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To: sitetest
The fact is that large numbers of Methodists (probably an absolute majority) voted Dem. The Bush twins, as far as I know, are Methodists.

You really must be careful with how you stereotype various groups. The United Methodist Church tends to be a somewhat more liberal denomination because of the influence of the North-Eastern and Western Conferences. In the Southeastern and Southcentral Jurisdictions (where Bush and his Twins are from) the UMC tends to be significantly more conservative to evangelical. Looking at the delegations and their votes at General Conference will reflect this: if the Northeastern and Western Jurisdictions didn't have votes, and it was just the Southeastern, Southcentral, and Northcentral Jurisdictions, the UMC would be considered -- politically -- a fairly evangelical conservative church. Our social principles would be far less socialist, we would be unambiguously anti-abortion and our stand on gun ownership would be either neutral or pro. Given that the Southeastern and Southcentral portions of the church are the parts that are growing, while the Northeastern and Western parts continue to shrink in numbers, I suspect we will continue to see the UMC drift more and more conservative with each General Conference session.

While some of our clergy here in the South are definitely liberal, many of us are conservatives, evangelicals, and we vote Republican like most of our church members. Case in point: I have served as pastor of 5 different UMCs in Texas, and I don't believe that any of them are unusual -- either for Texas, or for the South (early in my ministry I pastored a church in North Carolina): while we had Democrats in all 5 of these churches, the overwhelming political orientation of each of my congregations would have to be moderate-to-conservative and Republican. My current congregation typifies this: I know of no more than 15-20 families (out of 150+ families) that are politically liberal and voted Democrat. The overwhelming majority of my congregation voted Republican, as did President Bush's home church -- Highland Park UMC (at 15,000+ members, the largest congregation in the denomination) -- and, I would suspect, a very large number of the Churches in the 5 Texas Conferences. I have a lot of friends among the UM Clergy here in Texas, many of whom ARE liberal. One of their biggest complaints during the last election was the degree to which their congregations were conservative Bush-supporters. When I asked how they knew they would say "you can tell it from what they say over coffee and donuts, and the stickers on the back of their cars!" And, they were right. I could count a few dozen Bush04 stickers in the parking lot last Sunday, but I've only seen one Kerry sticker.

In short, be careful about how you stereotype the UMC, or it's members, or the Bush Twins. They may be members of what, in the NORTH, is a very liberal and Democrat-voting denomination, but they're from the SOUTH ... and the UMC in the South is a VERY different animal.
377 posted on 11/20/2004 11:19:46 AM PST by TexasGreg ("Democrats Piss Me Off")
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To: TexasGreg

Dear TexasGreg,

That's a very nice analysis of Methodist political affiliation. It helps us to understand why both President Bush and Hitlery can both be Methodists. It shows significant understanding of the complexities and subtleties involved.

Which would further undermine any effort to cite religious discrimination in a case that overtly appears to be political discrimination.


sitetest


378 posted on 11/20/2004 11:28:08 AM PST by sitetest (If Roe is not overturned, no unborn child will ever be protected in law.)
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