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**VANITY** PLEASE RECOMMEND FUN .223 RIFLE **VANITY**
Rabidralph ^ | 03/05/2011 | Rabidralph

Posted on 03/05/2011 12:31:04 PM PST by rabidralph

I've been intrigued by the Appleseed Project and I would like to take part in some of their shooting events, as well as other recreational shooting events. Most events require 400-500 rounds for weekend participation. The ammo for my current rifles would cost nearly a dollar per round. I've done some checking at Cheaper than Dirt and ammo for .223 rifles would be only $250 or so, a much more manageable cost.

I would like to get FReeper recommendations for fun-to-shoot rifles in the .223/5.56 that would be suitable for the Appleseed Project and practical for training purposes.

Also, does anyone know of a carbine conversion kit for a S&W Model 622 pistol, .22LR? Something similar to this Beretta?


TOPICS: Arts/Photography; Chit/Chat; Military/Veterans; Sports
KEYWORDS: appleseed; appleseedproject; banglist; carbine; firearms; rifle
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1 posted on 03/05/2011 12:31:10 PM PST by rabidralph
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To: rabidralph
Are there rifles that aren't fun? ;-)
2 posted on 03/05/2011 12:35:10 PM PST by humblegunner (Blogger Overlord)
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To: humblegunner

LOL! No, I guess not :-)


3 posted on 03/05/2011 12:37:56 PM PST by rabidralph ((Mu)Barack must go!)
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To: rabidralph

RUGER MINI 14 223 REM Stainless Steel 20

4 posted on 03/05/2011 12:37:56 PM PST by KDD (When the government boot is on your neck, it matters not whether it is the right boot or the left.)
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To: rabidralph

What kind of budget are you looking at?


5 posted on 03/05/2011 12:39:02 PM PST by Joe 6-pack (Que me amat, amet et canem meum)
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To: KDD

I did see that at the Ruger site. It is on my list to check out when I go to the gun store.


6 posted on 03/05/2011 12:39:58 PM PST by rabidralph ((Mu)Barack must go!)
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To: rabidralph
Keltec makes a cheap 5.56/.223.about 550.00

The SU-16's are self-loading rifles for the .223 Remington cartridge. They accept standard M-16 and AR-15 magazines,come in several exciting configurations. Now legal in California- all models (A,B,CA) except the 'C' model.

7 posted on 03/05/2011 12:40:59 PM PST by NoLibZone (A)
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To: NoLibZone

Its stamped 5.56 on the receiver too!

It matters.


8 posted on 03/05/2011 12:44:22 PM PST by NoLibZone (A)
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To: Joe 6-pack

Under $1,200, without a scope, but I’d like to get a few needed accessories within that price.


9 posted on 03/05/2011 12:44:32 PM PST by rabidralph ((Mu)Barack must go!)
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To: rabidralph

It’s a whole lot cheaper to shoot .22LR at Appleseed. A lot of people just use a Ruger 10/22. The Ruger is a lot easier to shoot if you install some Tech Sights.

For .223, the cheapest gun to buy would probably be a Saiga .223 or Kel-Tech SU-16. Probably more than accurate enough for Appleseed.


10 posted on 03/05/2011 12:45:18 PM PST by smokingfrog ( BORN free - taxed to DEATH (and beyond) ...)
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To: NoLibZone

I second the nomination for the Kel-Tec. Fun at the range and my 14 year old boy took a nice doe at 100 yards this year with it.


11 posted on 03/05/2011 12:45:18 PM PST by armydoc
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To: rabidralph

Recently purchased a Stag 2L—the L for left handed. It’s a 5.56 (.223), 16” barrel, 30 round magazine and only about $800. The store I shop in is the largest in Kentucky. They featured 500 rounds of Federal 5.56 for $189. Quite a buy. In general, even reloading .223 ammo is not cheap. After purchasing 500 pieces of brass from the friend who runs a local range for only $5, the reloads will be about 24 cents each. Only 280 loads per 1 pound of powder, 10 cents per bullet and 4 cents per primer. Anyhow, it’s a fun rifle to shoot...unless you live in Connecticut. They state government is about to CONFISCATE all magazines over 10 rounds!! That will NOT go well.


12 posted on 03/05/2011 12:46:32 PM PST by Oldpuppymax
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To: rabidralph
It has quick semi auto action without jamming.

Recoil is moderate.

It is easy to disassemble and clean.

13 posted on 03/05/2011 12:47:29 PM PST by KDD (When the government boot is on your neck, it matters not whether it is the right boot or the left.)
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To: rabidralph
FNS2000?

I'm pretty sure that the 2000 tag has something to do with price :)

14 posted on 03/05/2011 12:48:29 PM PST by Tucsonican
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To: NoLibZone

Okay, I don’t know anything about the reliability of “off-brand” firearms, so can you or anyone vouch for the quality and reliability of these brands?


15 posted on 03/05/2011 12:49:39 PM PST by rabidralph ((Mu)Barack must go!)
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http://appleseedproject.blogspot.com/2008/02/liberty-training-rifle.html


16 posted on 03/05/2011 12:50:43 PM PST by smokingfrog ( BORN free - taxed to DEATH (and beyond) ...)
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To: Tucsonican

LOL!


17 posted on 03/05/2011 12:51:45 PM PST by rabidralph ((Mu)Barack must go!)
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To: smokingfrog

Yes, I have heard to just go with a .22LR at the event. Having an accurate rifle would be a high priority as well. I will look into that. I appreciate everyone’s recommendations. I do enjoy window shopping at the sporting goods store.


18 posted on 03/05/2011 12:53:56 PM PST by rabidralph ((Mu)Barack must go!)
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To: rabidralph
the .223 is not a sudden killer beyond 50yds.

Get a .308 or 30.06.

19 posted on 03/05/2011 12:55:34 PM PST by Mariner (USS Tarawa, VQ3, USS Benjamin Stoddert, NAVCAMS WestPac, 7th Fleet, Navcommsta Puget Sound)
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To: rabidralph
I own 2 mini-14s.

I wish I had bought just one of these instead:


20 posted on 03/05/2011 12:56:14 PM PST by E. Pluribus Unum ("If they bring a knife to the fight, we bring a gun." -- Barry Soetoro, June 11, 2008)
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To: rabidralph
You can find a whole lot of AR type platforms well within that price range; I'm personally fond of Armalite products, but the number of manufacturers you'll find are almost too numerous to mention. The advantage of the platform is that you can accessorize from here to eternity if you so desire.

I'd recommend going to gunsamerica.com and browsing.

Depending on the type of shooting you want to do, one of the best optics for the money I've found is the Burris AR-332. It's got a ballistic reticle that's designed for the 5.56 trajectory out to 500 yards, has a dual illuminating reticle in either red or green, and still shows up black when you're battery dies.

21 posted on 03/05/2011 12:56:19 PM PST by Joe 6-pack (Que me amat, amet et canem meum)
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To: rabidralph

You can do the entire first day of an Appleseed with .22 LR. That would be my recommendation. If you really want something in .223/5.56 then get an AR-15. Lots of good makers these days.


22 posted on 03/05/2011 12:58:28 PM PST by stranger and pilgrim
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To: Mariner

Well, I wanted something with cheap ammo, as these training programs require around 500 rounds for a weekend of shooting. My main thought for going .223 was the cheap ammo. I already have hunting rifles but that ammo is nearly a dollar per round.


23 posted on 03/05/2011 1:00:13 PM PST by rabidralph ((Mu)Barack must go!)
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To: Joe 6-pack

Thanks for the info!


24 posted on 03/05/2011 1:04:37 PM PST by rabidralph ((Mu)Barack must go!)
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To: stranger and pilgrim

Thanks so much for the recommendation.


25 posted on 03/05/2011 1:10:11 PM PST by rabidralph ((Mu)Barack must go!)
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To: rabidralph
If you look at the Burris, keep one thing in mind. You should be able to find them in the $300 neighborhood and they come set up to either mount on a rail or a conventional AR carrying handle so there's no additional cost for rings, mounts etc. For about another $80 you can get a quick-detach mount.

Just be aware that the first production run had some problems with slightly canted reticles. They have since fixed the problem, but there are still some older ones on the market. Some vendors will specifically advertise that they have the latter available, so if they don't I wouldn't buy it sight-unseen.

It is an exceptionally handy (and rugged) little scope:


26 posted on 03/05/2011 1:11:39 PM PST by Joe 6-pack (Que me amat, amet et canem meum)
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To: smokingfrog

> It’s a whole lot cheaper to shoot .22LR at Appleseed.
If you actually take a pair of calipers and measure a .22LR you will find that it is actually .223; funny how that is.


27 posted on 03/05/2011 1:12:20 PM PST by BuffaloJack (Obama did not learn incompetence; he was born to it.)
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To: NoLibZone

Yep! It does matter.


28 posted on 03/05/2011 1:12:42 PM PST by Red_Devil 232 (VietVet - USMC All Ready On The Right? All Ready On The Left? All Ready On The Firing Line!)
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

Very nice.


29 posted on 03/05/2011 1:14:10 PM PST by rabidralph ((Mu)Barack must go!)
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To: smokingfrog

I appreciate the info! I’ll read up on it.


30 posted on 03/05/2011 1:17:39 PM PST by rabidralph ((Mu)Barack must go!)
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To: KDD; rabidralph

+1 on the Mini 14. Put a Tech-Sight on it: http://www.tech-sights.com/mini14.htm

You’ll also need a sling. Get a cotton USGI sling here: http://www.appleseedstore.flyingcart.com/?p=detail&pid=10&cat_id=0


31 posted on 03/05/2011 1:20:36 PM PST by EdReform (Oath Keepers - Guardians of the Republic - Honor your oath - Join us: www.oathkeepers.org)
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Comment #32 Removed by Moderator

To: rabidralph

Forgot to mention - you’ll need at least two magazines. You’ll be doing mag changes when you shoot the AQT.

When I go to an Appleseed Shoot, I take six mags. You can prep additional magazines during the prep period and be ready to go.


33 posted on 03/05/2011 1:27:52 PM PST by EdReform (Oath Keepers - Guardians of the Republic - Honor your oath - Join us: www.oathkeepers.org)
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To: rabidralph

Ruger Mini-14...in stainless steel.
Or, the Savage 110. My son has one and has used it for about everything from local target and varmint to some longer range prairie dog stuff. If you don’t mind a bolt action, it’s a good, reliable, affordable rifle.


34 posted on 03/05/2011 1:28:10 PM PST by PubliusMM (RKBA; a matter of fact, not opinion. 01-20-2013: Change we can look forward to.)
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To: EdReform

Thanks!


35 posted on 03/05/2011 1:30:53 PM PST by rabidralph ((Mu)Barack must go!)
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To: rabidralph

Mini-14 is a fun gun. Quite accurate and lightweight, won’t wear you out if you do alot of shooting with it.
And as others have pointed out it’s not a killer beyond say 100 yds. But one of my magazines is loaded about every 4th round with a tracer round.

So in the middle of the night or whatever, if some clown wants to try something, he’d hear Pop-Pop-Pop-ZING.....

Next day I expect I would find his britches nearby loaded with something...

And I know what you mean about ammo prices cause I also have a .30-06 and I’m not gonna take that out and start popping a hundred rounds just for fun...

IMHO, the Ruger is a good choice, easy to clean and care for.


36 posted on 03/05/2011 1:31:28 PM PST by djf (Dems and liberals: Let's redefine "marriage". We already redefined "natural born citizen".)
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To: djf

I appreciate the extra info and everything everyone’s adding on this thread. I will have fun checking prices and accessories at the stores.


37 posted on 03/05/2011 1:38:51 PM PST by rabidralph ((Mu)Barack must go!)
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To: rabidralph

Atlantic has some nice AR’s at decent prices:

http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/storeproduct556.aspx

http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/storeproduct572.aspx

http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/storeproduct347.aspx

Good source for ammo:

http://www.ammunitiontogo.com/

Take a look at CDNN’s catalog:

http://site.cdnninvestments.com/CDNN2010-6/index.html

You can drop over to www.gunsnet.net also. I’ve been a member & mod for ten years...


38 posted on 03/05/2011 1:43:47 PM PST by El Laton Caliente (NRA Life Member & www.Gunsnet.net Moderator)
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To: rabidralph

Also they are now finally making factory Ruger mags for them in the higher capacity (10-20-30) round flavor. I’ve got a couple of those, also a couple of the knock-offs that were out before Ruger made them.
IMHO get the Ruger mags, the others just aren’t as good.


39 posted on 03/05/2011 1:44:36 PM PST by djf (Dems and liberals: Let's redefine "marriage". We already redefined "natural born citizen".)
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To: rabidralph
Fun? Depends what you want.

Cant go wrong with AR15, prices are good and they are accurate/solid.

I just got this C93

What's your idea of fun?

40 posted on 03/05/2011 1:49:43 PM PST by mylife (Opinions: $1.00 ~ Halfbaked: 50c)
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To: mylife

That looks like a knockoff of a G3.


41 posted on 03/05/2011 1:52:59 PM PST by wastedyears (It has nothing to do with safety, and everything to do with control.)
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To: rabidralph
.223 aint that cheap at the moment.

5.45x39 is, if you dont mind an ak74

As far as ballistics they are about the same but while the AK74 wont rival the AR15 as a platform, ammo is about $125 for 1260 rds

42 posted on 03/05/2011 1:56:46 PM PST by mylife (Opinions: $1.00 ~ Halfbaked: 50c)
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To: rabidralph
I shoot a Ruger M77 Mark II in .223. Awesome rifle. Photobucket
43 posted on 03/05/2011 1:59:11 PM PST by hedgetrimmer
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To: wastedyears

HK93 clone


44 posted on 03/05/2011 1:59:34 PM PST by mylife (Opinions: $1.00 ~ Halfbaked: 50c)
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To: El Laton Caliente

The ammo link is quite helpful. Thanks very much!


45 posted on 03/05/2011 2:10:52 PM PST by rabidralph ((Mu)Barack must go!)
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To: mylife; rabidralph
I've been meaning to get a C93. I have a HK91, PTR91 and two CETMEs. I like the platform.

Another option is the Golani Galil from Century. I have two and two friends have one each. Nice rifles and accurate for a AK action. About the only drawback is the weight, but that is what makes the almost indestructible.

http://www.jgsales.com/product_info.php/products_id/1624

46 posted on 03/05/2011 2:11:49 PM PST by El Laton Caliente (NRA Life Member & www.Gunsnet.net Moderator)
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To: rabidralph

I have one of Keltec CA models.

I own several M-4’s , I built using with LMT suppers.

The Keltec has yet to jam or fail on me. It holds two 10 round mags in the stock.

I only shoot NATO ammo, so it could handle lower pressure .223s

Is it a $2,500 rifle?

No.


47 posted on 03/05/2011 2:13:25 PM PST by NoLibZone (A)
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To: El Laton Caliente
I was just about to post the galil

I have 2 cetmes as well. Decent machines if you know what to look for.

Century is hit or miss for quality of the builds, but you can find gems cheap.

48 posted on 03/05/2011 2:17:25 PM PST by mylife (Opinions: $1.00 ~ Halfbaked: 50c)
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To: mylife

Alantic has AK74s cheap. Surplus 5.45x39 is really about the cheapest ammo out there besides .22LR.

http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/storeproduct911.aspx


49 posted on 03/05/2011 2:19:40 PM PST by El Laton Caliente (NRA Life Member & www.Gunsnet.net Moderator)
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To: El Laton Caliente
The Daewoo also used to be cheap. Not any more.


50 posted on 03/05/2011 2:20:52 PM PST by mylife (Opinions: $1.00 ~ Halfbaked: 50c)
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