looking for an excuse to make gas $10 gallon so his Voltswagon will finally sell.

[nascarnation]

One of my buddies is a Captain in the USNR. I’ll see what he thinks.

[Angry_White_Man_Syndrome]

I was in the Special Boat units when we did the acceptance trials on these boats. One of the criteria was the ability to launch Stinger, surface to air missles. I don’t think a TOW would be much more difficult.

[PapaBear3625]

How did you find the platform, as far as being able to hit something at long range with a machinegun?

One thing about TOW is that you need to keep the sights centered on the target to guide the missile to it, which is why I was talking about mounting some sort of gyro-stabilized platform for the sights (with the user able to control the thing from inside the boat while looking at the target on a display).

[PapaBear3625]

PS: thank you for your service!

[Angry_White_Man_Syndrome]

The boat is actually a lot more stable then you might think. A good driver can make it a pretty steady ride especially in the shallow waters where they operate. We had plenty of range time shooting 3’ dia targets out by San Clemente Island. I could usually get on target within 10 to 20 rounds with 7.62 at 500 to 600 yards.