Posted on 08/17/2016 5:02:55 AM PDT by MeneMeneTekelUpharsin
People at work were talking about getting to work and back home the other day. In the conversation, they mentioned the toll roads in Austin, Texas and the cost thereof. I was in shock. The amount per month spent on toll roads for people ranged from $300-600 per MONTH. Then it hit me!
The poor can not afford to pay those charges. So, the regular roads in Austin are in bumper-to-bumper traffic overload. The well-to-do go to and fro with great convenience while the lower classes suffer pretty badly with some having a 2-hour trip EACH WAY from home to work. This for some reason smacks of discrimination. I'm not big on playing the discrimination card, but it seems that people are taxed to death over everything, including roads, and then have to pay an exorbitant price AGAIN to be able to get to work to make some money to pay the taxes. Something just doesn't seem right about the whole thing.
I do not use the toll roads since I don’t drive enough in Austin to use them. Just giving my 2 cents worth.
On what was public land or land obtained for the private entity through condemnation.
New toll concept around DC. Toll lanes that adjust the cost based on the amount of traffic. The more traffic the higher the toll lanes cost. The theory is that at any price point people will drop out and the toll lanes will keep moving despite the high traffic on the “free” lanes. It’s up to you, how much is your time worth? Pure economics at work. The price is real low when traffic volume is low. It’s the time value of money.
Foreign Company Now Owns Six Major US Tolls Roads
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It would be interesting to see numbers of how much of the USA is owned/operated
by foreign companies. Investors move around the world in an effort to make a dollar.
Austin sounds like Denver and their toll road stuff.
Good point.
Best to stay out of the lib hell hole and save that $600. The once every two years I have no choice but to go to Austin, I stay clear of those evil tolls.
This is not bringing "efficiencies" of private business to the government sector, which is a all a big myth anyway. To the extent that private business is efficient it is driven their by profit motives and the competition of the free market. There is no competition in monopolies government monopolies granted to private companies except the initial sale price (the cost of lobbying and paying off politicians and officials).
With a monopoly the profit incentive is to drive up the cost to the user. Now suppose the terms of the charter are fixed profit on revenue - then the incentive is to drive up revenue - i.e. costs on the user. Efficient use of resources has nothing to do with this.
Like privately operated prisons - the incentive is to maximize prisoners x costs per prisoner. Those are not public goals.
Our founders, our constitution is built on the basis of the recognition that there are public goods that belong to everyone, and the government is there for the people.
I cannot believe that this kind of a diatribe is necessary against anyone on THIS forum of all places in the universe.
I said no such thing. I have no idea which post of mine you’re replying to. I have no problem with tolls, and especially for a private toll road. The owner is free to charge whatever the market will bear.
You fell for it too did you. Yes there are laws of economics at work here, but not the one's you are thinking of.
It is a classic hold-up problem with a government granted license to maximize the fleecing of the people. The really powerful use helicopters.
Especially when the so-called owner managed to pay off the government to get private ownership of a public good. I cannot believe the number of clowns here who fall for a scam started when Bill Clinton was president.
The people driving on the toll roads pay for said roads.
They also have nicer cars.
Should the rich pay for the others to have nice cars, too?
Why is “not a penny justified”?
The users of the road pay for it.
You know, instead of ranchers and oil people who bear the overwhelming costs of supporting the Democrat cess pools like Austin.
:: they start with the goal to just pay for the roads, but by the time they’re paid for, they became a damn jobs program and extra ‘free’ money for the local governments to use as their own personal cash cow ::
Google “I-294” or “Chicago’s TriState Tollway”. Toll-funding was designed to be continuous while being sold to the public as a bond-type construction.
And know the pols can get the cash up front by selling the cash cow to private so-called "investors."
Here in Georgia the 400 toll road was supposed to be as long as it took to pay off. The governor tried to renege on that and extend it, then all hell broke loose and he had to open it up - no more toll.
There is HOV tolls $5 each way at rush hour here in the Los Angeles area. That works out to $300/month. $600 seems high.
Most of the mapping tools default to “fastest route”, whether or not there are toll roads involved. You have to go into the settings and tell it not to use tolls. On a long trip a couple of years ago, I forgot to do this on my in-car mapping tool, and it routed me onto every segment of tolled commuter lane while driving through Maryland. After the first one, I realized what it was doing and ignored it.
I think the programs make the assumption that if there are toll bypasses available, they’ll be faster than the regular highways (not an unwarranted assumption). In my case, it was long after rush hour, so there was no appreciable difference.
“I’m still waiting for my Obama phone. Austin voted yes on toll roads they only have themselves to blame. There is a toll road from Austin to San Antonio that is bankrupt because it wasn’t worth the charge. “
I commute every day to Austin from San Antonio. 1604 onto 35 and up to exit 226 in 45 minutes. To go from 226 to downtown, 45 minutes. What is the point adding 40 miles to my trip, when I would have to pay 14 bucks a day and still get stuck in Austin traffic?
Whoever built that bypass should be shot. They would have been better off redesigning 35 around the Austin area to fix the traffic problem from exits 242 to 225. The problem is the on and off ramps cannot handle the flow of traffic from the frontage roads.
Go ahead and flame away - I have the asbestos suit on.
I could support toll roads on all or most major roads provided one thing happens - THE TAXES ON GASOLINE ARE ELIMINATED
For many years the the way governments raised funds for road and bridge maintenance was through gasoline taxes. This was as far as taxes go a good system in that people with large heavy vehicles paid more for road and bridge upkeep because their vehicles placed more stress on the roads and bridges.
As cars have become for fuel efficient there has been no corresponding reduction in the wear and tear they place on the road. Thus taxes on gasoline and diesel have risen substantially. (I am not arguing there isn’t a lot of waste in the system)
As hybrids and electric cars like those made by Tesla have become more common you have millions of drivers that are - essentially, tax cheats because they use the roads that are maintained by drivers using gasoline.
Often these people try to use a fake argument that that they produce less pollution so they deserve the tax brake which is a an apples to oranges comparison because the cost of road maintenance is independent of air quality and the roads and bridges deteriorate just as fast whether you drive a Prius or Mazda-2 with a gasoline engine.
Placing tolls on major roads and eliminating gasoline taxes is the only equitable and actually the only workable way I can see to rectify that problem short of charging everyone with a drivers licence, man, woman, teenager or senior citizen a road maintenance tax every year whether they drive or not.
Placing tolls on most major roads, not just newly built ones would also allow the tolls to be lowered because more people would be paying tolls.
As to it costing $600.00 a month, well; how much do you spend on gasoline taxes every year? I’d bet that there is at least 50 cents of tax on every gallon of gas so a 22 gallon fill up would be $11.00 in taxes every time you fill up. If you figure 2 tanks a week = $22.00 times 52 weeks a year and you get over $1100 a year in hidden tax. THis is money that no Tesla driver pays.
You can avoid a toll road but you can’t avoid the hidden gasoline tax if you have a gasoline engine and I am generally an opponant of any hidden tax.
All taxes should be obvious and open
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