Considerations For SHTF Living & Bug Out Locations

SHTF Plan ^ | 4-4-2011 | Mac Slavo

[familyop]

"It’s those in the far rural areas 3 or more hours from a major city that will have the best chance of surviving."

LOL! Then you need to go to the Northwest Territories! Here in the States, there are few places that are more than three hours from any sizable city. And it's in those places, that the real troubles would begin for a bug-out. The dangers of long-term camping residence in those places are far worse than the dangers of cities during disasters.

[metmom]

And there are a lot of under 45 more than 25# overweight.

We live in a small rural town and are not nearly as unsheltered about farming and wildlife as I'd like. Nevertheless, although we're fairly new at the rural thing, we're LIGHT YEARS ahead of your average city kid.

My oldest daughter just graduated from college and was constantly amazed and appalled at the total lack of experience or knowledge about even basic wildlife and farming that most of her city born and bred college peers displayed.

College kids and younger today are so pampered and spoiled, that they'll probably be among the first to go.

The older folks will die off from health issues long before they'd die off from the inability to manage without having everything handed to them on a silver platter.

The entitlement generation, however, is a different matter. They have no survival skills of any kind. Try to find a one that knows how to sew, garden, can, heat with wood, hang out laundry on the line, etc. Take away their modern conveniences, and they're lost.

They're the idiots who go out somewhere on a 15 degree day in the middle of winter and just hop in the car without taking a coat, figuring that they don't need one since they'll be going from a warm house to a warm car, to another warm place, not even considering what might happen if the car broke down.

They have no idea how to even deal with the elements. Exposure will claim a lot of them.

[familyop]

I live in a high place, where most of the residents are well over 45 and able to work hard. Most young, athletic lowlanders, suffering from oxygen deficit, would pee their pants, if they tried to run at all. That is...if they didn’t freeze to death first.

[Free Vulcan]

There are more places than you think, even east of the Mississippi.

We’re not talking RV’s and tents here. You need a home and preferably be living there now. You may not be able to bug out when the time comes.

[Hoffer Rand]

Unlike the movie suggests, if Yellowstone 'goes off', most of the population of the world will not survive.

That's a fact. If the Yellowstone Caldera blows, you may as well break out the good Scotch and toast the end of the world, especially if you're west of the Mississippi.

[familyop]

"There are more places than you think, even east of the Mississippi."

I live in a remote part of the West but did live close to the Mississippi in the past. Try to find a map point with more than three hours from any city of more than 100,000 population (assuming that three hours is about 150 miles). Try to find such a place in Arkansas or Missouri, even.

I'll add this. If the economy continues as it is, many more people in cold places like mine will be moving back to the east or to the south. Heating bills for small, well insulated houses are already going near a $1000 per month during the seven months of winter, and that's at propane prices for "locals" (lower than prices for tourists and newcomers). As for firewood, the bipartisan treehuggers and animal worshippers rule everything, because they have the money and time for politics. Firewood's a little expensive and will go sky high.

And for anyone hoping to mess with the lefty arbiters of nature, politicas and their third-world employees,...

From "Going Great Guns", (Forbes, David Serchuk, 04.23.09, 04:00 PM EDT)

"Forbes: I was in Colorado, and I knew people who had 200, 300 guns. And they'd stash them in various hidden places around their compound. This wasn't all that uncommon out west."

[familyop]

"We’re not talking RV’s and tents here. You need a home and preferably be living there now. You may not be able to bug out when the time comes."

BTW, I'm not wanting to discourage anyone from preparing for any possible major disaster. What I should be saying, is that there are good places in the east for surviving just about any disaster--good places not so far from cities and not in climates like Mars, er...like mine.

The Ozarks are great, for one. And there are quite a few other areas back there, where the best of rugged, self-sufficient, hospitable neighbors can be found. Here on the Rockies, just keeping warm enough will be a challenge, and growing vegetables is something else (as in extremely expensive and frustrating). Fuel...well, we might just have to find a way to live without it, if possible.

[Free Vulcan]

This is what I’ve struggled with finding a place to park. The west and north is great, really great, except for that damn weather. Montana is a hell of a place but if you don’t cut enough wood you die and the range of crops is limited.

I examined the tradeoffs and found my home area here in south Iowa is as good as any. More population but better winters, more wood, better land, more growing season, etc. Not perfect but when you match the tradeoffs it doesn’t come out bad. Plus it literally is 3 hours from any serious sized city (St. Louis). I’d like to be in north central Missouri but this is where my family is.

I figure in a ‘fan out’ from the city it will drop off geometrically. People will go no farther than they have to in order to survive. Driving randomly in the country, you will stick out like a sore thumb and not last long. Past a 2 hour drive and you won’t see much unless they got family there.

It’s a risk, but you gamble and hope. Guess we’ll find out eventually.

[cherry]

let me predict something....mostly, it'll be the OLDER parents taking in the younger people....that will be our situation...we have the big house, the 5 acres, the garden space....my husband has knowledge enough to hunt, with a bow, and to fix most things like electrical or plumbing, or car repairs....I can cook,bake,can, etc..

and then there is the financial side....older people have got a lot of their bills paid off and have a few bucks in the bank...maybe some coins...valuables....etc....

[cherry]

the police and the military will be paid with food stuffs stolen from citizens....thus it always is when you have a totalitarian govt....just like Russia...

[pyx]

Quit being such a snot.

Thanks for the reply. I hope you're a bit more amiable when you're around guns and people walk by carrying only a garden rake. Have a nice day.

[pyx]

And for those that are younger than 45 and might be in good physical health, they need to consider their parents and other family members who may need to rely on them for some of the basics. If travel is involved, could a 40-year old and his wife and kids take the parents and the in-laws and protect them and feed them properly? What about medicinal needs?

Lots to consider when the SHTF...

I agree. I've also been wondering about our parents. There is indeed so much to think about.

Kartographer has some very good tips in the PDF he mentions in Post #30. The PDF is at this URL.

[pyx]

They have no idea how to even deal with the elements. Exposure will claim a lot of them.

Kartographer's PDF file of tips and recommendations in Post #30 could help a lot of these people, if they knew about it.

[PA Engineer]

I'm not a hunter but I have many guns. My buddies are always telling me to 'get some scopes on those guns.' My retort is usually that if a person is far enough away that I need a scope to shoot him, I probably ought not be shooting him.

Get the scope. Site the scope. If you have the money (make it a priority) get one of these scopes. Put it on you prep list. Unlike "pyx", assume you will pull the trigger. You will see what is coming. Keep it rational and not emotional.

Funny. I am over 45 and only 5lbs over bmi for my age. Means shout. Ignore the trolls, but be ready. I will be magnanimous and have prepped to feed quite a few. I am also ready stop problems. Plan the same even if you need to mentally prep accordingly. YMMV. Ignore the trolls who pretend to help.

[sauropod]

read

[PA Engineer]

It was cold in our house in the winter and we shared one window fan in the summer.

Are you related to me?

[PA Engineer]

I'll add this. If the economy continues as it is, many more people in cold places like mine will be moving back to the east or to the south. Heating bills for small, well insulated houses are already going near a $1000 per month during the seven months of winter, and that's at propane prices for "locals" (lower than prices for tourists and newcomers).

Come on. Can't be that well insulated. I live in one of those places (in the east and competitive with Anchorage) and it takes no more than 5 chords of seasoned hardwood to heat (my house is not super-insulated). We are one of the worst at about 6000 HDDs. I'm staying put. Got a wood lot and can cut-split 5 chords over 5 weekends (with a handful of Motrin). Of course I live in the middle of the Marcella boom, but I don't think we are going there (TEOTWAWKI). Assume the Argentina model.

[PA Engineer]

I agree with you. A bank holiday scares me, but things will be slow and not sudden. Google FerFAL.

Regards.

PA

[Cronos]

Take away their modern conveniences, and they're lost.

Quite right. I once volunteered at Mother Teresa's in India and there were people who didn't have any of the things we take as basics -- not even running water. But they managed and we lived with them and learnt and taught (and were taught) -- a lot of the things we take for granted are things we can (at a pinch) live without. And I'm not talking about the nice stuff like TVs, ipads, phones etc. but something like running water, a flushing toilet, a knife, food, etc.

Why the thing we take the most for granted and what I saw these poor people valued the most materially was a nice hot bath. We folks who have bathrooms etc. and don't think about it, don't realise how much a little soap and water can make a person feel so much better about themselves

[Cronos]

I don't know if they have a way to donate, it's not on the website: http://www.bandranet.com/sr-christobels-trust.html

The Rose Room at Bandra (opposite Bhabha Hospital) caters to give hope to, so many homeless, naked, sick and starving men, women & children each day. They are welcome to a bath, clean clothes and food cooked by Yellow Roses. On their way to Bhabha Hospital we take them for admission (pay for medicines, admission, etc. )

Reaching out to the poorest on the streets, the Red Roses with packets of food, search the roads for the helpless, feeding and bathing them.

Fruit, vegetables, clothes and other necessary items like soap, etc., makes nearly daily @ 100 families in various areas happy to recieve these items.

And what shamed me is how little it takes to give these people the basics in life.

Rs. 100 ($2 -- that's right, 2 dollars) a day can give them a warm bath, three meals. The same amount can buy them a shirt or trousers or two slippers.