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Need help with building friendships/conversation skills (esp. for young Freepers)
2/1/03 | myself

Posted on 02/01/2003 8:02:08 PM PST by rwfromkansas

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Comment #41 Removed by Moderator

To: rwfromkansas; Calvinist_Dark_Lord
Calvinist bump. Thanks for any help if you want to give any. ~~ 5 posted on 02/01/2003 8:11 PM PST by rwfromkansas

Hmmm.....

You want to be able to analyze a discussion within ten seconds or less, correctly interpret both the verbal and the non-verbal conversational cues, think on your feet and discuss the subject matter intelligently and confidently, and learn how to direct the course of the discussion while at the same time engaging your conversational partners in a healthy and satisfactory give-and-take?

Extemporaneous speech is both a Talent and a Skill. Those who possess the Talent (and I don't know that I am one) were born with it. But almost everyone can learn the Skill.

You'll want to consider the following Sterling College courses:

If I had to pick one, I'm guessing that "CT150/CT150S Forensics Laboratory 1 credit" is University-Bureaucrat-speak for "Debate Team" or "Speech Team". If so, that one course carries my highest recommendation. Of course, you'll end up spending at least 10 hours a week (30 or more if you really get into it) on a 1-credit class, but what will you get out of it??

Applied Logic, Conversational Analysis, Extemporaneous Speech, and (instant) Camaraderie with your team-mates... all rolled into one class.

Oh, and that's just what you're looking to take away from the class. If you really go gung-ho on it, you'll get to indulge your competitive appetite for winning Debate and/or Public Speaking rounds and competitions while you're at it. But you'll learn regardless.

Check it, yo.

42 posted on 02/02/2003 6:46:11 PM PST by OrthodoxPresbyterian (We are unworthy servants; We have only done our duty.)
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To: rwfromkansas
I sent you a private reply. Check your FR mail
43 posted on 02/02/2003 7:17:03 PM PST by NetValue (Orwell was right.)
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To: OrthodoxPresbyterian
I am already scheduled to take public speaking this semester (it is a required course, btw). I work for the debate team coach and he has said I should debate, but I haven't said yes or anything yet. I will consider it, but I didn't do any of that stuff in HS.
44 posted on 02/02/2003 8:28:20 PM PST by rwfromkansas (What is the chief end of man? To glorify God and enjoy Him forever. --- Westminster Catechism Q1)
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To: uncowed
I'm not going to a shrink.....I am not that overwhelmed....:)

It is just quite frustrating sometimes, but things will get better eventually.
45 posted on 02/02/2003 8:32:17 PM PST by rwfromkansas (What is the chief end of man? To glorify God and enjoy Him forever. --- Westminster Catechism Q1)
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To: rwfromkansas; Calvinist_Dark_Lord
I am already scheduled to take public speaking this semester (it is a required course, btw). I work for the debate team coach and he has said I should debate, but I haven't said yes or anything yet. I will consider it, but I didn't do any of that stuff in HS.

Well, if you didn't take debate in HS...

...then your first semester in the Novice ranks, you might Win less often then you'd like.

One of the posters above suggested a socially-conservative therapist. I guess that works for some (shrugs). Personally, though, I think the best way to untie your tongue is to learn by doing. Call it "throw you off the pier immersion therapy". Except that you'll be enjoying the support of your coach and team-mates as you learn to swim.


46 posted on 02/02/2003 8:45:31 PM PST by OrthodoxPresbyterian (We are unworthy servants; We have only done our duty.)
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Comment #47 Removed by Moderator

To: rwfromkansas
I'm late to this thread, but am drawn to respond to your request for help.

I'm not a young FReeper, by any means. I did, however, at your age experience much the same frustration as you regarding my ability to communicate effectively.

My advice is that you lighten up a bit. NO ONE I know has ever mastered the art of friendship/conversation skills right out of the starting gate. If you are as frustrated as you say, that frustration will bleed through and will make others ill at ease.

I've always been taught that the way to be a good friend or conversationalist, is to engage the other party. Ask them to share their viewpoints, feelings, interests, etc. When you initiate a conversation look the other party in the eyes and actually LISTEN to what they have to say. Some of the best conversations/debates/exchanges I've ever had started with a simple question followed by an open and honest exchange of ideas. Social conversation cannot be scripted. There are no Cliff notes for you to memorize. LISTENING to responses to your overtures rather than thinking ahead to the next question or statement you should make to keep the conversation rolling will do more to stimulate open and honest exchanges than any other skill I can think of. I mean, really, don't you open up to people who seem genuinely interested in your viewpoints? It's human nature to interact with others. We are very social creatures.

One more thing...not everyone you attempt to engage conversation with is going to respond. Don't take it personally - maybe their mind is on something totally unrelated to you. Be open, be friendly or sympathetic, or whatever the situation calls for. Most importantly, be true to yourself. People can spot a phony right away. It's not necessary to agree with another's viewpoint in order to establish a lasting relationship.

I hope this helps. Put yourself out there and take a few rejections on the chin. I think you'll find plenty of folks who will be eager to respond, but who have been too timid to take a chance on making the first move.

Keep in touch, please, and let us know if any of the suggestions posted have been of value. If we are all full of baloney, let us know that, too. **grin**

Go get 'em, Tiger!!! (sorry, LSU alumni) my Dad's from Arkansas, though, do I get points for that?

48 posted on 02/02/2003 9:31:02 PM PST by southerngrit (Strange...I've spent most of my time trying to teach MY kids to shut UP!!)
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To: rwfromkansas
I don't wish to repeat the good advice that others have already given you, so I will just sum it up, and add a little bit of my own.

There is nothing wrong with being a quiet person. Don't feel obliged to be the life of the party. Some of the deepest people I know, and some of the wisest, are quiet people.

If you are a good person, and a good LISTENER, you will go farther in life than the loudmouths of the world.

Far more important than glibness is honesty and fortrightness. Look people in the eye. Shake hands warmly and firmly. Smile. Use good manners. Go ahead and let other people do the talking. But don't be afraid to ask girls out if you like them. There is a girl out there who will appreciate you for who you are, whether you talk much or not.

There is nothing wrong with you. Your stillness is your charm.
49 posted on 02/03/2003 12:11:22 AM PST by Jeff Chandler ( ; -)
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To: ETERNAL WARMING; rwfromkansas
The turning point for me came when I realized that people were just like me. They too felt shy

This is a good point from Eternal Warming! I'm an older woman, and I used to be shy and self concious when I was young. It's basicly a fear of being laughed at. I remember the 'popular' kids saying and doing stupid things, but it didn't seem to bother them!?

All the good advice has already been said on this thread, such as asking questions of people. Make one really good friend with another guy and start doing things together. It will give you confidence, Good luck!!

50 posted on 02/03/2003 2:19:22 PM PST by potlatch
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To: southerngrit
I am from Kansas, not Arkansas...:) I understand sometimes your eyes see things that aren't there. That happens to me reading online sometimes as well...
51 posted on 02/03/2003 2:40:56 PM PST by rwfromkansas (What is the chief end of man? To glorify God and enjoy Him forever. --- Westminster Catechism Q1)
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To: rwfromkansas
Don't be all anxious about it, m'friend. I was where you are about 12 years ago. :) I was painfully shy in HS; had some close friends I hung with, and that was it. Wasn't sure of myself interacting in social situations. In college I came out of my shell a bit; the best thing is to get involved...clubs and/or other organizations on campus. And hey, you could always -start- a club of your own! Is there a College Republican Chapter there? If not, start one up! (Conservative girls are always the cutest ;) I actually joined my residence hall council when I was a sophomore. That's where I met my best friends--a group of 6 or 7 guys that I hung out with most of the time; and my other club memberships gave me new friends to get to know. When you're around people whom you -know- have the same interests (many of them, anyway), you -always- have stuff to talk about. Don't force conversation; relax. It'll come. Trust me. :)
52 posted on 02/03/2003 2:51:30 PM PST by TheBigB (Ignore this tagline.)
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To: rwfromkansas
You're a guy, right? Well, guys can't talk on the phone..... it's genetic.....my husband told me so...... and he wouldn't lie to me, would he?

Look, I know you are frustrated, but everyone has trouble meeting people - some just fake it better than others. Even I, who could talk to just about anyone, sometimes I have a hard time switching gears in a conversation.

Good luck...and don't be so hard on yourself........

53 posted on 02/03/2003 3:22:20 PM PST by WhyisaTexasgirlinPA
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To: WhyisaTexasgirlinPA
bump
54 posted on 02/07/2003 10:39:41 AM PST by GrandMoM (Spare the rod, spoil the child!)
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To: rwfromkansas
Hi, RW.

I saw your post and I have a few ideas:

(1) talking with girls on the phone is a bad idea, they are much more experienced and are trained form birth to talk about nothing for hours;
(2) clubs like fraternities, etc are fantastic places to meet lifelong friends-- consider them;
(3) Dale Carnegie training is well worth the money-- you must learn to sell yourself to really succeed at life;
(4) please read "Think and Grow Rich" by Napoleon Hill. He has other books which are almost as good.

Good Luck, you are a great young man from what I have seen,

RobbFromGa
55 posted on 02/07/2003 11:15:42 PM PST by RobFromGa (Space Is The Final Frontier.)
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To: RobFromGa
My college does not allow fraternities etc. for religious reasons. There are a good number of clubs, some of which actually would fit with me. Most are religious in nature though. I have thought about starting up a Young Republicans chapter, but would need to find out if the support level would be high enough first......and then all the regulations etc. I will try to look for ways to get involved at any rate.

I am going to take a short road trip to check out Dale Carnegie's book (as well as a book called "Painfully Shy" which seems to describe my situation quite well and how to overcome it) at a nearby library.
56 posted on 02/08/2003 1:31:23 AM PST by rwfromkansas (What is the chief end of man? To glorify God and enjoy Him forever. --- Westminster Catechism Q1)
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To: All
I wanted to update you on some awesome news!!!!!!

Well, tonight I ate at Pizza Hut with the girl that I dated that one time. This was not a date, just something as friends. But, it was incredible. I could sense she felt it was fun as well...I could only think of 2 things the entire time to make her laugh, but I managed to at least do that. It went REALLY well and she said straight up when I dropped her off that it was really enjoyable and not as stressful as last time. I definitely agree and we somehow managed to keep thet conversation flowing without a bunch of akward pauses...perhaps one or two during the entire time (this includes a 10 minute car drive back and forth, plus 30 minutes waiting for the food...and 20 minutes eating the food). That blasted blows my mind and I can't believe how wonderful it went tonight! We are definitely on our way to being friends, I can see that. I really enjoyed it and feel like it went so well. One thing that helped me is consciously trying to think of subjects to talk about, and I have a running list. That helped me out some, and most of the conversation discussion was initiated by me. Wow.

This was the best time I have had in awhile. Simply awesome!
57 posted on 02/10/2003 5:37:58 PM PST by rwfromkansas (What is the chief end of man? To glorify God and enjoy Him forever. --- Westminster Catechism Q1)
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To: rwfromkansas
Yo RW!

I'm a 15(almost 16)-year-old male from Central California... about 60 miles south of Fresno.

When I went to a small rural school during grades 4-8 (by small I mean pop. 225 in the K-8 school), everybody got stuck with a label. Being smart, I was labeled a nerd, and no matter what I did (I didn't always act like myself) I couldn't rid myself of that horrible stereotype.

Well, I changed schools after graduating 8th grade, and at the high school here I have definitely lost nerd status... though I'm still getting higher than a 4.0 on my report cards and my SAT scores are tops in the school (which doesn't say much for the school). Because the thing is, people don't care about that. I'm relaxed, I'm not afraid to try something new, I'm friendly. I still play video games, listen to all kinds of music, go to the movies, hang out with friends, etc. That's what people are looking for, and you can be yourself while still being that person.

A life secluded from civilization isn't a life at all. Just be calm, cool, and forget about the pressure. I know, it is definitely harder than it sounds... but you have to face your fears. Take this girl, for instance... you are just now getting to know her and are naturally nervous. Be yourself, don't be too tense and see what happens. After all, what have you got to lose? A friendship that you didn't have earlier? That would just be returning to par.

Some tips I would give you is to always have a great smile (esp. for the girls!) and always be a gentleman. Too many kids nowadays don't do the simple things like holding the door open for someone else (esp. girls!), saying "please", "thank you", "God bless you", etc., using good table manners, and just being naturally nice. Oh, and, not that you are, but don't be too cocky. I flirt with that problem occassionally and it makes me look like a jerk; forgive me.

I'm glad to hear of your success at Pizza Hut... keep us updated and good luck!

Regards,
panther33

P.S. You sound like a cool guy. Drop me a line via FReepmail sometime if you just wanna talk.

58 posted on 02/23/2003 11:08:24 AM PST by panther33 (Your Favorite Band Sucks)
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