Skip to comments.China calls for attacking Somali pirate bases
Posted on 05/26/2011 4:57:11 AM PDT by Pan_Yan
(AP) BEIJING (AP) A Chinese general's call for land attacks on Somali pirate strongholds is being seen by analysts as another sign of the armed forces' growing assertiveness, even if the proposal is unlikely to result in action.
Speaking at a news conference Wednesday in Washington, Gen. Chen Bingde said he believes land bases must be assaulted in order to eradicate piracy.
"I think that for our counter-piracy campaigns to be effective, we should probably move beyond the ocean and crush their bases on the land," Chen said, adding that those funding and organizing piracy must be targeted along with rank-and-file brigands.
Chen's call was interpreted among analysts more as a statement of desire than intent, with the People's Liberation Army ill-equipped to carry out such missions and little appetite among other nations for dispatching troops to the African mainland.
His remarks, however, fit a pattern of greater outspokenness among PLA leaders that sometimes diverges from the official government line, especially in areas outside China's core interests of Taiwan, Tibet and its South China Sea territorial claims.
(Excerpt) Read more at cbsnews.com ...
This is all drifting towards sending in foreign troops to, in effect, re-impose colonial type rule and attempt to train and install a government that will last. This is a very unsavory option, and not guaranteed to work. No one (at least in Africa or the West) wants to go near the C (for colonial word). But Chinese military leaders are pointing out that there is no other option, especially if the pirates are to be shut down. The Chinese are willing to contribute to the invasion force, but not to do it by themselves. Some Western military leaders have also pointed out the need for occupation of the coastal towns used as pirate bases. No one, not even the Chinese, want to go much beyond these coastal towns. Note that the Chinese have no hang-ups about the C word, and have long used a more "practical" approach to working with African governments.
On a visit to the U.S. this week, China's top military commander Chen Bingde suggested that the international coalition patrolling the Gulf of Aden and the waters off the coast of Somalia ought to take decisive action against pirate dens on land. So far, the counter-piracy strategy has focused on the pirate "mother-ships," usually retrofitted trawlers that tow little skiffs out into the deep sea. Yet the pirate problem emanating from lawless Somalia cost the global economy over $8.3 billion in 2010. And China has a huge stake in securing its ever-increasing economic interests in the region.
Somali Pirates = alQaeda. Do it.
About effing time; it’s embarrassing when the Chinese show the b*lls Western powers used to have...
This also shows that the West’s lack of assertiveness has left a vacuum for the chicoms to fill.
Implement a “No Boat” zone along the Somalian coast for the next 40 years.
“About effing time; its embarrassing when the Chinese show the b*lls Western powers used to have.”
You took the words out of my mouth...I mean, fingers, except I was going to say “balls” ;)
Easy to say, but we’ve attacked enough as the cash rich chicoms sit.
Dead pirates? Go China!
And here's where the circle gets completed: Commerical boats from Asia wiped out the local fish populations, putting the Somali fishermen out of business. They turned to piracy to keep from starving. Now the Chinese want to kill them.
I hope the AP is wrong about the “unlikely to result in action” part.
Now, if we could just persuade the ChiComs to drop a nuke on Mecca.
Vaporize “Allah’s” “holy city”, and Islam will shudder and implode. A billion or so angry religious fanatics will dissolve into a disorganized mass of aimless zombies.
A few of whom will emerge from the Islamic mindfog and become genuine human beings.
“At some point you have to stop swatting flies and go for the manure pile.” General LeMay
They should move inland and look for oil.
Isn’t it about time to start to see the world we will become when China assumes world leadership,and we stay home and mine coal and grow food to ship to them?
Western liberals have been salivating over this for years.
What an opportunity for John F. Kerry to put on his CIA cap, man the PT Boats and take the fight to these Pirates of Arabia. I’m sure there’s a drunken Kennedy or 2 that need to launch their political careers.
China sees the Somali Pirates for what they are, Pirates. We (i.e. Zero) see them as future undocumented Democrat voters.
Why call for it? Just do it.
The Chinese have some huge number - at least 10 million? - excess males in the 18-35 warfighting demographic. What to do with them all?
Wars of conquest in places no one really cares about would seem to be one answer.
Let the ChiComs do it! It will take some of the heat off us!
Let the ChiComs do it! It will take some of the heat off us!
Might be a good idea as it could be used as an instant riposte against the Chinese when they get on one of their canned anti-colonialist rants.
The bad side would be that they’d get some serious hands on training.
China’s right about this one (and would be filling a vacuum left by the absence of US or Western action).
“Wars of conquest in places no one really cares about would seem to be one answer.”
Yes indeed. Military beachheads under the guise of a policing action are the perfect cover for establishing the initial occupation force for the Chicom conquest of the African continent.
And the press will swoon over how safe the seas have become in the area.
Perhaps this will be their charter carrier strike force’s first mission?
I have seen this claim several times, but no documentation.
Do you have a reference?
“However, if China is serious I say go for it.”
They’ll never leave once they arrive.
Ya....this is about 5 years late.
In all fairness, Bush SHOULD have implemented this!
Last line of the article:
“People don’t even want to have to deal with pirates captured at sea,”
The Russians beg to differ.
The ChiCom apparently still have some cahonies that the West has lost somewhere along the way. Africa appears to be a resource rich power vacuum available for the picking. Does history repeat itself? Youbetitdoes.
“Why call for it? Just do it.”
First thing that comes to mind is perhaps the Chinese don’t want the inevitable analysis of their military strategies, nor their capabilities at this point in the massive buildup of their military.
Me thinks they are trying to bluff others to show their hands. They will probably offer some “support”, something to get what they want, but keep their own cards face down.
Beat me to the punch... (ie: I second your sentiment)
The Chicom leader ship couldn’t give a rats ass about their troops suffering.
A United Nations report in 2006 said that, in the absence of the country's at one time serviceable coastguard, Somali waters have become the site of an international "free for all," with fishing fleets from around the world illegally plundering Somali stocks and freezing out the country's own rudimentarily-equipped fishermen. According to another U.N. report, an estimated $300 million worth of seafood is stolen from the country's coastline each year. "In any context," says Gustavo Carvalho, a London-based researcher with Global Witness, an environmental NGO, "that is a staggering sum."
It’s not like they need much in the way of conventional military amphibious shipping to take on the Somalis. Load up some container ships and some lighter stuff and go.
This is probably the first time I agree with a political decision made by China.
Pay the next ransom in cash laced with a deadly biological agent that has a 5-7 day incubation period. That will sicken not only the pirates who share in the loot, but their families and those who sell to them. Whole pirate villages will cease to exist in a matter of weeks.
Repeat as necessary.
This also points to Somalia’s basic problem. It has not had an organized and recognized government since the ouster of President Barre in 1991. At that time and before it was a under the Soviet Sphere of influence. With the end of the Soviets and the Cold war, there was no one to prop them up and so they have fallen into this lawless land. The Pirates are only a symptom of all of these warring tribal factions trying to gain control of the country and none of them able to fend off any outside interference from other countries such as this fishing problem.
Methinks you guys over estimate the reach and power of the Chinese military and underestimate what would happen if an occupying force came into Somalia. All of the tribes would band together for common cause and work to oust the invader IMO. It would be a long and bloody affair with most of the world lining up to denounce China. Now, if they just went in, wiped out the pirates and left, that would be achievable. However, the pirate problem would only be gone for maybe a couple of years. It would then come back. Power abhors a vacuum and some leader of some tribe would step in to be the next Captain Kidd. Piracy is merey a symptom of the problem in Somalia. The problem is there is no organized and recognized government. The current one is useless and powerless...
Travis, your take?
As an aside, one of the things stopping reprisals against the pirate bases are the fact that the Somali pirates hold quite a number of hostages. Of course, it is quite likely the Chinese don’t care about the hostages . . .
The Chinese have the right idea, but thy don’t go far enough.
1. Destroy pirate funding - no ransom for ships or crews. corporations or organizations that pay ransoms are to be sanctioned into bankruptcy.
2. The Navies of the Civilized World should attack pirates at sea. Captured pirates should be tried and executed by military courts at sea. They should not set foot on land again.
3. The Navies of Civilized World should attack the coastal towns than harbor the pirates. Captured ships should recovered, or, failing that, sunk. Everything else that floats should be sunk. The water fronts should be burned with special emphasis on destroying any boat or shipyards.
4. At the same time, troops should rescue any hostages or captured crews or recover their bodies.
5. The principle of massive, indiscriminate retaliation for the death of hostages and crews should be established. Literally hundreds of Somalis within the pirate towns should die for each hostage or crewman killed by them.
6. War should be made against businesses that provide logistics support to the pirates - boats, weapons, fuel, etc. Organizations supplying such should be destroyed and their owners slaughtered.
7. The leaders of the pirates should be hunted wherever the reside and killed without mercy.
8. Individuals providing information to pirates regarding ships to be targeted should be hunted and killed without mercy.
9. The laws of the sea and of nations should be changed to allow ships to carry weapons for self defense. Bounties should be paid for successful defense if involves the death of pirates or the destruction of their vessels.
Since a lot of people don't know, Somalia is divided into three parts. Puntland and Somaliland are autonomous northern states, somewhat recognized as independent, but not given nation status. The Transitional Federal Government (TFG) is on the offense right now backed heavily by foreign troops and U.N. money. They control approximately 1/2 of the capitol Mogadishu. That's actually a significant gain for them. They were down to 12 blocks at one time with 8,000 foreign mercenaries holding it.
A significant number of the pirates sail from Puntland. Al Shabbab, the Al Qaeda group that controls most of the southern third of the country, wants in on the action has been fighting with the pirates lately. Al Shabbab has also been getting into fights with Kenya and Ethiopia, who have both made incursions into Somalia recently to push back Al Shabbab.
Including a few fully loaded supertankers worth a couple hundred million each. No one wants anything to happen to one of those.
Beyond illegal fishing, foreign ships have also long been accused by local fishermen of dumping toxic and nuclear waste off Somalia's shores. A 2005 United Nations Environmental Program report cited uranium radioactive and other hazardous deposits leading to a rash of respiratory ailments and skin diseases breaking out in villages along the Somali coast. According to the U.N., at the time of the report, it cost $2.50 per ton for a European company to dump these types of materials off the Horn of Africa, as opposed to $250 per ton to dispose of them cleanly in Europe.
Re: Dead pirates? Go China!
Somali pirates is costing the Chinese hugely, two cutting edge boats full time, boats which could’ve been diverted to more productive purposes, i.e., the patrolling and keeping [of State sponsored pirates] in the South China Sea from getting too smart assed which is much more sensible a proposition.
If that dumping of toxins has been done, the offenders should be caught and punished for the violation. That was done without regard for the results. My suggestion is a self-defense strategy for the seafaring world.
Aren’t rashes and disease common in third world crapholes like Somalia, anyway? < /cruel truth >
And yet, the Chinese have always tried to thwart U.S. attempts to “interfere in other countries’ internal affairs”.
Wars of conquest in places no one really cares about would seem to be one answer.
Is there any evidence to back up this theory? I know a number of people have said it, but it seems to be one of those shibboleths that circulates as if it's holy writ. In fact, China has had surplus males for most of its history, because monogamy is a Western import of recent (20th century) vintage. And yet, relative to European countries, China has had a pretty peaceful history, with few border changes over the last 2000 years. John Derbyshire at the National Review comments:
There is some speculation about what the social and political effects of the male surplus will be. Some writers have argued that it will have national-security implications for the U.S.A. I say fiddlesticks. Its been the case in societies all over, all through history, that there were not enough brides for the available men. This was certainly so in China because of polygamy. A dear old friend of mine, recently deceased, was born in Guangdong Province in the late 1920s to a father with seven wives. (And this, note, in a nation where female infanticide was still in play, as it had been among the poorer class of peasants since time immemorial.)
Even in monogamous cultures there have been adult sex-ratio imbalances due to such factors as male deaths in war and vendetta, and the shunting off of high-status females to convents. If theres any good data showing that popualtions with surplus males are more prone to warfare or despotism than those without, Id like to see it. As Mara Hvistendahl notes in her forthcoming book on the subject, Adolf Hitler came to power at a time when Germany had over 2 million more women than men as a result of the toll taken by World War I.
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