Freon can KILL you

7/12/2010 | Self

[rstrahan]

We all take automotive refrigerant (R-12/R-134) as part of the car. But this stuff can KILL YOU. Found out the hard way. Wife was in the car, AC failed, dumped all the freon into the cabin of the car. She got a big shot of it. 30 minutes later, she is very dizzy, very sick. An hour, she's flat on the floor, throwing up blood. Got her to the ER, they started work. She's home now and recovering. But if we had not got her to the ER, she could have died. You do research, the medical articles say "if you survive 72 hours". YIKES.

So, if you get exposed to this stuff, get to the ER immediately. It is NOTHING TO FOOL AROUND WITH.

[Lazlo in PA]

Nothing beats R 12 over 134. Keep all the classics on 12 no matter the expense. Ice cold right away. Heard of people mixing ammonia to 134 for a colder effect. Breathe a fair amount of both in my time through working on my cars and never had anything happen. Maybe there were other failures, i.e. wires burning, A/C oil burning.

[William Tell]

I recall my Dad teaching me years ago what he was taught in Army Basic Training during WWII. Something like, “When you smell the grass mown green, then you know you’re in phosgene”.

[loungitude]

I have since checked a MSDS for one of the freons - yes it does decompose into phosgene when heated.

[Mutley18]

Hi Vinnie
Totally agree about phosgene.
Both myself and my father have been in the refrigeration industry and both of us have been struck with the effects of long term exposure to both Phosgene and Freon.
Both of us have Peripheral Neuropathy affecting both hands and feet.
I have also met a refrigeration mechanic in his 60’s who is in a wheel chair because of long term exposure to Freon and Phosgene.

Are there any other refrigeration mechanics with the same condition?

[cva66snipe]

I've had about 1200 pounds of R-11 spill before down in the bilges of the ship. I was working on a chiller and the valve busted. I crawled to the nearest force draft vent for air. There is another thing about refrigerant that can be real deadly and that is if it comes in contact with a propane or a gas flame. It will produce very deadly phosgene {SP} gas. It can take you out very fast.

R-12 is in older cars now. R-12 is very, very, expensive if you can even find it. Most vehicles after 1995 have a different type but still you should inhales it. I used to work on car A/C many years ago. It sounds like the evaporator coil ruptured otherwise it should have vented outside the vehicle. But if the coil ruptured that is a different story.

[cva66snipe]

Should read should not inhale it. I remember back in the late 70’s we were getting some bad R-12 shipped to us from Navy Supply. We'd have to crack the valve open and see if it had an ammonia type smell. If it did we tossed it. My first full time job in 1976 was working on car A/C's. I have seen evaporator coils rupture but usually it was done when leak testing with nitrogen.

[Vinnie]

I hadn’t heard of the symptoms you are having as associated with ‘Freon’.
Have heard of liver cancer being associated though.
Poking around on the web I ran across this article, interesting theory.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3065218/

I’ve been told that a bunch of new refrigerants are on the horizon.
One that I deal with a little is R-407c.
It’s being used in some computer room ac units. Similar pressures to R-22.

[maxweber]

Please let me know of any more info. Family was very sick from AC leak. Trying to document risks.