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Mark Steyn: to excerpt or not to excerpt
self | April 21, 2004 | NonValueAdded

Posted on 04/21/2004 6:04:11 PM PDT by NonValueAdded

... let's put the argument where it belongs: in Chat and not in the body of a most excellent article post from the master himself.

Here is what I posted in the latest quidnunc excerpted Steyn article post:

Oh dear Lord ... another fascinating Steyn article sullied by lots of kvetching about quid posting an excerpt. Some of the complainers even note that quid is notorious for posting excerpts. HELLO quit your griping and post your own full copy if you wish. Get a free email account on Yahoo! or even the new Google, use it for your signups, turn on the spam filter, and never bother to check the inbox again.

OR ... are you Communists? That's right ... communists. Believers in the old "from each according to his ability to each according to their need" crapola. Steyn certainly has the ability, do you begrudge him the clicks and hits to fund the payment for his brilliance? Is your "need" to view his work for free?

Your click helps the publisher make some money that partially goes to pay Mark Steyn's fee and the hit count lets the publisher know that Mark Steyn is worthy of whatever he charges (and quite frankly should be one of the highest paid columnists going given his consistent brilliance!!!).

So there you go ... shot out ... add 50 and fire for effect. I've reposted this commentary in chat here so fire up your flamethrowers and join me over there and stop sullying up another Steyn gem.

That should get things stirred up a bit. Let's all have it out here and stop adding the petty complaining to each and every posting of a Mark Steyn column!

Let the flames begin.


TOPICS: Chit/Chat; Computers/Internet; Miscellaneous
KEYWORDS: argument; excerpt; marksteyn; notexcerpt
I toyed with adding the topic "religion" since this is tryly a religious war but I don't want to abuse the system too badly.
1 posted on 04/21/2004 6:04:11 PM PDT by NonValueAdded
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To: quidnunc; Dog Gone; nothingnew; Pokey78; Democratshavenobrains
ping
2 posted on 04/21/2004 6:08:10 PM PDT by NonValueAdded (He says "Bring it on!!" Then when you do, he says, "How dare you!! ")
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To: NonValueAdded
I vote for no excerpt. One of the values of FR is that these files are archived and can be viewed months, years from now. If we rely on the links, they will go stale.
3 posted on 04/21/2004 6:13:47 PM PDT by RobFromGa (There isn't always an easy path, but there is always a right path.)
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To: RobFromGa
An archive copy is one thing, but that isn't what I sense the complaining to be about. Even if the full text is posted, do you follow the source link to give your favorite authors the hit count?
4 posted on 04/21/2004 6:15:08 PM PDT by NonValueAdded (He says "Bring it on!!" Then when you do, he says, "How dare you!! ")
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To: NonValueAdded
Even if the full text is posted, do you follow the source link to give your favorite authors the hit count?

Honestly, no.

But I have often found many of these articles at the original site, had a comment I wanted to make, and looked for and found the article on FR where there was a debate in progress. If FR becomes a "link" site it loses its stickiness because people are always being pulled off the site in new directions.

5 posted on 04/21/2004 6:19:43 PM PDT by RobFromGa (There isn't always an easy path, but there is always a right path.)
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To: NonValueAdded
Here's the deal:

Copyright infringment via the Internet is becoming a hot topic, and some copyright holders are becoming very aggressive in their efforts to protect their property — and make no mistake, it is intellelectual property.

Jim Robinson himself stated just recently that the day was not far off when excerpting would have to be required on FR.

We are seeing more very good sites, such as the Arkansas Democrat-Gazette, placed behind subscription-only firewalls.

And more and more sites are putting their content on-line in the form of non-copyable PDFs.

And if the stuff really hits the fan and the Associated Press decides to sue FR and a couple of hundred posters for copyright infringment then my excerpted posts are going to be the least of your problems.

6 posted on 04/21/2004 6:21:47 PM PDT by quidnunc (Omnis Gaul delenda est)
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To: quidnunc
I believe you are correct. I think a future role for sites like FR will be an "archive for record" in some kind of legitimate watchdog role, along with analysis and disection using fair-use snippets in the body of the commentary.

While my communist comment was primarily joking, the real argument concerns capitalism (I'm in favor). You are correct that it is all intellectual property and one by one, publishers are coming to a realization that there is gold in them thar pages. Perhaps by giving our clicks to the sites, honoring their property rights (after all, Mark Steyn is not donating his articles to them, is he?), we will generate enough ad revenue and hit count to allow them to remain free of charge. Or perhaps all we will do is demonstrate that there is enough demand that a modest access fee is feasible. What a can of worms.

7 posted on 04/21/2004 6:33:36 PM PDT by NonValueAdded (He says "Bring it on!!" Then when you do, he says, "How dare you!! ")
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To: quidnunc
If the FR latest post window code was to include a pop under window that opened external websites, with the current system otherwise unchanged, would that work for you? I agree with most of what you said on the future of internet archiving. Any large change to FR will move towards the blogging system, something that will lower the stickyness of FR.


The websites that would have this done would have to be on an approved list, or security issues would arise for less secure Freepers.

8 posted on 04/21/2004 9:04:41 PM PDT by JerseyHighlander
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To: NonValueAdded; quidnunc; Dog Gone; nothingnew; Pokey78; Democratshavenobrains; RobFromGa; ...
Here's a glaring example of what happens when "someone" excerpts a Mark Steyn article

Mark Steyn: Want to Live Like a Liberal? Then Vote Conservative

Notice the MANY FR posters who were affected by not being able to absorb the article IN FULL as the article came from a website where one has to register to view the article....

FReegards,

ConservativeStLouisGuy
9 posted on 04/22/2004 7:20:42 AM PDT by ConservativeStLouisGuy (11th FReeper Commandment: Thou Shalt Not Unnecessarily Excerpt)
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