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Obama: Government can constrain the exercise of rights. WTF?

Posted on 04/17/2008 6:33:59 AM PDT by Bobarian

Obama is quoted saying this during last night's debate:

"I believe that the Constitution confers an individual right to bear arms. But just because you have an individual right does not mean that the state or local government can't constrain the exercise of that right," he said.


TOPICS: Government; Politics
KEYWORDS: banglist; constrains; constraint; constraits; debate; guncontrol; obama; secondamendment
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I think this chilling quote by ObeyMe merits further discussion.

Let's plug some different variables into this equation and see if it adds up:

"Just because you have an individual right [to bear arms] does not mean that the state or local government can't constrain the exercise of that right."

"Just because you have an individual right [to free speech] does not mean that the state or local government can't constrain the exercise of that right."

"Just because you have an individual right [not to be searched unreasonably] does not mean that the state or local government can't constrain the exercise of that right."

"Just because you have an individual right [to freely exercise religion] does not mean that the state or local government can't constrain the exercise of that right."

"Just because you have an individual right [to an abortion] does not mean that the state or local government can't constrain the exercise of that right."

Does anyone else find this disturbing, or are my panties in a wad over nothing?

1 posted on 04/17/2008 6:33:59 AM PDT by Bobarian
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To: Bobarian
Does anyone else find this disturbing, or are my panties in a wad over nothing?

Yeah... on the one hand, it is disturbing, even sickening what the constitution has come to mean. On the other hand, isn't this just the status quo - aka business as usual? I don't think anyone associates Hillary with liberty, and McCain has demonstrated that "Congress shall make no law restricting free speech" doesn't include his campaign finance reform.

2 posted on 04/17/2008 6:38:23 AM PDT by underground (Viva la Socialisme Wall Street)
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To: Bobarian

Opps, that is awkward isn’t it:

“Just because you have an individual right [to an abortion] does not mean that the state or local government can’t constrain the exercise of that right.”


3 posted on 04/17/2008 6:38:42 AM PDT by DManA
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To: Bobarian
He cut it too short....He should have added much more info defining "constraint" such as registration, age, felons...

But he does that with every topic...It's his FORM of oratory....and non-commitment.

4 posted on 04/17/2008 6:38:45 AM PDT by Sacajaweau ("The Cracker" will be renamed "The Crapper")
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To: Bobarian
Keep it up B. Hussein. your doing a bang up job, and real Americans appreciate your candor.


5 posted on 04/17/2008 6:38:59 AM PDT by Vaquero (" an armed society is a polite society" Heinlein "MOLON LABE!" Leonidas of Sparta)
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To: Bobarian

I am the person I have been waiting for...and quite frankly, that the constitution has been waiting for. Take it to the bank.
I know things that all you bitter rural, religious, gun-toting folks don't know...

THE TRUTH ABOUT BLACK LIBERATION THEOLOGY

6 posted on 04/17/2008 6:39:06 AM PDT by Jeff Head (Freedom is not free...never has been, never will be. (www.dragonsfuryseries.com))
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To: Bobarian
He's only voicing what he's been taught.

"The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they are ignorant, but that they know so much that isn't so." R.Reagan

7 posted on 04/17/2008 6:39:13 AM PDT by JPJones (Cry havoc and let loose the Freepers!)
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To: Bobarian

Disturbing is not the word. Obama’s words are the words of a tyrant. He is a patient wolf.


8 posted on 04/17/2008 6:42:31 AM PDT by AD from SpringBay (We deserve the government we allow.)
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To: Bobarian

And yet there are those that say JM and BHO - no difference.


9 posted on 04/17/2008 6:44:10 AM PDT by svcw (I reject your reality and substitute my own.)
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To: Bobarian
"I believe that the Constitution confers an individual right to bear arms."

This is why an ignorant moron like Obama will lose. He is essentially denying that all rights come from our Creator. What a stupid candidate.

10 posted on 04/17/2008 6:44:38 AM PDT by RabidBartender
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To: Bobarian
Let us hope that by “constrain” he really meant “regulate”. However, the regulation of a right that shall not be infringed, is a slippery, and one-way, slope to prohibition, as ever-more stringent laws defining who is and who is not “debilitated” from exercising their Second Amendment right should tell us.

Indeed, it appears that Senator Schumer (D NY) has developed this line of thinking into an art form where he can say he “supports” the Second Amendment, while filing bills that cut away and cut away who can enjoy that right and where he can enjoy it.

Since liberalism, at its core is where a person lies to himself, we can expect the will lie to everyone else too. Anyone who has listened to the oral arguments in DC v Heller will hear the attorney for the District of Columbia tell the US Supreme Court that their total ban on handguns in the District alway included a self defense exemption!

The positions that both Obama and Clinton have elaborated in public about the Second Amendment is just like that bold lie: after I ban all guns, you can still hunt and use yours to protect your family. Who you gonna believe, what I'm telling you now, or the law that I told the gun-grabbers I want to sign?

11 posted on 04/17/2008 6:48:21 AM PDT by theBuckwheat
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To: Sacajaweau
I did not watch the debate but I agree with your statement - he cut it too short. But then again, it is the fault of the moderators not to press him on anything. The statement standing by itself and read broadly can find people agreeing on a majority of the statement. Would you want a truly insane person to legally have a firearm? Considering this day and age, I would recommend a class or classes of firearm safety courses. You could even CLEP it if you want too. There are people out there who can better teach the instructors of gun safety courses while there are others who would shoot themselves in the foot if given the chance.

But the main point is you are correct - these leftists never explain their initial statements and nobody presses them on it. And they never go to forums where people would press them on it.

12 posted on 04/17/2008 6:49:15 AM PDT by 7thson (I've got a seat at the big conference table! I'm gonna paint my logo on it!)
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To: RabidBartender

Such a simple truth. Such profound consequences when we forget that.


13 posted on 04/17/2008 6:54:34 AM PDT by DManA
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To: 7thson

I took the mandatory NYS Hunting Safety class in 1962 to get my deer license. I got several bulls eyes on the test and I pasted it on the refrigerator...just like a kid.


14 posted on 04/17/2008 6:54:44 AM PDT by Sacajaweau ("The Cracker" will be renamed "The Crapper")
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To: DManA

“Just because you have an individual right [to an abortion] “

you do?


15 posted on 04/17/2008 6:55:55 AM PDT by MrB (You can't reason people out of a position that they didn't use reason to get into in the first place)
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To: RabidBartender

The left and their willing dupes, “conservative” atheists,

deny the existance of a Creator in order to deny that that’s where our rights originate.

Since the rights are conferred by man, or a construct of man, they can also be revoked in the same manner.


16 posted on 04/17/2008 6:57:31 AM PDT by MrB (You can't reason people out of a position that they didn't use reason to get into in the first place)
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To: theBuckwheat
I winced at his use of the word "constrain" in regard to the Constitution and specifically the Second Amendment. From Oxford University Press: con·strain / kənˈstrān/ • v. [tr.] (often be constrained) severely restrict the scope, extent, or activity of: No thanks, Barry.
17 posted on 04/17/2008 6:57:37 AM PDT by Be_Politically_Erect (Conservative from birth...Republican no more.)
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To: Bobarian

“...just because you have an individual right does not mean that the state or local government can’t constrain the exercise of that right...”

THIS from a candidate whose party opposes the Patriot Act!!!


18 posted on 04/17/2008 6:59:37 AM PDT by SMARTY ('At some point you get tired of swatting flies, and you have to go for the manure heap' Gen. LeMay)
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To: Bobarian

I think the people who wrote the Constitution believed that the rights conferred restrained the government.

Of course, people of Obama’s persuasion think the Constitution is a silly old document written by slaveholders.


19 posted on 04/17/2008 6:59:45 AM PDT by popdonnelly (Unapologetically European)
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To: MrB
Maybe I should have italicized does not mean that the state or local government can't constrain the exercise of that right."
20 posted on 04/17/2008 6:59:52 AM PDT by DManA
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To: Jeff Head

Hey Jeff,
A typical portrait of a (Racist) who hates Whites, Jews and other Non-BLT members.

Obuma would make a far better Shoeshine boy, than either a senator or a president.

The smug look on his face reminds me of the the black militants that I enjoyed putting in jail.

Any person who would vote for this fool is either a mad man or woman or a complete self serving loathing POS.

Respectfully,
NSNR


21 posted on 04/17/2008 7:04:00 AM PDT by No Surrender No Retreat (Xin Loi My Boy!!!!)
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To: Bobarian

Inalienable right and its necessary corollary BUMP!


22 posted on 04/17/2008 7:05:20 AM PDT by PGalt
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To: DManA

Not sure where you’re coming from.

I don’t believe that such a “right” exists as it infringes on the life of another person.

You may be pushing Obama’s “logic” back on him in a sarcastic manner, but I’m not clear on it.


23 posted on 04/17/2008 7:07:55 AM PDT by MrB (You can't reason people out of a position that they didn't use reason to get into in the first place)
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To: All

I am always hearing from the left that George Bush has trampled our constitution and our rights..

Well from that statement.. Obama will take the constitution, stick it up our arse.. and light it on fire...


24 posted on 04/17/2008 7:10:07 AM PDT by Kitanis (Kitanis,)
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To: Bobarian

Isn’t it liberals who are always stating that states rights are a ‘myth’?


25 posted on 04/17/2008 7:11:21 AM PDT by bamahead (Avoid self-righteousness like the devil- nothing is so self-blinding. -- B.H. Liddell Hart)
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To: traviskicks

PING.


26 posted on 04/17/2008 7:11:42 AM PDT by bamahead (Avoid self-righteousness like the devil- nothing is so self-blinding. -- B.H. Liddell Hart)
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To: MrB

It is awkward for the PRO-ABORTS. Extending their logic about the right to own guns leads you to the awkward (for them) conclusion that the state has a perfect right to regulate, even eliminate, the “right” to an abortion.


27 posted on 04/17/2008 7:14:14 AM PDT by DManA
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To: Be_Politically_Erect

I am reminded that the person who seizes control of the meaning of words has seized control of the debate topic.

During orals for Heller, on Justice, I think Stevens, mused that the Court was free to insert the word “unreasonable” into the restraining clauses, this transforming the Second Amendment into shall not be unreasonably infringed, and the First into shall not make any unreasonable law.

Amendment by redefinition. Chilling and shameful.


28 posted on 04/17/2008 7:16:26 AM PDT by theBuckwheat
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To: No Surrender No Retreat
Obama's associations tell us all we need to know about the man.

Bill Ayers of the terrorist weatherman underground, unrepentant bomber.

Rezco, corrupt financere and tied to crime and terror.

Jeremiah Wright, hater of America (even if he once was a US Marine - I got news for Obama, Benedict Arnold was once a certified American hero before he went bad so don't try and pass off the US Marine thing as a pass for his hate) and an absolute Black Liberation militant,

Louis Farakahn, radical Islamic leader and another hater of America,

The New Black Panther Party ('nuff said),

Hamas, who now endorses Obama and hopes he wins so that the US attitude toward their operations (meaning abject radical Islamic Jihad and terror) will improve.

...and the list goes on.

Obama is the apex of the face of the enemy within.


I AM WHO I HAVE BEEN WAITING FOR.

THE TRUTH ABOUT BLACK LIBERATION THEOLOGY

29 posted on 04/17/2008 7:18:09 AM PDT by Jeff Head (Freedom is not free...never has been, never will be. (www.dragonsfuryseries.com))
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To: Bobarian

You have a right to free speech. But you can’t yell “Fire!” in a crowded theater (unless there actually is one). You have a right to freely exercise your religion. But if your religion requires you to kill those who are unwilling to convert, you cannot exercise it in that respect.

Yes, the government has a right to constrain your exercise of certain rights. The question is whether or not Sen. Obama supports constraints that have an objective other than keeping you from bringing immediate harm to someone else.


30 posted on 04/17/2008 7:18:40 AM PDT by RonF
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To: DManA

My second undeniable truth about liberalism is that

“liberals” do no promote ANY freedoms except those related to consequence free sexual behavior choices,

in all other issues, they choose the side of totalitarian control.


31 posted on 04/17/2008 7:20:08 AM PDT by MrB (You can't reason people out of a position that they didn't use reason to get into in the first place)
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To: Bobarian
>>"I believe that the Constitution confers an individual right to bear arms. But just because you have an individual right does not mean that the state or local government can't constrain the exercise of that right," he said.<<

And just because Article II of the Constitution established the Office of the President, whose to say we need one?

32 posted on 04/17/2008 7:22:57 AM PDT by Muleteam1
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To: Bobarian

Now, now...let’s not get bitter ; )


33 posted on 04/17/2008 7:25:00 AM PDT by ravingnutter
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To: Bobarian

Just the beginning.

I paraphrase: Someone’s going to take a piece of your pie so that someone else can have more.

Scary stuff.


34 posted on 04/17/2008 7:26:38 AM PDT by tennteacher (Hunter Conservative)
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To: MrB

He was trying to frame the immediate issue in terms that some people, who would otherwise approve of BHO’s comment, would better understand.

That doesn’t mean that the poster believes that particular right exists. A rhetorical technique is to re-phrase issues in terms that are meaningful your opponent, even if they are not meaningful to you.


35 posted on 04/17/2008 7:27:32 AM PDT by ctdonath2 (The average piece of junk is more meaningful than our criticism designating it so. - Ratatouille)
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To: MrB

They want government in every room of your house - except the bedroom.


36 posted on 04/17/2008 7:28:13 AM PDT by DManA
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To: RonF

The issue is that he uses variations on “reasonable regulations”, which while sounding like something we can all agree on, really mean something radically different to different people. Our side almost never calls the other on what they mean by “reasonable”, never asking what principles lead to such regulations.


37 posted on 04/17/2008 7:30:55 AM PDT by ctdonath2 (The average piece of junk is more meaningful than our criticism designating it so. - Ratatouille)
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To: ctdonath2

Thanks, he cleared it all up at #27


38 posted on 04/17/2008 7:31:07 AM PDT by MrB (You can't reason people out of a position that they didn't use reason to get into in the first place)
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To: Bobarian
Yup. And much of the modern day thinking along that line was because of a guy named Feingold and his buddy:

Feingold and McCain wrote a law SPECIFICALLY restricting political speech.

39 posted on 04/17/2008 7:32:46 AM PDT by SoFloFreeper
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To: DManA

Great point. Excellent response for lefties saying “keep the gov’t out of our bedrooms”.

Well, how about the bathroom? We have FEDERAL (show me in the Constitution where this one is) laws mandating how much water we can use to flush, for crap’s sake!

The kitchen? Trans-fats anyone?

Every room with a light bulb?

(Got more, FReepers?)


40 posted on 04/17/2008 7:33:37 AM PDT by MrB (You can't reason people out of a position that they didn't use reason to get into in the first place)
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To: Bobarian

Every right we have gets constrained by the government in some way. We have freedom of speech, but can’t yell “fire” in a crowded theater.

So the fact he said a rather obvious statement doesn’t bother me. However, I would like to know how he would like to the government to constrain the right to bear arms. The whole Constitutional intent suggests that the government’s role in gun regulation should be quite limited.

I have no problem with the following constraints on the right to bear arms:

1. Ban on private ownership of overly destructive weapons that would not be useful in self-defense, such as a grenade.

2. Banning the possession of handguns in places where the danger of assasination is high. You can’t carry a gun when on tour of the White House, for example.

3. Keep children, the mentally incompetent, and those who have show a completely inability to use guns safely from owning guns.

I suspect Obama has more constraints in mind than these limited constraints.


41 posted on 04/17/2008 7:57:20 AM PDT by Our man in washington
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To: DManA

Exactly but for Liberals the constraint only works on the issues that they say .... and if you disagree then maybe Obama will have the federal govt constrain your rights by labeling you a racist, bigot, conservative that is guily of intolerance and hatred and should be stifled for the sake of the government .....

Obama is a socialist tyrant who thinks that he is above the common man so far above that he wil REQUIRE us to do things “For Our own good”...

Be very afraid..


42 posted on 04/17/2008 8:02:45 AM PDT by Typical_Whitey (Prepare to do your time as Corvee labor on the Plantation of Barack and Michell Obama.)
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To: Bobarian

O’Bama is sounding odder and odder every passing day.


43 posted on 04/17/2008 8:05:21 AM PDT by RightWhale (Repeal the Law of the Excluded Middle)
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To: DManA

Isn’t that what the law against the performance of partial-birth abortions is all about? And the laws that require a judge to approve of a minor’s abortion if there are reasons she can’t tell her parents? And laws that mandate clinics go through counseling with a patient before they can perform an abortion on her?

Clearly laws that prevent a person who committed a felony or who has been committed to a mental institution from owning a gun are constraints on their Constitutional right. Do you think these laws are unconstitutional?


44 posted on 04/17/2008 8:58:27 AM PDT by edweena
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To: Jeff Head

Yea Half-White-Non-Wright was a Marine an obtained the high horsepower of PFC which is the grade of E-2 in the Marine Corps after three years of service. “Color that Dud.”

I glad there are Freepers like SJackson and You who are “Men of Honor “ on this site, along with the other top notch freepers.

Respectfully,
NSNR


45 posted on 04/17/2008 9:11:53 AM PDT by No Surrender No Retreat (Xin Loi My Boy!!!!)
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To: MrB

MrB, it does not, if the person has the ability, the opportunity and places one’s or anothers life in jeopardy.

We do have the right to defend our selves in America, unless I woke up in Russia this morning.

I enjoy it when Obama keeps revealing his true self and marxist/islamic teachings.

If Obama wants our guns, well my answer to him is “Come and Take Them, If You Dare.”

Piss Off A Liberal By Another Gun,
NSNR


46 posted on 04/17/2008 9:18:38 AM PDT by No Surrender No Retreat (Xin Loi My Boy!!!!)
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To: DManA

Someone posted the right designation for Obuma and his ilk. “The Enemy From Within.”

Obuma will not be elected for there are more of us Patriotic Americans, who have always loved our country and way of life.

Obama is a demon, who seeks to charm the brain-dead into voting for him.

Here in Alabama we say,” Obuma, It Is Not Going To Happen On Our Watch Boy.”


47 posted on 04/17/2008 9:25:00 AM PDT by No Surrender No Retreat (Xin Loi My Boy!!!!)
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To: RabidBartender
>This is why an ignorant moron like Obama will lose. He is essentially denying that all rights come from our Creator. What a stupid candidate.<

Don't count on it! When I look at the fact that the ONLY candidates left in the race are all socialists, I am not encouraged with the intelligence of the voters.

48 posted on 04/17/2008 9:39:29 AM PDT by B4Ranch ( Rope, Tree & Traitor; Some Assembly Required || Gun Control Means Never Having To Say I Missed You)
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To: bamahead

bookmark


49 posted on 04/17/2008 10:38:31 AM PDT by traviskicks (http://www.neoperspectives.com/Ron_Paul_2008.htm)
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To: DManA

For the record, I do NOT believe the Constitution confers abortion rights, SCOTUS notwithstanding.

I threw that one in there to bait our Liberal adversaries who believe abortion IS an inalienable right that should have no constraint whatsoever.


50 posted on 04/17/2008 3:55:33 PM PDT by Bobarian (Your NEED is not a legitimate claim upon MY productivity, thank you very little.)
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