Posted on 01/22/2013 10:49:32 AM PST by GreenEyedGal
You have it right. Life begins at conception. My husband is a medical doctor.
Per chacha, [wiki, and several other websites}...
“Although identical twins have the same genotype, or DNA, they have different phenotypes, meaning that the same DNA is expressed in different ways.”
Their fingerprints are unique too.
“self-sustaining individual who would, in the absence of outside intervention, become a fully-independent person.”
I’ll add to your response to this. If this were the “clear line” moving from chosing to eliminate parasites to murder, then according to the collectivists we could kill anyone at any time!
I guess that is their end goal....
We mostly agree, and I'm undecided on which end of that 1-5 day period life begins. In practical terms, it almost never matters whether one accepts what I called definition (1) or definition (2). In either case, surgical abortions are in almost all cases killing an innocent child and chemical abortions are at least potentially the same moral crime. Note: in rare cases, such as ectopic pregnancy, this killing of an innocent is, in my opinion, fully justified to save the life of the mother when the baby's life cannot be saved.
These should get you started. We watched a version of this during Sunday School this week.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bXA-RNgOLyc
http://shop.nationalgeographic.com/ngs/product/dvds/science-and-space/in-the-womb-dvd
The Human reproductive process is a continuum. That is; a live female person furnishes a live egg, and a live male person, fertilizes, with live sperm, the aforementioned egg.
Thus, conception is a live human process. Ergo, it really doesn't "begin" at a later time as the zygote is alive and hopefully well, from the moment it is created.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_fertilization
As every tenth grade biology student understands, the individual receives it’s genetic makeup - the blueprint that makes it a unique human being - at conception - that’s when life begins - just because it doesn’t yet look like a “real” person makes it no less a human being than does the fact that it will look differnt at the age of one from what it does at ninety - and that it needs assistance in sustaining life on its own makes it no less human than does the fact that it needs help in surviving at one year of age, and will probably need it at ninety........
Sorry, I watched more of this YouTube clip. This is a watered down version of the one we watched.
Many of the scenes are the same, but the sound track is an American sounding man while the one we watched was a British sounding woman.
The narrative with the American Man speaking is a bit wimpy, both scientifically and from a pro-life perspective.
We can sit and argue all day with these people about when life does or does not begin. I agree that not everyone of them are religious and disregard what ever the Bible has to say on the subject of abortion for reasons of hatred towards Christians/Religion in general. However science tells us that if what ever is inside the woman has a heart beat and brain waves then that is a life. This is true at 12 weeks of pregnancy. The same 12 weeks or after that a fetus is aborted.
If I had a wish to spend as I saw fit, I would wish that every "Pro-Choice activist", including the Obamas, would wake up tomorrow with that sweet face indelibly tattooed on the inside of their eyelids. If they could clearly see what it is that they are so eager to destroy perhaps it might stay their hands...
Regards,
GtG
Yours is such a sweet wish, I wish yours could be granted.
God bless and keep you and everyone you love.
Now, I did not know that. Thank you for sharing it.
Yes, we absolutely do. This is just a matter of refining the argument.
In the case of an ectopic pregnancy, I would agree. This is covered by the "principle of double effect": where an action has a primary goal and a secondary effect. The primary goal is to save the mother by removing the ectopic pregnancy--but that can only be done by ending the life of the child, even though that effect is not intended. There is no way around it.
I understand what you say about the heartbeat.
The fleshly body of man requires the beating of a heart, air to lungs, blood through veins..but the Soul of man...can we as humans determine when that arrives?
I say no. We are Spirit, enfleshed. The flesh is only part of who and what we are. In my understanding, God knows us before we are born, therefore, our spirit begins before conception, our flesh, what man in his ignorance calls “life” begins at conception.
Thanks to most of you for your responses. I’ve written my piece and used a lot of what you all offered (you can read it at amandakmelson@wordpress.com if you want). I especially loved the TED Talk video.
One or two of you said I was buying into the pro-abortion premise, either by asking questions or writing the piece (I can’t remember which). I couldn’t disagree with you more. It is absolutely imperative that we know what the left is saying in order that we give informed, measured, rational and logical answers. I also believe that when we conservatives answer, we must speak the blunt truth. Specifically, we cannot afford to soften language as it relates to abortion. There are so many people who are pro-abortion because they have never truly considered what it is and what it does. They reach a certain point in their thinking and stop because to go further would lead to discomfort and conviction. It is our job to push them beyond that point and I believe that’s what I’ve done, and of course, what I will continue to do in my efforts to end abortion.
After I had written my piece, I came across this one, http://www.desiringgod.org/blog/posts/we-know-they-are-killing-children-all-of-us-know?fb_action_ids=10200107704968046&fb_action_types=og.likes&fb_source=aggregation&fb_aggregation_id=288381481237582, which is an absolute indictment of anyone who supports the right of women to abort their children. I hate to say it’s better written than mine, but I think that just might be the case!
Thank you again for taking the time to share your thoughts with me and help me form my own thoughts and what I wanted to say. I can’t tell you what a blessing it is to have a group of conservatives with which to discuss issues and reaffirm and reinforce the things I believe. The number of voices out there who contradict my values and beliefs is overwhelming and sometimes depressing. It’s so refreshing to belong to a group that goes against the grain!
Life begins when one of the two parties says “O G*D”! :-)!
That’s the truth!
Very nice summation of what FR is all about!
I had just remarked to Mrs BN that FR was like sitting at the gates of the city, discussing the events of the day with the other elders.
Your post said it with so much more elegance!
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