Posted on 12/11/2010 9:55:10 PM PST by Swordmaker
Look lady, I’ve already conceded. You win. Apple is the best. Steve Jobs is the best. Al Gore is the best. PC’s suck, they should probably be outlawed, as they have no use in our world.
I should have looked at your posting history before I made my first reply to you, and I would have seen that I was debating an Apple employee, or someone who has a strong agenda to push Apple on conservative forum, which is generally related to politics.
Is this Apples way of getting conservatives to buy into their whole lifestyle thing, by hiring women to get on blogs and pimp their product? Apple is already very big in the far left, so it wouldn’t surprise me that they would have planted agents to push their agenda in conservative forums.
You won miss. Apple is the bees knees, and I was a fool to think otherwise.
This horse is dead. No need to keep beating it.
You clearly know as much about me as you do about Macs, and are just as willing to treat your wild-assed assumptions as fact.
YOU are the one who swallowed the purely manufactured hype when you claim there was an "iPhone debacle" and "reception-gate." We owners of the product did not because we did not experience what we were being told we should be experiencing! Believe me I tried to get my iPhone4 to drop signal; I couldn't get it to do it!
The fact is that as soon as the totally UNCHANGED iPhone4 was released in the world market, away from the Google and Verizon manufactured hype machine, the Antenna Gate hype completely fell apart! The rest of the world's Cell phone markets simply could not duplicate the issue. Absent AT&T's already flakey network, the iPhone4 performed as advertised. In fact, as of November, the "flawed antenna" iPhone4 now commands 72% of the smartphone market in Japan!
When the iPhone4 was released in those markets the reviewers COULD NOT DUPLICATE the problem. They, almost to a man, claimed the Americans were wrong! Strangely, the issue disappeared almost overnight in the American press as well as more and more glowing foreign reviews came in WITHOUT claims of reception and antenna problems. Gee, what happened? Apple changed nothing about the phone. The only thing that was different was the FUD hype engine got turned off... It was too expensive and unnecessary to run in too many markets where the Android phones were not yet being released.
You asked for "first hand experience" to refute these claims, I offer that I have no over thirty friends and family with iPhone4s and ONLY ONE has experienced reception issues and she lives in the boonies, and had worse problems with her iPhone 3Gs. NONE of us can duplicate the attenuation problems to the degree we drop any calls. Independent tests done by competent signal engineers who tested the iPhone4, not the amateurs at Consumers Reports who had NEVER done such tests before and had no clue how to do it, found the iPhone4, got BETTER reception than it's predecessors. I have posted the certified results on here, along with their critiques of the CU tests.
On September 30th, Apple ended the free case program band-aid it had to put on the scratch it got from the FUD attack in the US. Sales of iPhone4s went up.
So much for "antenna gate." it was and is FUD.
Secondly, Apples main stratagem has been to market to the technically challenged. If you can’t see this, it is because you take exception, or feel insulted that by using an apple, you are lumped into that category. This thread is not about emotion, where many apple posts go, it is about the closed end proprietary method that the author is touting as a strength, when that very thinking, for all practical purposes, put Apple out of business for over a decade.
Again, you ASSUME something not based in fact. When, exactly was Apple "out of business for over a decade?" are you talking about the period before the return of Steve Jobs 13 years ago? You assume that a system based on open source UNIX and open standards is somehow "closed end" and "proprietary" yet Microsoft's reliance on proprietary licensed file systems and proprietary DRM Systems is not? The thinking that you claim and denigrate as merely "marketing to the technically challenged" is what has made Apple the largest and most successful tech company in the World... By making products that are easy to use yet still very powerful AND still give access to industrial strength hardware and abilities just under the surface for any geek to tweak as needed... Along with providing best in the world tech support.
As to marketing to the Eco friendly, that's what's expected these days. So you found ONE PAGE on their website about it. You'll also find them giving lip service in their store ads. BUT you won't see big TV ads showing vistas of blue skies and babbling brooks with bunny rabbits leaping in their ads with no sign of their products anywhere to be seen. The ecology push is merely an addenda. Not a PUSH. It's an afterthought. The icing on the cake of their well thought out product mix, not the marketing thrust.
I do agree that Apple HAS performed like a start up, but the trend this year, and the product line for the next year, leads myself, and those who invest into the product to be gun-shy about further investments, thinking there are other options that will play out stronger. Of course, there are always analysts on both sides of the isle, but as an investor, and not a fanboi, I have to wade through and sort out the propaganda from the fact, and base my decisions on ROI, not on what feels good.
As far as becoming the number 1 tech company... Texas Instruments also held that title for 3x the period that Apple has, and they didn’t have the benefit of the Inventor of the Internet, Al Gore on their board.
Forgive me, but you apparently seem to fall for the propaganda and the hype without really digging for the facts underlying the stories. Your research is seriously flawed and out of date. I disagree that TI ever held the number 1 tech position, as I believe IBM was probably in that slot during TIs biggest heyday. Your last point about Gore being on Apple's board is twaddle and has nothing to do with reality and certainly nothing to do with making serious investing decisions, although during his tenure on the BoD, Apple's stock has more than quintupled in value. It's a non sequitor. In fact most of your conclusions about Apple are based on myth and simply do not follow... and are apparently much more based on emotion than a fanboi's; making your opinions those of an anti-fanboi.
You dismiss me with the claim I don't read much. . . or spend time on college campuses. To the latter, I will plead guilty. I got my degrees in Finance and Economics over 40 years ago... and my time has been spent using them, managing businesses, and reading. Lots of reading. What little time I spent back on campuses was spent guest lecturing. I wager I've read a LOT more about Apple and other tech companies than have you.
Look, I understand. You and your alternate monikers have thoroughly convinced me. I have capitulated more than once, and have thrown in the towel.
It is not good enough for someone to not like a product, you will brow beat them into submission. So, I’ve submitted, but yet you continue to beat this dead horse.
So, I will outline to you, my submission, and I advise anyone who disagrees with you on the threads here, that they too sign the submission, in hopes that they are not harassed or harangued for days on end.
Here goes:
1) Apple is the greatest company that has ever existed in the history of the world.
2) Apple products are now, have always been, and always will be, the greatest products ever created.
3) Apple has never made a mistake in the history of its existence.
4) Apples strength lies in its proprietary control, yet, it is not proprietary, and actually more open than a PC, so that is also its strength.
5) Apple is cheaper than a PC.
6) Even an Apple II+ from 1984 is faster than the most up recent Intel chip-set in a PC.
7) Big Blue is actually an Apple IIc with a big blue box around it.
8) The iPhone is better than anything that will ever come around, and anyone who disagrees is a moron.
9) Every story that degrades Apple is a lie.
10) Every story that promotes Apple is understated.
11) Al Gore on the BoD of Apple is irrelevant (unless you want it to be relevant, then it is).
12) Apple does not promote themselves as green (unless you want them to be green, then they are green)
13) Apple runs MS programs better than MS based machines.
14) Even when Apple had less than 1% of the market, they secretly had 90% of the market. Those who disagree are “deniers”.
15) The Droid was developed by Apple, just for fun, and will have no impact on Apple.
16) Apple cannot be harmed by any virus or malware, even if you download constant porn or run malicious software. There is no need for anti-virus or firewalls, because Apple is that solid.
17) Steve Jobs can kick Chuck Norris ass.
18) Everything Apple has done since day one, has been “part of the plan”, but since Apple doesn’t use committees, or think tanks, it has all just been off the top of Steve Jobs head. Even his firing was part of “the plan”, so when he came back, the stock price would soar even more!
19) Apple is NOT the preferred computer of gays, hippies and liberals (unless you are a gay, hippy or liberal, in which case it is).
20) Apple has never attempted to force folks into the iTunes store. That is a big lie.
21) Apple products work just fine with a PC, in fact, they work so well, they make a PC run better.
22) It is just as easy to change the speakers on an Apple as it is a PC. That goes for the graphics card, and hard drive as well. Oh, and it’s cheaper, and you have more to choose from.
23) The one button mouse is brilliant.
24) Since Apple never makes mistakes, the long term deal to make AT&T the sole provider was brilliant as well. Those who disagree, are just too dumb to understand the calculations of Mr. Jobs.
25) On the 7th day, God created Apple.
I hope that sums up where all of us who were not so thrilled with Apple previously have gone wrong. I doubt this will curb your 20+ daily posts about how great Apple is, I have to wonder if you are paid by the word or by the posting?
But, to further acknowledge my misdirected past, and to show penance, I further propose the following:
a) All PC’s be confiscated by the government.
b) Since we can force everyone to buy health-care for the good of the nation, we should also force everyone to own an Apple.
c) The first day of every month shall be known as Appleday.
d) Since Apple promotes secularism, Christmas will now be known as Steve Jobs Birth Celebration Week.
e) To celebrate the repeal of DADT, every serviceman will be given an Apple in his favorite color.
f) Those who continue to favor a PC over an Apple, will be tied down to an iChair and beaten with an iClub until they come to their iSenses.
g) As Apple is the greatest company in American History, Steve Jobs will now be appointed as the Technology Czar for Life.
h) Games and applications that don’t run on an Apple, will be outlawed, as they have no place in the New iWorld. There is no need for such things.
Hope I didn’t miss anything. Perhaps you can finally see that you have convinced me, that Apple is greater than even God, Country or Pie (Apple Pie of course).
You win.
And again, I suggest anyone who has a disagreement as to the greatness of Apple, go ahead and try and make a point, try and voice your like of a PC over Apple, and after the 5th day of getting harassed, just sign the above document and submit it. Maybe Swordmaker and his alias accounts will leave you alone.
But I doubt it.
Got it. You are one who REFUSES to look at facts... a new low... Live in your ignorance, esoxmagnum. We have NOT harassed you, we have corrected your mis-information you have been spouting with the facts. You have merely returned to spout MORE myths and mis-information ex cathedra.
In case you missed it, you ARE in violation of Jim Robinson’s edict against attempting to start a flame war. Your attempt at humor is juvenile.
I am NOT Reignoferror, nor do I have multiple accounts... YOU are just one who happens to be in the wrong with a lot of ignorance about what you really demonstrate you know nothing... in spades. You insultingly attempt to spout it as if you are an expert to people WHO ARE EXPERTS and WHO DO USE IT DAILY ... and you tell us we are not doing what we ARE DOING. Then you act aggrieved because when people tell you you’re wrong! That YOU don’t know what you are talking about. And You tell US we don’t know what we are talking about and that we are deluded. And you belittle us... with claims of “not reading” or you erect insulting “strawman arguments” such as this entire post for you to shoot down...
Keep it up and you will be slapped down every time. You are simply outnumbered on these threads. You refuse even to believe that FACT, attributing others to being ME.
There are over 500 of your fellow freepers who use Macs that you are insulting with your posts... You might want to think about that number the next time before you hit that Post button and put your drivel up publicly.
I did look at the facts, and acknowledged them exactly as you stated.
Like I said you were right on everything you said, you always are, and I capitulated.
I agree with everything you say, and I have stated so, yet you continue to harass me.
You win. I’ve said it now... what 7 times? Yet you continue to attempt to push my buttons.
I am currently burning my PC and will find a different line of work, where I can use Apple products to do my job. I will tell my kids, they cannot play the latest PC games, because PC’s are no longer allowed in our home. From now on, its all Apple all the time!
My G’zone phone? I’m scrapping it. No matter it can be submerged under 30 feet of water for a half hour. No matter that it has been dropped several stories and still works, no matter that it works 30 feet below ground, it is not an iPhone so it must be eradicated! I must learn to use music and fancy screen savers, my job be damned! iPhone is all that will be allowed! My sons Droid? I will punish him for daring to use all those fancy apps that he uses for FREE! He MUST USE APPLE! All HAIL APPLE! ALL HAIL AL GORE! ALL HAIL STEVE JOBS!
You win. Now, leave me alone.
You want to be left alone? I told you how. Quit posting twaddle on Apple oriented threads. Quit posting attempts to start flame wars. Quit posting this kind of AD HOMINEM CRAP!
YOU are the harasser, not us.
Don't bother to respond, esoxmagnum.
I have criticized Apple several times, and Swordmaker has never jumped on me. With some things he had to agree, and with others we had reasonable discussion. We also are on opposite sides of some core issues regarding Apple, with me not being on Apple's side. It's the difference between informed criticism and ignorant trolling. He does not respond well to the latter.
First off, to both of you and your love fest for Apple. My threads began in earnest to explain why our family uses both products. My early posts explained that the Apple products do not work for me.
I was attacked. I was told I was a moron and uninformed.
I outlined why they did not work, and was told “bullshit”, you just don’t know what your doing.
I further explained how I saw Apple being marketed and was told again, Bullshit.
I then checked the posting history of this guy Swordmaker, and saw page after page of attacks on those who disagree that Apple is not the Bees Knees.
Now, when I get into these types of discussions, whether they are with Gay Activists, PETA types, Palin haters, or Apple Zealous, I know that common sense is not going to prevail.
I pointed to problems with apple, documented by hundreds of articles, and it is dismissed as FUD. As a matter of fact, it is almost a give-me, that anyone who points out anything bad about Apple, Swordmaker claims it is FUD in his numerous defensive posts according to his posting history.
This is the sign of a zealot. It is also in his posting history, common for him to scream that he is being picked on or trolled on, by those who disagree with him. This is the tactic of the left. This is the tactic of those who don’t want to debate, but rather those who want to preach to a choir, and want everyone else to shut up.
I explained my wife loves her apple products, but they were not for me. That was not enough. So, in an effort to end this dumassery, I gave him what he wanted, a complete statement as to the greatness of Apple. The problem is, he was insulted by that as well. You see, he wants to debate about apple, talk about it, but not be made fun of, and he wants no light to shine on his absolute love and adulation for Jobs and Gore.
Now, I will outline further, above and beyond, why most folks here don’t like Apple. You say there are 500 apple users that I offend? Guess what, there are thousands of conservatives here that Apple offends, and maybe you are on the wrong forum, pimping your Gay loving, left leaning products, made by child labor in foreign countries.
You think I am going against Jim Robs policy against starting flame wars? Take a look at his recent policy of promoting the homo agenda. Apple is front and center in that. Don’t dismiss it as “oh, its not apple, its the employees”. Employees cannot use their companies name without the express consent of that company. Apple pushed very hard in CA to push the homo agenda, and they are the most liberal of the PC makers, and are noted as the 2nd most liberal company in the United States. Stick that in your pipe and smoke it.
http://forums.macnn.com/89/macnn-lounge/412022/apple-second-most-liberal-us-corporation/
Apple continually disallowed conservative apps, while approving and pushing liberal apps:
http://forums.macnn.com/89/macnn-lounge/412022/apple-second-most-liberal-us-corporation/
The use of foreign child labor is also a point that I do not like, but Apple defends it.
http://bungalowbillscw.blogspot.com/2010/02/are-liberal-mac-apple-ipod-and-apple.html
Lets get back to their donation policy. Mind you, I don’t support microsoft either, but we are talking about Computers. This is why I like PC, I can build them how I want, buy from who I want, and what I want stick it in. Apple is a computer maker, Microsoft is an operating system maker. Neither I, nor Michael Reagan, nor Rush agree with Apples political stance, nor would most on this forum as well, I am sure:
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/08/03/michael_reagan/
The democrats on iTunes
http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/the-democrats/id376405891?mt=8
See, that is allowed, but this isnt:
http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/technology/2010/12/apple-removes-anti-gay-and-anti-abortion-app.html
Nope, no way Apple will let you be anti-Gay or pro-Choice. Wonderful isn’t it?
Its just not Big Al, it’s the whole company.
Here is what I think about Apple and their marketing:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JixbzFjv_cU
Now, lets get on to the meat, which is where our arguments began. First this Swordmaker claims that Apple does not target the technically challenged. Really? What about these commercials where they target folks who can’t even plug in a mouse?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Tq7yykR-DM&feature=channel
And as far as not targeting the enviro-weenies, oh no, they don’t do that either.... Feast your eyes:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZhuSJ6RSNrw
Here, they tout themselves as the GREENEST of notebooks:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AqJl6huz4y0&feature=related
Lets move on to their actual products. First, everything they release, originally, sucks. I think it is their marketing strategy to release sucky products. Every first version sucks. The original iphone, no Nav, couldn’t even take movies. Well, I guess you can keep buying iPhones until they get up to speed at the cost of a thousand bucks a year.
The first music storage devices? My daughter had one of the originals, it would not work with our PC’s, we could NOT transfer our existing music to it, unless we had the rights to it. Which means all those CD’s we bought in the 80’s were junk.
Oh, yes, apple changes, eventually. Even their Macintosh and desktops couldn’t communicate with each other at one time. Remember that?
As far as graphics and processing. I remember all the Apple heads talking about how the Intel chipsets sucked, and Apple had a far superior product. Test after test showed different results. So what did Apple do? They went with Intel.
Remember how all of Microsoft products sucked to the Apple-bots? Guess what Apple did, they made a deal with Gates to supply the office portion to Apple, because it was far superior.
Remember how only apple peripherals would work with Apple? The Apple bots LOVED that, but no one else did. Now, USB works some of the time. But you are still taking a chance on some of the digital cameras and music PDA’s and phones working with Apple. But they all work for PC.
How about that 1 button mouse that Apple insisted for years was the BEST! People hated it. Now you can get a normal mouse.
So, it seems that the better Apple becomes, the more like a PC they become. The better they get, the less like Apple they are. Well, except for that hefty price tag, and except for their constant push of liberal agenda.
So, again, tell me why I.. yes ME... should buy an Apple and what benefit I would get from it?
My wifes Apple is problematic, it has trouble hooking up to our Linxys Win 7 network, it has trouble using our HP printers, and it acts like a total ass when trying to file share with our homegroups. It was to the point, that the locking up of the computer (of which no one at Apple could tell us how to figure out how to trace what was freezing up the computer) was due to using a HP printer on our network. We had to segregate, and yes, USB... not wireless... USB cable a dedicated with an APPLE COMPLIANT printer. So much for integration... eh?
Now, lets get on to the price thing. Two years ago, my son built his own PC. He did it for around $800 bucks, mostly from NewEgg, his liquid cooling system he got at a PC swap meet. Quad Core, blazing fast. Reason he built it? For games. More power to him. Not Xbox games, MMORPG games, where speed is of the utmost importance.
Why did he build his own? Because we won’t buy him that stuff, the money comes from his job delivering papers, and shoveling snow. Plus, he got credit for a boyscout badge. And, its what kids should do. He priced out all manner of computers, PC’s and Apples. First, he disqualified Apple because the games he and all his classmates play, would not work on Apple. Yes, he tried on Moms Apple, but it froze up and lagged horribly. Gamers who play those types of games know, you don’t use Apple apparently.
He priced the system he was building at Dell. Around 4grand. He priced the Alienware one. He didn’t trust HP, so he built his own. He did it for about 800 bucks. No monitor, he had a 26” monitor already, and he had super sound / surround sound speakers. He used his old sound card, he used his old hard drive, whatever he could. He did it for around 800 bucks. He waited till his Radeon card was on sale at Newegg, that was the longest wait, and picked up the chipset and motherboard in Rosemont Illinois at the computer convention for about 1/4 the price it was retailing for.
Can you do that on an Apple? I doubt it. The case was built by dad in the sheet metal shop (me), and it was custom done, to be LARGE, so it could fit his liquid cooling, 2 fans, and 8 expansion slots. Cost for me to build that case? Probably 20 bucks. We had a guy down the street paint it black in his auto body shop. He donated the time and paint.
Now, I see that over the last year, Apple has made some changes. They are progressing towards being able to do that. I see you can mix and match parts. Like I said, they are becoming more and more like a PC. As soon as they become a PC, they will become a good product. But why wait. Why not just buy a PC?
So, there you have it, I think technically, they are always behind the 8 ball, I think politically, they suck, I think they market to the left, they support the left, they are expensive, and I personally don’t like them.
I have heard Ben and Jerry’s makes good ice cream, but I won’t buy it, when there are other brands out there that don’t lean so far left.
So, if I am starting a flame war, by disagreeing with Apple, their pro-homo, anti-Life, and all around leftist green bullshit policies, report me, and lets see how that all works out for you.
I am also against the recent push to get every military man an Apple. Its bullshit. It amounts to rewarding Apple like the unions. Spend the money on Body Armor, not frickin iphones.
Also, stop spouting off how great Apples market share is and comparing them to Microsoft. Microsoft makes an operating system, Apple makes computers. A fair analogy would be to count all the PC’s made and sold in the world, and compare THAT number to the number of Apples sold. I would be impressed if Apple hit the 3% mark, but I am just speculating here.
As far as Apple taking over Microsoft in sales, why are we comparing the sales of a software manufacturer with that of a computer manufacturer? Are the Gay Loving, Left Leaning Apple-bots that desperate?
You can ping whoever you want to call into this discussion, as I see when you get frustrated, you start calling in the recruits to circle the wagons.
No, I’m sorry, I won’t support Apple and their left, gay, anti-life, Al Gore, Steve Jobs, gub’mint welfare, crap technology, but, you do whatever you want. I am just suggesting you may be on the wrong forum to do so.
I did not call you a moron. Name-calling bores me. I gave you the benefit of the doubt that you are misinformed, because the alternative is that you're lying.
You are spinning off in a hundred different directions. My only argument with you has been your criticisms of the Mac that are factually inaccurate. You're still at that, I see.
The first music storage devices? My daughter had one of the originals, it would not work with our PC’s, we could NOT transfer our existing music to it, unless we had the rights to it. Which means all those CD’s we bought in the 80’s were junk.
The first-generation iPod was Mac-only. The second generation was Windows or Mac compatible, but had only a Firewire interface. If you did not have a Mac, or you did not have a Firewire port, then buying an iPod was an astonishing lapse in research.
Assuming you had a Mac to connect it to, your "unless we had the rights to it" is simply a crock. Every iPod ever made will play standard MP3 files. Every version of iTunes ever released has been able to rip CDs. The iTunes store did not even exist until the 3rd-generation iPod, in April 2003.
Even their Macintosh and desktops couldn’t communicate with each other at one time. Remember that?
No idea what you're talking about. The very first Mac had LocalTalk networking out of the box.
As far as graphics and processing. I remember all the Apple heads talking about how the Intel chipsets sucked, and Apple had a far superior product. Test after test showed different results. So what did Apple do? They went with Intel.
PowerPC chips were, when adopted and for some years thereafter, faster than Intel's Pentium. Motorola and IBM failed to keep up with Intel, so Apple switched. That's been the pattern for Apple -- they develop their own technology when needed, and switch to off-the-shelf solutions when they catch up.
Remember how all of Microsoft products sucked to the Apple-bots? Guess what Apple did, they made a deal with Gates to supply the office portion to Apple, because it was far superior.
Microsoft was working with Apple before the Mac launched. Word for Mac was released in 1985, and was a popular title on Mac when it trailed far behind WordPerfect on DOS.
Remember how only apple peripherals would work with Apple?
I remember that claim. It wasn't true.
The Apple bots LOVED that, but no one else did. Now, USB works some of the time. But you are still taking a chance on some of the digital cameras and music PDA’s and phones working with Apple. But they all work for PC.
Any peripheral requires that the manufacturer write drivers or use standard ones. You'd have to dig pretty far into the bargain bucket to find a camera, MP3 player or phone that won't work with a Mac.
How about that 1 button mouse that Apple insisted for years was the BEST! People hated it. Now you can get a normal mouse.
For suitably broad versions of "now." I had a three-button mouse for Mac in 1989.
Now, I see that over the last year, Apple has made some changes. They are progressing towards being able to do that. I see you can mix and match parts.
For values of "over the last year" that reach back to 1997, when Apple started offering build-to-order G3 Macs. Just because you have recently discovered something does not make it new.
“The first-generation iPod was Mac-only. The second generation was Windows or Mac compatible, but had only a Firewire interface. If you did not have a Mac, or you did not have a Firewire port, then buying an iPod was an astonishing lapse in research. “
It was an iPod Shuffle. I had to ask my wife. JUNK. Pure junk, just like most Apple products. Made for the technically challenged, marketed towards the technically challenged. We thought it would be good for an 8 year old because of that. We were wrong. We could not use our CD’s, because we were directed instantly to the Apple store to buy the rights of those songs. Not only that, but the damn thing kept installing some apple media player on our PC, which would cause our PC all sorts of problems.
Were we mis-informed? Maybe, but after contacting Apple, we were told by THEM that we had to buy the usage rights. We were also told we HAD to have the apple media player, and had to register with the itunes store for it to work. We did not want apple fishing around and gathering information on song library. Screw them. Goodbye Apple product, Hello Zen for the 8 year old.
If I was misinformed, it was from your Gay Loving, Liberal Loving Apple company. Take it up with them, and stop lying on the forums.
“No idea what you’re talking about. The very first Mac had LocalTalk networking out of the box. “
The Apple II series could not work with the original Macintosh, so the III series was made to allow schools to transition. This hurt Apple badly, as they had the schools all locked up. What universities found, was that HS kids going from the II series to the College level macintosh, knew nothing, and had to start from scratch. You couldn’t take that IIc pizza box you bought and use it with your macintosh. You had to upgrade to the IIe card.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_IIe_Card
Once again, brilliant move Apple. Brilliant. So glad they are the top dog.... NOT.
“PowerPC chips were, when adopted and for some years thereafter, faster than Intel’s Pentium. Motorola and IBM failed to keep up with Intel, so Apple switched. That’s been the pattern for Apple — they develop their own technology when needed, and switch to off-the-shelf solutions when they catch up. “
Every time Apple made statements on speed, it was shot down. HARD. Embarrassingly hard. So hard in fact, it became a joke on the internet. They were even claiming that their single core processors were faster than the dual cores and overclocked processors that were dominating the market. It was laughable. I think it became so laughable, that Apple even recognized they were becoming the joke of the neighborhood. While they were talking speed, off-brand PC makers were capturing the gaming market, and running circles around them.
Yes, Apple at one time, under the right conditions (no TSR programs) could out run a PC, but once overclocking and multi-core technology became the mainstream and every 13 year old was overclocking their rig, Apple was left looking like grandpa in his Studebaker, while the cool kids were doing laps around him in their Mustangs.
Develop their own technology? What technology is that? They don’t even use their own OS anymore do thy? They have jumped to outside sources for their OS, their sound, their video, their storage, and just about everything else. Heck, even Microsoft is doing their dirty work. So tell me again, why do I want an Apple?
The only reason I ever hear anyone suggest to buy an Apple is “it works”. Guess what, PC’s work too. They work great, and Apples freeze up too, and have issues. But I’m not shelling out an extra grand for there to be some sort safety net that allows me to plug in a mouse without frying my system. That stuff is for Granny, and the technically challenged.
“Remember how only apple peripherals would work with Apple?
I remember that claim. It wasn’t true. “
Wow, how was I going to jam my 86 bit cards into them apples? How as I going to jam my soundblaster card into the apple? With Steve Jobs magic? How as I going to plug my 3 button trackball into the apple? Oh, they can do those things now, but not then. Stop Lying. Your a liar. You make shit up. YOU ARE FUD, and you support and pimp the 2nd most liberal company in the United States, who loves Gays, and hates Pro-Lifers. You don’t just do it casually, YOU DO IT EVERY DAY, it is all you post.
“Any peripheral requires that the manufacturer write drivers or use standard ones. You’d have to dig pretty far into the bargain bucket to find a camera, MP3 player or phone that won’t work with a Mac. “
Maybe today, I don’t know, I know last year, our Kodak camera wouldn’t work, I know our Zen wouldn’t work. Oh yeah, that’s Apples philosophy, make shit that doesn’t work, then remake it when people complain enough, then say “your wrong... see it does work????” How about making it work the first time? Not on the 4th or 5th generation product.
“For values of “over the last year” that reach back to 1997, when Apple started offering build-to-order G3 Macs. Just because you have recently discovered something does not make it new.”
I’m not talking about built to order, I’m talking about the ability to build your own, mix and match parts, scavenge what you need, and do a project that works, at a cheap price. Apple has never been able to do that.
Oh, and instead of cherry picking what you think you might win a battle on, lets address the rest of the post. I want to see you show me how much you love their Gay agenda, and how much you love their anti-life agenda. I’m just itchin to report you for pimpin this liberal company day after day buster. I’m just itchin...
And that goes for your ring of rodeo clowns that come running to your rescue every time you ping them.
lets see what the mods and Jim Rob have to think about your constant push for the 2nd most liberal company in America, because quite frankly, conservatives like myself get sick of seeing your Gay lovefest of Apple, Jobs and AlGore being tossed around all over day after day, like pamphlets at a Pride rally.
And I posted this at you and swordmaker, because I think you are the same person. I haven’t been able to distinguish one of you from the other.
So, when you argue back that you “don’t post all day about apple”, I’m not convinced you and he are not one in the same.
And as far as not targeting the enviro-weenies, oh no, they don’t do that either.... ... Here, they tout themselves as the GREENEST of notebooks:
That was a reaction to Greenpeace. Greenpeace was continually trashing Apple in the press over supposedly poor environmental practices. This was mainly because Apple wasn't bragging about anything environmental while all the PC OEMs paid a lot of lip service and wrote a lot of BS to Greenpeace. Apple finally succumbed to the pressure, publicizing the environmentally friendly aspects of their products.
"Apple has been criticized by some environmental organizations for not being a leader in removing toxic chemicals from its new products, and for not aggressively or properly recycling its old products. ... It is generally not Apple’s policy to trumpet our plans for the future; we tend to talk about the things we have just accomplished. Unfortunately this policy has left our customers, shareholders, employees and the industry in the dark ... So today we’re changing our policy." -- Steve JobsFirst, everything they release, originally, sucks.
There was an article on this a while back about how Apple operates like a startup, which is what gives the flexibility often lost by large corporations. For these products, Apple is more interested in getting the idea out there first to see if it catches on. If it does, then Apple can shift engineering resources to the project to make it better. Apple doesn't highly staff all of the teams, so people are shifted around like this as needed. Given Apple's objectively huge level of market-changing success, I think it's working.
The first music storage devices? My daughter had one of the originals, it would not work with our PC’s
Duh, the first iPods were Mac-only. I don't buy PC-only products for my Mac, and I don't buy Mac-only products for my PC. What a concept.
Guess what Apple did, they made a deal with Gates to supply the office portion to Apple, because it was far superior.<>/i
Faulty history, MS Word first went WYSIWYG on the Mac in 1985 and from then on reigned as the preferred word processor for the Mac. Before that it was by no means a superior DOS product. It didn't even hit Windows until years later.
I remember all the Apple heads talking about how the Intel chipsets sucked, and Apple had a far superior product. Test after test showed different results. So what did Apple do? They went with Intel.
Very simplistic. For one, the x86 architecture does suck, and the PowerPC architecture is far better, not as tied to the past. The x86 is literally just a set of extensions on the 8-bit 8080 from the 1970s. In contrast the PowerPC has its history in IBM's effort to make the highest performance chip possible, resulting in the POWER processor for the RS/6000 server in 1990. It was even designed from the beginning to support 64-bit.
But that is merely theoretical in the face of business realities. The other fact is that at times the PowerPC in Macs was far more powerful than the fastest PCs. This was especially true in the late Pentium III and early Pentium 4 era. Then it became a lot slower as Moto/IBM refused to put resources into making the PPC line faster. Then the PPC was faster again with the 970, but again IBM refused to put in the resources to make it faster, and it ran way too hot for Jobs' portable view of the future (for a while Apple was the only major OEM to have liquid cooling in the G5). PPC was no longer an attractive option. Apple's suppliers simply didn't want to put the money into R&D when selling only Apple's numbers. Intel was killing them on economy of scale.
The kicker was Intel dropping the horrendously inefficient Pentium 4 architecture, going to more efficient Core line. That is what Apple switched to. And now that Apple is using the x64 architecture (much better than x86) and is not using the BIOS (that piece of 16-bit 80s tech in your PC), things are pretty sweet. However, notice the large concentration in the highly efficient ARM architecture lately.
I think politically, they suck, I think they market to the left, they support the left,
Go ahead, buy Microsoft, support Planned Parenthood. Yep, Bill Gates is a big lefty too, and loves to give generously to lefty causes. Most of Silicon Valley fought against Proposition 8. If you avoid tech companies because of politics, you'll be living in the stone age.
My point is that it's okay to criticize. But it helps if you have your facts straight first so it doesn't look like you're going on an ignorant rant.
Esoxmagnum IS going on repeated ignorant rants, and has demonstrated his total belief in the MYTHS and revisionist history he has bought into and prefers to live in denial of the facts those of us who really KNOW the facts are trying to provide for him. Instead he calls us deluded liars. . . and then he proceeds to pile on more of his mis-information and ignorance. I don't think he really knows how foolish it makes him appear. It's sad.
Please link to the post where you were told you were a "moron."
I outlined why they did not work, and was told “bullshit”, you just don’t know what your doing.
I further explained how I saw Apple being marketed and was told again, Bullshit.
Link also to the reply where ANYONE used the term "bullshit" in reference to what you said about how Apple computers worked or how Apple went about doing their marketing. I disagreed with you and gave you reasons and evidence.
I again accuse you of raising straw man arguments based on your myths and ignorance to shoot down. The rest of your post is just more of the same tactics. They are not worth my time to refute for the umpteenth time.
“Go ahead, buy Microsoft”
Microsoft is in your lovely Mac.
And maybe I’m slow on the uptake, but Microsoft is not a computer maker.
Thats the great thing about PC’s. You can run whatever you want in them.
Tell me again why Mac is superior to PC?
“Faulty history, MS Word first went WYSIWYG on the Mac in 1985 and from then on reigned as the preferred word processor for the Mac. Before that it was by no means a superior DOS product. It didn’t even hit Windows until years later.”
From 1997 MacExpo
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Apple_Inc.
“If we want to move forward and see Apple healthy and prospering again, we have to let go of a few things here. We have to let go of this notion that for Apple to win, Microsoft has to lose. We have to embrace a notion that for Apple to win, Apple has to do a really good job. And if others are going to help us that’s great, because we need all the help we can get, and if we screw up and we don’t do a good job, it’s not somebody else’s fault, it’s our fault. So I think that is a very important perspective. If we want Microsoft Office on the Mac, we better treat the company that puts it out with a little bit of gratitude; we like their software. “
“Duh, the first iPods were Mac-only. I don’t buy PC-only products for my Mac, and I don’t buy Mac-only products for my PC. What a concept.”
The Shuffle was sold as PC compatible. Problem was, you were forced to enroll in all of Apples spy crap, forced to register all of your current content, and were manged into the iTunes store. Yes, you could disable this... EVERYTIME you plugged in your device, but then it would force you to reinstall the stuff again, if your device was plugged in. Typical Apple nonsense.
“Bill Gates is a big lefty too”
Yup, but Microsoft is not listed as the 2nd most liberal company in the United States, and once again, Microsoft doesn’t make PC’s. In any event, two wrongs don’t make a right. Comparing your favorite company with another company to justify its actions is a bit over the top.
Incidentally, esox, that claim is TOTALLY FALSE! You jumped to a FUD conclusion! Apple was the only US company to audit employment conditions at it's contractors in China and included the prohibition of child labor in it's standard contracts... And the article you linked was an article written in response to Apple's action they took against one of their subcontractors they found in violation of their contract who WAS using underage workers in violation of Apple's contract with them! Apple was NOT defending the use of child labor; they were spearheading the international effort against it.
Again you are wrong! Even the comments on your link criticized the misrepresentations and pointed out that Apple had done the audit itself! Try reading and researching a bit more deeply before you assign blame.
Following Apple's example and lead, more and more US companies are incorporating workers' rights in their contract requirements.
If being a conservative is foolish, I’m guilty as charged.
Myths? I’ve backed them up.
You? You’ve indicated you have all this inside knowledge that disputes what is widely reported. You accuse me of being “in denial of the facts those of us who really KNOW the facts”. How do you really KNOW these facts I’ve outlined to be false? What are your credentials? Everyone out there must be wrong. Lets use your favorite word, they are all FUD correct?
I outlined in my sarcasm post what you wanted to hear. That in a nutshell is your argument, and the argument of every Appleboy out there.
They put out a crap product, it takes them several years to get the product working, and they exist only by their fanboi base, and by misleading the public with slick marketing and by targeting granny and the technically challenged. Oh.. a dentist office uses Apple products? WOOHOO! They save files and stuff? Wow, Apple has come a long way. Remember when they didn’t even offer internal Hard Drives and PC’s did? Genius, pure genius. Remember that whole Corvus thing? Yeah, that was the FUTURE!
The ONLY thing Apple has ever done to increase their market share, is to watch what other innovators were doing, and then spend mass cash to copy it. They then push their product out, unfinished, in order to say they were first. Apple is notorious for doing this, and most folks with common sense realize it is for legal purpose. Even Europeans are not playing those games anymore. They get away with it here, because of their politics.
Why is apple growing? Well, is it coincidence they are the No.2 Liberal company in America, and are now the no 2 company in America? Is Apple growing that much, in terms of real hard growth, or is the rest of American companies just dying? Also, marketing. Apple markets to those who cannot plug in a monitor. Guess what the fastest growing segment of our population is? Boomers. Old people. People who can’t plug in a monitor.
You would be hard pressed to find a 14 year boy old who would be gleeful for an Apple Computer under their tree. An iPhone? Probably, but that’s what kids use. They would be just as happy with an Android, I assure you, but as long as mom & dad are buying, I’m sure an iPhone would work. Ask them how they would spend their money? I’d bet it wouldn’t be the hefty tag of Apple unless they had well-to-do parents.
And once again, if not falling in love with your gay company makes me foolish, I’m guilty.
Sorry, no rainbow colored apples for me.
Apple is a bubble, like the .com bubble, and like the housing bubble. FUD? Apple is mostly propped up by its fanboi base, and not the facts. Apple over promises time and time again (even Cavuto has criticized them for this), but the fanbois are still there.
Any other company would have been out of business. They are like Lucy and Charlie Brown with the football. But I guess as long as there are women like my wife who want a cute little computer in their kitchen, aging boomers who think Apple has better “gigabytes and wi-fies”, and soccer moms who believe it is a sign of prosperity to own the latest iGadget, Apple will continue. But eventually, people move on, fads die. I suspect like all fads, Apple users will wise up and move on.
The great thing about the new Apple products is the portability. Maybe now the Boomers will be able to take the Apple products to their nursing homes with them to listen to the latest “hits of the 60’s”.
Once again, they manufacture pure rubbish, their politcs are even more rubbish, and you pimping them almost daily indicates your love for both.
Yet I appear foolish? Only on DU would I appear foolish.
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