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What Old, White Conservatives Miss About America
The Atlantic ^ | Aug 22, 2011 | Conor Friedersdorf

Posted on 08/23/2011 4:26:46 AM PDT by BUGSWOL

Their nostalgia isn't necessarily bigoted. The main reason people feel wistful for less racially enlightened times is that everyone romanticizes childhood.

(Excerpt) Read more at m.theatlantic.com ...


TOPICS: Chit/Chat; Society
KEYWORDS: 1950s; race
Gee why would we miss a time when we could tell our kids to "Go outside and play, just be home for supper."?

Why would we miss a time when our kids could go to a school two blocks away?

Why would we miss a time when a family could be supported on one income and our children were not raised in government schools?

1 posted on 08/23/2011 4:26:53 AM PDT by BUGSWOL
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To: BUGSWOL

I guarantee that a lot of older blacks miss plenty from their “unenlightened” youth.


2 posted on 08/23/2011 4:31:11 AM PDT by cripplecreek (Remember the River Raisin)
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To: BUGSWOL

I’m only 35 however I maintain that America peaked as a nation in the 1950’s.


3 posted on 08/23/2011 4:37:25 AM PDT by TSgt (When in the Course of human events...)
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To: BUGSWOL

This Conor Friedersdorf thinks he’s providing insight into old, white conservative thinking in this article but he’s really providing an insight into just how limited modern Lib thinking is. To Libs, the time before 1960 was all about one thing — race and oppression. And the history of the world started in the 1950s. In the 1950s, there was a drab, black and white world in which Whites went to church to hear their pastors tell them to go out and lynch blacks. The Evil Republicans were in charge and controlled everything, including how people should think, through their theocracy. Then John Kennedy was elected and the world became enlightened. Then we had the Glorious Revolution of the 60s and going forward the rest of history is the struggle between good (Democrats, Socialism, PC-ism)and evil (Republicans, capitalism, limited government). Anyone who is nostalgic for the 50s can’t be thinking sane thoughts. They are acting on an irrational impulse as a way to get back to the safety of childhood. BTW, this isn’t hyperbole—the unreflective intellectual Libs of The Atlantic really believe this.


4 posted on 08/23/2011 4:38:41 AM PDT by Opinionated Blowhard ("When the people find they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic.")
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To: BUGSWOL
The main reason people feel wistful for less racially enlightened times

I think the 1950s were considerably more enlightened about many things.

The "enlightenment" to which the author refers is almost certainly a false dawn.

5 posted on 08/23/2011 4:40:36 AM PDT by Jim Noble (To live peacefully with credit-based consumption and fiat money, men would have to be angels.)
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To: BUGSWOL

What a disappointing article.


6 posted on 08/23/2011 4:40:51 AM PDT by Past Your Eyes (I'm sticking with Herman. No more second terms!)
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To: TSgt

“I’m only 35 however I maintain that America peaked as a nation in the 1950’s.”
***************
*************************

Right On Target with that one!!!!!


7 posted on 08/23/2011 4:42:02 AM PDT by gunnyg ("A Constitution changed from Freedom, can never be restored; Liberty, once lost, is lost forever...)
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To: TSgt

AMEN!!!


8 posted on 08/23/2011 4:43:49 AM PDT by Ann Archy (Abortion is the Human Sacrifice to the god of Convenience.)
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To: cripplecreek

I had a cousin who was a police captain in an Black precinct. The truth be known he hated Blacks. The local Black news paper hated him. The odd thing was I’d run into Black people through work that lived in that precinct and they loved him because when he was there it was safe. He is long dead and the city now has a Black chief of police and it is not safe for anyone anymore.


9 posted on 08/23/2011 4:45:29 AM PDT by BUGSWOL (No one was ever burned at the stake for saying the Earth was flat)
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To: BUGSWOL

I grew up in East Los Angeles in the early 1950s, and people didn’t lock their doors or cars them There was no need to.

Today, bars on the windows and doors and gang tags everywhere is the norm in this neighborhood.

Bucky Covington got it right:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HJWEvP9gtww


10 posted on 08/23/2011 4:45:55 AM PDT by Tigerized
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To: BUGSWOL
I miss a time when our credit rating would never be questioned.
11 posted on 08/23/2011 4:46:32 AM PDT by HereInTheHeartland (I love how the FR spellchecker doesn't recognize the word "Obama")
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To: BUGSWOL

“Why would we miss a time when a family could be supported on one income and our children were not raised in government schools? “

The finger of government has been involved in education since before any of us were born.

http://www.servintfree.net/~aidmn-ejournal/publications/2001-11/PublicEducationInTheUnitedStates.html

A few facts:

“The first publicly supported secondary school in the United States was the Boston Latin School, founded in 1635”

“The federal government’s activities in the field of education have further centralized American schooling. The Smith-Hughes Act of 1917 helped create vocational programs in high schools, and the GI Bill of 1944 was the first important federal effort to provide financial aid for military veterans to attend college.”


12 posted on 08/23/2011 4:47:44 AM PDT by Immerito (Reading Through the Bible in 90 Days)
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To: BUGSWOL

I miss a time when you could leave your house and not have to lock it behind.

We would go on vacation in the 50s and 60s, and the parents would lock the front door. They never locked the back door.


13 posted on 08/23/2011 4:49:22 AM PDT by Dustoff45 (A good woman brings out the best in a good man! A better woman might be just what this nation needs)
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To: TSgt
I’m only 35 however I maintain that America peaked as a nation in the 1950’s.

I'm a good deal older than you, FRiend....and I would add about 5 years to your estimate.

IMHO....things began to turn south just after Kennedy was murdered in Dallas TX by persons unknown.

And when they turned south...they went south in a hurry. We had a brief respite during the Reagan presidency, and again during the Bush II first five years, but then...south we continued to go.

Kind of like walking down a flight of steep stairs; one wonders where the bottom is....and if we'll find a true leader in time to not only hold us in place but begin climbing back up.

In 500 years or so, historians are going to have a ball with this period of time!

14 posted on 08/23/2011 4:51:24 AM PDT by Logic n' Reason (The stain must be REMOVED (ERADICATED)....NOW!!)
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To: BUGSWOL

My understanding of America leads to believe that the best I ever saw America was in 88/89 when they had a televised “goodbye” to Ronald Reagan.

There were about 20 kids that were given 10-20 seconds to describe why Reagan was important and such a great leader. They understood clearly that Reagan had changed America for the better and I completely agreed.


15 posted on 08/23/2011 4:52:34 AM PDT by struggle
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To: gunnyg

I think the apex was June 6th, 1944.


16 posted on 08/23/2011 4:53:35 AM PDT by central_va ( I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: Opinionated Blowhard
Perfect post. I couldn't agree more. I have to say that even here on Free Republic, a few years ago I posted "I miss the 1950s" and a freeper responded very seriously with an accusation that I "want to bring back Jim Crow".

Some people can only see the world in a twisted way.

17 posted on 08/23/2011 4:55:02 AM PDT by ClearCase_guy (The USSR spent itself into bankruptcy and collapsed -- and aren't we on the same path now?)
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To: Opinionated Blowhard

Thanks for a most cogent post.

The black civil rights issue was the last one liberals were unequivocally on the right side of morality and history and (most) conservatives were unfortunately on the wrong side of both.

Since liberals cannot make very good arguments for their policies based on today’s issues, they love to restage every issue in the light of the civil rights movement. It’s forever 1965 in Selma. If you oppose or criticize any of their policies, no matter how unrelated to race, you must want to bring back Jim Crow.

This is somewhat similar to the way some conservatives replay every international conflict in light of WWII. It’s always 1938 and we’re in Munich.


18 posted on 08/23/2011 5:05:35 AM PDT by Sherman Logan
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To: central_va

Yep, by the time the flim-flam zip code became mandatory, it was a done deal for the maxists!

;(

Semper Watching!


19 posted on 08/23/2011 5:09:53 AM PDT by gunnyg ("A Constitution changed from Freedom, can never be restored; Liberty, once lost, is lost forever...)
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To: TSgt; gunnyg
I’m only 35 however I maintain that America peaked as a nation in the 1950’s.

So does Mark Steyn. He makes the argument through the picture of plucking a man up from the beginning of the nineteenth century and dropping him into the typical suburban home of the 1950s. There the time traveler sees refrigerators, air conditioning, table top radio, television, washing machines, the automobile and the 707 jet.

Mark then describes another fifty year jump and not seeing anything really new except that the entertainment devices have shrunk and improved. It took eighteen months to build the Empire State Building, but it will be eighteen years and counting before a new building replaces the WTC (maybe).

Man was curing polio and developing vaccines for curing and eradicating terrible diseases, today we consider among our drug miracles Viagra. Fifty years ago, we would spread DDT around to kill off Malaria, today we allow Malaria to kill us off because of political correctness and earth worship.

I wasn't anywhere near the 1950s or 60s but where is our Hoover Dam, our man walking on the moon, Concorde jet, Panama Canals, winning major world wars on two fronts against Tier 1 enemies? All we have is the Apple iPad 2?

20 posted on 08/23/2011 5:12:12 AM PDT by The Theophilus (Obama's Key to win 2012: Ban Haloperidol)
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To: The Theophilus
...where is our Hoover Dam, our man walking on the moon, Concorde jet, Panama Canals, winning major world wars on two fronts against Tier 1 enemies?

We have President Dwayne Elizondo Mountain Dew Herbert Camacho

21 posted on 08/23/2011 5:24:45 AM PDT by TSgt (When in the Course of human events...)
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To: BUGSWOL
All I can say is this:


22 posted on 08/23/2011 5:26:13 AM PDT by ThePatriotsFlag (.)
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To: TSgt

Economically I’d say yes we peaked in the 50’s. I’d say we peaked intellectually and educationally somewhere around WWI and the Roaring 20’s and lived off the fruit of that for decades. Once FDR came in we started down the road of mind-numbed fools.


23 posted on 08/23/2011 5:35:15 AM PDT by Free Vulcan (Obama/Biden '12: No hope and chump change.)
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To: The Theophilus
I wasn't anywhere near the 1950s or 60s but where is our Hoover Dam, our man walking on the moon ...
Good post. I'm a Baby Boomer and I couldn't agree more. I often use the Empire State building as an example of the way things were - built during the Depression, under budget and on time.
I often also wonder why, with billions and billions spent in research over the last 50 years, do we still have cancer, MS, MD, etc?
Where are today's Jonas Salks?
24 posted on 08/23/2011 5:36:03 AM PDT by oh8eleven (RVN '67-'68)
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To: The Theophilus

>All we have is the Apple iPad 2?

While I admit that in many ways the 50s were a golden age, we can’t very well sell short what has been accomplished since then.

First off, one should understand that the prosperity of the 50s is likely to be a unique event in history. Considering that every other industrialized nation on the planet had pretty much been bombed flat during WW II, while our production facilities were still standing, it is easy to see the huge edge we had. I cannot see circumstances in which that advantage will be available to us again.

But let’s be honest, tech these days is not something to be scoffed at. Sure, we don’t have the flying cars, and other WOW gizmos people thought were going to be the future back in the 50s. However we do have some pretty damned amazing stuff.

For example look at that iPad2 you mock. That’s capable of being a library bigger than the one down your street. It’s capable of being a newspaper from anywhere on the planet. It can be a calculator, do advanced math functions, act as an astronomy guide, and do other advanced scientific aides. It can also let you look up information on any topic at your whim. Heck, you could also include all of Mozart’s symphonies on it as well.

In reality it’s just a bigger version of the iPhone which is a pocket sized device that gives you access to a very significant percentage of the information amassed by humanity at any time, most anywhere in this country. As it has been said plenty of times, knowledge is power, and these tools are utterly amazing knowledge devices.

Yes, we didn’t go with the science fiction strides expected beck in the days of yore with spaceships, rays guns, and colonies on other planets, but we did things in the space of information sharing that are just as amazing.

Of course one might note that the information space was where the government intruded the least and derive some conclusions from that.


25 posted on 08/23/2011 6:01:04 AM PDT by drbuzzard (different league)
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To: The Theophilus

If we look at history to the periods of time preceding outbreaks of war or civil unrest, pandemics, etc., - and then compare the decades thereafter... we might note that society and its people follow a certain rhythm.

Adversity/fear/dissatisfaction.
Conflict.
Victory over adversity.
Recovery.
Celebration.
Normalcy.
Complacency.
Dissatisfaction.
Civil unrest.
ad infinitum.

To the elderly, the past appears perfect, the present no longer belongs to them and the future is fantasy. Memories are God’s therapy.


26 posted on 08/23/2011 6:02:42 AM PDT by sodpoodle (Despair: Man's surrender. Laughter: God's redemption.)
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To: ClearCase_guy
I posted "I miss the 1950s" and a freeper responded very seriously with an accusation that I "want to bring back Jim Crow".

The 50s?

Wasn't that when President Eisenhower had to send troops into Little Rock, Arkansas, to enforce court ordered desegregation in the schools there?

And wasn't it also when he initiated Operation Wetback? It was good to have a President who understood that his job was to see that the laws were faithfully executed.

ML/NJ

27 posted on 08/23/2011 6:07:30 AM PDT by ml/nj
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To: ClearCase_guy
And maybe I was just naive then, but my feeling was that the Sports Section wasn't the only part of a newspaper that offered reasonably complete and objective coverage of events.

ML/NJ

28 posted on 08/23/2011 6:15:47 AM PDT by ml/nj
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To: BUGSWOL; Chode

29 posted on 08/23/2011 6:52:25 AM PDT by Morgana (I never said one word........)
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To: cripplecreek

I just got back from a cruise vaca. The comedian was a black man whose whole routine was how the country had changed for the worse. Kids not respecting their elders, dress, girls acting like tramps, etc. He wasn’t old, either.


30 posted on 08/23/2011 6:54:54 AM PDT by sportutegrl
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To: BUGSWOL

31 posted on 08/23/2011 6:54:59 AM PDT by Morgana (I never said one word........)
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To: BUGSWOL

“Why would we miss a time when a family could be supported on one income”

I get your point, but one income can still support a 1950’s lifestyle. a 1200 square foot ranch, one black and white TV. One car. Home cooked meals. No child care expense. New clothes once a year. Getting shoes resoled instead of buying new. No cruises or jet trip vacations. etc.


32 posted on 08/23/2011 7:09:29 AM PDT by dangerdoc (see post #6)
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To: BUGSWOL

Ah, not only am I a rascist terrorist, but now I am also immature.....Got it..


33 posted on 08/23/2011 9:31:05 AM PDT by CSM (Keeper of the "Dave Ramsey Fan" ping list. FReepmail me if you want your beeber stuned.)
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To: Sherman Logan

“The black civil rights issue was the last one liberals were unequivocally on the right side of morality and history and (most) conservatives were unfortunately on the wrong side of both.”

I may be misreading your statement, so I’ll apologize in advance if I am misreading it. That said, you are completely incorrect to state that democrats were on the right side of the racism issue. They were not. They were the Jim Crow folks, they were the lynchers and they were to segregationists. The Repbulicans fought them to a final victory, then the Dems began the process of taking credit for what they were completely against...


34 posted on 08/23/2011 9:37:03 AM PDT by CSM (Keeper of the "Dave Ramsey Fan" ping list. FReepmail me if you want your beeber stuned.)
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To: Morgana
damn straight...

35 posted on 08/23/2011 2:56:39 PM PDT by Chode (American Hedonist - *DTOM* -ww- NO Pity for the LAZY)
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To: Morgana
Remember when?






36 posted on 08/23/2011 3:03:17 PM PDT by trisham (Zen is not easy. It takes effort to attain nothingness. And then what do you have? Bupkis.)
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To: Opinionated Blowhard

Great summary, and you could delete “of The Atlantic”.


37 posted on 08/23/2011 4:48:01 PM PDT by FreedomPoster (Islam delenda est)
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To: CSM

I’m sorry, but your comment is not accurate history.

For one thing, I never mentioned Democrats or Republicans. I said liberals and conservatives. Prior to the 1970s, neither party was exclusively one or the other. Both were national coalitions of regional parties that included both liberal and conservative branches.

You can call the Jim Crow boys many things, (and I’m happy to join you in doing so), but you can’t call them liberals, neither in the original classical liberal sense or in the modern leftist/socialist sense. They were conservatives, even reactionaries, although in my opinion a variant of conservatism that deviated so widely from the American conservative mainstream as to have a whole lot more in common with fascism and Nazism.

You are quite correct that those oppressing blacks were Democrats. But then so were almost all those leading the fight against them. The GOP pretty much sat on the sidelines.

While it is a truism that more GOP than Democrat congressmen voted for the Civil Rights Act, it is also irrelevant. On the ground few if any mainstream conservatives were leaders in the fight for civil rights. This was left up largely to Democratic liberals, leftists and even communists. For instance, I think you would have to search long and hard to find influential conservatives who participate in the various marches in the South.

Most conservatives, such as Goldwater and WF Buckley, saw the civil rights issue as a local or states’ rights issue, rather than a national constitutional one. The fight against Communism was much more important to them than the fight for equal rights for all Americans. While this opinion was defensible and understandable, I believe it was utterly and disastrously wrong, and later in life both of these gentlemen agreed.

The problem is that liberals gained enormous moral capital by being on the right side of this issue, and conservatives acquired an equivalently-sized moral deficit. For 50 years now the major rhetorical tool of liberalism has been to wave the bloody shirt of civil rights, and it has worked beautifully. (Though the shirt is getting a little ragged.)

I believe conservatives should have led, or at least participate enthusiastically in the fight for civil rights, rather than considering it an unimportant side issue. Conservatives today, and the country as a whole, IMO, continues to pay the price of their failure of vision in the 50s and 60s.


38 posted on 08/23/2011 5:13:23 PM PDT by Sherman Logan
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