Posted on 09/03/2009 9:03:20 AM PDT by Mobile Vulgus
David Hogberg of the National Policy Center has an interesting, in depth study of the mess that is Sweden’s single payer healthcare system from 2007 that is very relevant to today’s discussion of Obamacare because much of what Obama wants has already proving a failure in Sweden.
“The experience of Sweden demonstrates,” Hogberg says, “that when a nation adopts market-oriented reform for its health care system, the reforms will fail if the market is not permitted to work.”
Hogberg discusses some of the detailed changes that Sweden made to its system in the 1980s. These changes were made because costs were getting out of control and the government felt some market forces needed to be added to the system to help balance it. But the efforts were half measures that didn’t work.
Read the rest at Publiusforum.com...
He just has different criteria for success than you do. In Sweden, I’m sure the political elite is doing splendidly. Obama wants to repeat that success, maybe improve upon it.
Usually Americans get criticized by intellectual types because we are unaware of what is going on in the rest of the world, and hence unable to learn from their experience. Here is an instance where all of the global experience is saying DO NOT nationalize your health care, and our intellectual class is rejecting that lesson on delivery.
I assume that most Republicans and Conservatives haven’t read that much about the Swedish system. It’s actually a system that might work here: The Federal government provides minimum standards, and the county councils (sort of like our states) actually take care of getting it done.
I’m surprised no one’s suggested a hybrid federal/state solution.
At least it’s better than the Feds, yeah?
Living for years here and in Gothenburg, Sweden (and having had a child in Sweden) I agree wholeheartedly with the assessments in the article.
If the pregnancy and birthing process was any indication, we are in for a real disappointment here in this country.
Minimal care is the order of the day.
We only saw a medical doctor ONE time through 9 months of pregnancy and the birth of our son. Not out of our choice, that’s just the way it is there.
With a metro of about 1 million people, there are only two hospitals that have birthing centers.
After my wife’s water broke, we called our first choice of the two hospitals to make our “reservation.” They said they were booked up and to call the other one. We called it and they too were “booked up.” They suggested we call a couple other hospitals in Boros or Helsingborg, both more than an hour and a half drive.
We called the first one back and said we’re coming over. They were not happy. They put us in a waiting room where my wife had our son. Nothing in the room but a midwife, a fetal heart monitor they sat in a chair, and nitrous oxide.
I later asked if it was a peak time for births and they said “no, just about average.”
Evidence EVERYWHERE in the world shows Obama’s plans will fail, yet he continues down that same path anyway. The man is not smart.”
Your last sentence rebuts your first.
It’s not Obama’s plan and it’s not about healthcare.
If the plan succeeds it, it succeeds, if the plan fails, it succeeds.
“I assume that most Republicans and Conservatives haven’t read that much about the Swedish system. It’s actually a system that might work here”
- I’m Swedish. I also happen to know a little bit about American society.
On the surface, our nations display many similarities, but most well educated people who know something about both cultures probably would agree that there also exists major differences.
Sweden, still, is a society very much founded on the traditional values of the Viking/Lutheran unit of the “by”; the village consisting of free, self-governing men (feudalism never haunted Sweden unlike many other parts of Europe), but also by the ways in which they were dependent on each other and agreed to cooperate in daily matters and defend themselves in times of war.
The US, on the other hand, is a culture based on the idea of the melting pot and the ideal of independence (not wishing to say there’s no team spirit among Americans, there sure is).
Sweden and USA have much to offer each other and among other things, we should support each other as we are brothers in arms in the WOT.
BUT, what works well in Sweden might end up a fiasco on American soil and the other way around..
Do you happen to know if your great grandfather was a “statare”?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statare
Translation of the Swedish Wikipedia article performed by translate.google.com:
I can easily see why many regard this system to be close to Feudalism.
On the other hand, in a genuinely Feudal society the peasant is more or less a slave. In Russia, the aristocrats used their peasants for stakes in gambling. You can't compare that kind of Feudalism to Sweden in the beginning of the 20th century.
I get your point, but perhaps we could agree that being poor and economically dependent on someone else does not equal being a victim of traditional Feudalism.
In any case, what your great grandfaher did is admirable.
I sincerely hope you're not getting me wrong.
- Luckily enough, neither Swedes or Americans usually find themselves in such situations nowadays.
On the other hand, my impression is that in both countries, a lot of people feel their lives are being “owned by the banks”.
Personally, I don't hate the banks. Without banks Capitalism couldn't function, but I try and avoid getting too involved with them.
I'm poor for being Swedish, but at least I've enjoyed the experience of paying with cash for purchases like a nice (although used) Volvo and a big plasma TV.
My point here is that apart from the fact that products like these really DO bring quality to your life, it feels even better to actually OWN things in the old fashioned way like only middle class/upper class folks used to do in those days.
That was before the introduction of the credit card (- not to speak of the wonderful Scandinavian invention of the SMS/Text messaging loan, a 21st century phenomena which is just as insane as it sounds like; there are cases of 18 year olds being granted 20 loans at annual percentage rates of 700-800% from different creditors on a single day just by applying for a quick loan through a text message!)
By the way, I guess the Swedish town where your Swedish relatives live is Västervik. Please correct me if I'm wrong.
I have a vague memory of you and I discussing Västervik earlier on this forum and also one of providing you with a link to a site containing nice photos from there.
Anyhow, Västervik is a beautiful part of the world, just like the Ozarks is (I love lakes!).
Västervik:
http://www.fotocommunity.com/search?q=v%E4stervik
The Ozarks:
http://www.fotocommunity.com/search?q=ozark
Best of regards from old Sweden to you and everyone in America of our common ancestry, brothers and sisters eternally present in our Nordic hearts,
WesternCulture
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