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Bob Dylan and the Poetry of Salvation
Saturday Review ^ | May 30, 1970 | Steven Goldberg

Posted on 02/06/2013 10:15:17 AM PST by don-o

It is quite conceivable, therefore, that, when he bothers with politics at all, Dylan's political outlook is conservative. His emphasis on personal, as opposed to societal, salvation could very possibly leave him feeling most at home with a political philosophy that emphasizes the individual's right to be left alone to his own search for God. John Wesley Harding appeared at a time when the indescribable revulsion felt by the young toward Lyn- don Johnson was at its zenith; yet, in a time of ornate, kaleidoscopic record covers, John Wesley Harding had an Americana cover. Dylan's declaration (Continued on page 57)

that he was not about to argue or to move contrasted with the student rage that was asserting itself. If Dylan does tend toward conservatism, it is be- cause conservatism, at least theoretically, mirrors his distrust of political routes to salvation.

(Excerpt) Read more at unz.org ...


TOPICS: History; Music/Entertainment; Poetry; Religion
KEYWORDS: dylan
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To read past the jump, go to the TOC and navigate to page 57. I found a paper copy of this 1970 magazine in some of my old stuff. And I dedicate this thread to the FReepers who profess to dislike Dylan – with a special shoutout to the many who will post only to disparage his vocal ability.
1 posted on 02/06/2013 10:15:25 AM PST by don-o
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To: scott says

ping the list?


2 posted on 02/06/2013 10:16:28 AM PST by don-o (He will not share His glory and He will NOT be mocked! Blessed be the name of the Lord forever.)
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To: Merciful_Friend; wardaddy

ping


3 posted on 02/06/2013 10:17:38 AM PST by don-o (He will not share His glory and He will NOT be mocked! Blessed be the name of the Lord forever.)
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To: nuconvert; 185JHP; Dr. Eckleburg; TruthRespecter; fnord; Michael.SF.; pissant; Sword_of_Gideon; ...

ping

I find out that scott says has not posted in a while, Found a few names on his FR home page


4 posted on 02/06/2013 10:24:53 AM PST by don-o (He will not share His glory and He will NOT be mocked! Blessed be the name of the Lord forever.)
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To: don-o
with a special shoutout to the many who will post only to disparage his vocal ability

LOL

I rate Dylan 2 out of 10 on vocal ability, and 9 out of 10 on songwriting talent.

The only reason he doesn't get a 10 out of 10 on songwriting is his frequent use of "ain't", which for some reason really grates on me.

5 posted on 02/06/2013 10:30:20 AM PST by Leaning Right
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To: Leaning Right

9 out of 10 ain’t bad, is it? I would rate John Prine and Leonard Cohen up in that area, though they both fall way short in terms of sheer volume.

I did a little research on the writer, Steven Goldberg. Have not found anything else he wrote about Dylan. He was a Professor of Sociology at CCNY and did write about Patriarchy. I found a comment from him that Wiki articles presenting his views had been regularly deleted.

I find his insights on Dylan, only seven years in to his musical career, to be right on the money.


6 posted on 02/06/2013 10:42:25 AM PST by don-o (He will not share His glory and He will NOT be mocked! Blessed be the name of the Lord forever.)
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To: don-o

Dylan never had much of a singing voice. But he has written and performed great melodies and arrangements.

Singer, songwriter, bandleader.

He could do like Carlos Santana, and have somebody else sing.


7 posted on 02/06/2013 10:42:45 AM PST by truth_seeker
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To: don-o

Did Dylan die?


8 posted on 02/06/2013 10:45:32 AM PST by cuban leaf (Were doomed! Details at eleven.)
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To: don-o

I thought it was the poetry of Kant. I guess it depends on who’s professin’


9 posted on 02/06/2013 10:46:01 AM PST by cornelis
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To: don-o

I really came to like Bob Dylan through listening to his XM radio show. There’s a lot more to the guy than most people give credit and I’m sure he could care less what anyone thinks of his vocal abilities ;-)


10 posted on 02/06/2013 10:46:53 AM PST by bigbob
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To: don-o

I’ve loved Dylan’s music from my early teen-his mistrust of that era’s liberal government and the admonition to suck it up and fight on are something I can still relate to-likely because I’m still as much of a rebel ass every.


11 posted on 02/06/2013 10:47:19 AM PST by Texan5 ("You've got to saddle up your boys, you've got to draw a hard line"...)
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To: Texan5

Make that “teens”-and while I may be a rebel “ass”, I’m still AS much of a rebel...


12 posted on 02/06/2013 10:52:04 AM PST by Texan5 ("You've got to saddle up your boys, you've got to draw a hard line"...)
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To: cuban leaf
Did Dylan die?

He almost did a couple of times.

13 posted on 02/06/2013 10:57:35 AM PST by don-o (He will not share His glory and He will NOT be mocked! Blessed be the name of the Lord forever.)
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To: don-o

The only reason I ask is that it seems the information in question could most easily be acquired by simply asking him.


14 posted on 02/06/2013 11:02:30 AM PST by cuban leaf (Were doomed! Details at eleven.)
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To: cuban leaf

It is magical that Dylan has managed to resist being pigeon holed politically, the left has tried to absorb him for more than 50 years and just can’t get it done.


15 posted on 02/06/2013 11:11:00 AM PST by ansel12 (Romney is a longtime supporter of homosexualizing the Boy Scouts (and the military).)
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To: don-o

I like his lyrics.
Many of his melodies I like.
I don’t think he did bad at acting, either.
Lastly, I certainly hope he outlives me - because as
long as he is alive I will always be ‘next to the last’ worst singer on earth.

:) (just playin’ with you)


16 posted on 02/06/2013 11:15:21 AM PST by Verbosus (/* No Comment */)
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To: cuban leaf

It’s not that simple. He’s changed his name.


17 posted on 02/06/2013 11:17:54 AM PST by cornelis
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To: don-o

His vocal ability? 10 on the scale of 10, the same as that of Louis Armstrong (whom the ‘racism’ obsessed wouldn’t dare to criticize), the same as any bluesman or authentic folk singer white or black. You want Enrico Caruso, listen to Enrico Caruso! If you don’t get it, admit that you don’t get it!


18 posted on 02/06/2013 11:18:45 AM PST by Revolting cat! (Bad things are wrong! Ice cream is delicious!)
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To: Revolting cat!

That’s right, cat. Everybody’s a 10, get it?


19 posted on 02/06/2013 11:23:07 AM PST by cornelis
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To: cuban leaf; a fool in paradise; Slings and Arrows

There was an extensive interview with Zimmy a few months ago in Rolling Stone (I wouldn’t pay a Canadian cent for that rag, and read it in a B&N Starbucks cafe, but since I wouldn’t pay a Zimbabwean cent for a Starbucks coffee, I didn’t buy a drink either!) where he wouldn’t let the interviewer pin him down on politics, though he did express some standard moonbat sympathies, I’m afraid.


20 posted on 02/06/2013 11:23:28 AM PST by Revolting cat! (Bad things are wrong! Ice cream is delicious!)
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To: cornelis

Ever heard Hasil Adkins?


21 posted on 02/06/2013 11:24:48 AM PST by Revolting cat! (Bad things are wrong! Ice cream is delicious!)
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To: Revolting cat!
Bob Dylan in '08.

"Poverty is demoralizing,'' he said. "You can't expect people to have the virtue of purity when they are poor. But we've got this guy out there now who is redefining the nature of politics from the ground up — Barack Obama. He's redefining what a politician is, so we'll have to see how things play out. Am I hopeful? Yes, I'm hopeful that things might change. Some things are going to have to."

22 posted on 02/06/2013 11:30:33 AM PST by what's up
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To: cuban leaf
Dylan has never been easy to "pin down" save a few years in the late 70's. But, he leaves little clues as in this Interview in November

Do you ever worry that people interpreted your work in misguided ways? For example, some people still see "Rainy Day Women" as coded about getting high.
It doesn't surprise me that some people would see it that way. But these are people that aren't familiar with the Book of Acts.

23 posted on 02/06/2013 11:32:33 AM PST by don-o (He will not share His glory and He will NOT be mocked! Blessed be the name of the Lord forever.)
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To: what's up

Exactly. The word is “naive”.


24 posted on 02/06/2013 11:33:08 AM PST by Revolting cat! (Bad things are wrong! Ice cream is delicious!)
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To: what's up

What is the link to that quote in context?


25 posted on 02/06/2013 12:10:23 PM PST by ansel12 (Romney is a longtime supporter of homosexualizing the Boy Scouts (and the military).)
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To: don-o

Because when you say that his songs are cool but that “Dylan can’t sing”, the standard highly original lame reply on these pages, then who do you think ought to sing Dylan’s songs and how: Michael Buble, Liza Minelli, George Strait?

I purposely avoided hearing the Rolling Stones version of “Like a Rolling Stone”, believing that they or anyone can’t possibly add anything to it (some standards ought to remain untouchable), until I heard it on Youtube just yesterday. I had been correct, nothing was added in any way. You might have even thought that Al Kooper himself played the organ on the RS recording.


26 posted on 02/06/2013 12:38:57 PM PST by Revolting cat! (Bad things are wrong! Ice cream is delicious!)
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To: Revolting cat!

The only other singer I ever cared to hear sing Dylan’s songs is Joan Baez.


27 posted on 02/06/2013 12:49:31 PM PST by don-o (He will not share His glory and He will NOT be mocked! Blessed be the name of the Lord forever.)
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To: don-o

Dylan is an Obama voter and has said as much.


28 posted on 02/06/2013 1:24:49 PM PST by dennisw (too much of a good thing is a bad thing --- Joe Pine)
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To: Revolting cat!
You might have even thought that Al Kooper himself played the organ on the RS recording.

How Al Kooper, who thought he was going to play lead guitar when he walked into the studio, came to play the organ on that track is a GREAT story in itself. That it is an iconic organ is just icing on the cake...so to speak.

29 posted on 02/06/2013 1:36:19 PM PST by newfreep (Breitbart sent me...)
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To: dennisw

Do you have the quote for that?


30 posted on 02/06/2013 2:00:19 PM PST by ansel12 (Romney is a longtime supporter of homosexualizing the Boy Scouts (and the military).)
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To: don-o; scott says

Thanks for the ping. I miss scott’s postings. Seems he hasn’t posted since May of 2011. Hope he is OK.


31 posted on 02/06/2013 2:01:46 PM PST by Liberty Valance (Keep a simple manner for a happy life :o)
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To: ansel12
Q: Did you hope or imagine that the election of President Obama would signal a shift, or that it was in fact a sea change?

A: I don't have any opinion on that. You have to change your heart if you want to change.

THERE is what Bob said in November 2012 - link in post 23.

32 posted on 02/06/2013 2:10:56 PM PST by don-o (He will not share His glory and He will NOT be mocked! Blessed be the name of the Lord forever.)
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To: don-o

I for one don’t need or seek a verification of my political views from entertainers or celebrities.


33 posted on 02/06/2013 2:18:27 PM PST by Revolting cat! (Bad things are wrong! Ice cream is delicious!)
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To: Revolting cat!

That is not what Bob (or the OP) is even about. Thread got hijacked into that - as usual.


34 posted on 02/06/2013 2:22:25 PM PST by don-o (He will not share His glory and He will NOT be mocked! Blessed be the name of the Lord forever.)
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To: Liberty Valance; scott says

I volunteer you to take on the Dylan ping list. What say?


35 posted on 02/06/2013 2:48:55 PM PST by don-o (He will not share His glory and He will NOT be mocked! Blessed be the name of the Lord forever.)
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To: don-o

That would be great don-o. Thank you.


36 posted on 02/06/2013 4:00:38 PM PST by Liberty Valance (Keep a simple manner for a happy life :o)
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To: what's up

“Poverty is demoralizing,’’ he said. “You can’t expect people to have the virtue of purity when they are poor.”


Too Much Of Nothing
by Bob Dylan

Now, too much of nothing
Can make a man feel ill at ease
One man’s temper might rise
While another man’s temper might freeze
In the day of confession
We cannot mock a soul
Oh, when there’s too much of nothing
No one has control

Say hello to Valerie
Say hello to Vivian
Send them all my salary
On the waters of oblivion

Too much of nothing
Can make a man abuse a king
He can walk the streets and boast like most
But he wouldn’t know a thing
Now, it’s all been done before
It’s all been written in the book
But when there’s too much of nothing
Nobody should look

Say hello to Valerie
Say hello to Vivian
Send them all my salary
On the waters of oblivion

Too much of nothing
Can turn a man into a liar
It can cause one man to sleep on nails
And another man to eat fire
Ev’rybody’s doin’ somethin’
I heard it in a dream
But when there’s too much of nothing
It just makes a fella mean

Say hello to Valerie
Say hello to Vivian
Send them all my salary
On the waters of oblivion

Copyright © 1967, 1970 by Dwarf Music; renewed 1995, 1998 by Dwarf Music


37 posted on 02/06/2013 4:08:20 PM PST by Liberty Valance (Keep a simple manner for a happy life :o)
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To: Liberty Valance

So you are going to take the Dylan ping list? There are names on scott says home page


38 posted on 02/06/2013 4:08:41 PM PST by don-o (He will not share His glory and He will NOT be mocked! Blessed be the name of the Lord forever.)
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To: don-o

No don-o. I thought you were doing it.


39 posted on 02/06/2013 4:13:28 PM PST by Liberty Valance (Keep a simple manner for a happy life :o)
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To: don-o

Disparage his vocal ability?

There is no one who can sing his songs nearly as well as he does.


40 posted on 02/06/2013 4:21:19 PM PST by xzins (Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It! True supporters of our troops pray for their victory!)
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To: ansel12

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/arts-post/post/bob-dylan-predicts-an-obama-win-a-landslide/2012/11/06/5cdbfd40-283c-11e2-b4e0-346287b7e56c_blog.html


41 posted on 02/06/2013 6:44:49 PM PST by dennisw (too much of a good thing is a bad thing --- Joe Pine)
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To: dennisw
Dylan is an Obama voter and has said as much.

Do you have the quote for that?

42 posted on 02/06/2013 8:12:58 PM PST by ansel12 (Romney is a longtime supporter of homosexualizing the Boy Scouts (and the military).)
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To: ansel12

Your rock n roll idol is an Obama voter...same as the rest


43 posted on 02/07/2013 4:10:18 AM PST by dennisw (too much of a good thing is a bad thing --- Joe Pine)
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To: dennisw

No wonder you can’t find your claimed quote, you can’t even read my posts on this thread.

You can’t prove your claim, so you lash out at the people that ask for your proof, really childish.


44 posted on 02/07/2013 11:22:47 AM PST by ansel12 (Romney is a longtime supporter of homosexualizing the Boy Scouts (and the military).)
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To: don-o

Salvation or individualism?


45 posted on 02/07/2013 11:28:24 AM PST by cornelis
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To: cornelis
Salvation or individualism?

I don't know what individualism is.

46 posted on 02/07/2013 11:54:22 AM PST by don-o (He will not share His glory and He will NOT be mocked! Blessed be the name of the Lord forever.)
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To: don-o
Well, I don't have to wonder that you know what salvation is.

And while I'm not the expert, the author would have it mean overcoming alienation from the One through mystical experience in the form of a tune. For that Dylan uses his egregious skill to stride fragmentation and string coincidences, feelings, and experience, to convey a universal melody. There is no need to delve the entire article for more, as it's more of the same. Symbols are abandoned but we return to Eden. Words preclude access, but poetry is the thing.

How about you? You have a predilection to mystic conservatism?

47 posted on 02/07/2013 4:35:45 PM PST by cornelis
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To: cornelis

Thing is this was written eight years before Bob resolved all that by coming to Christ. He was asking all the right questions. Then, he found the answer.


48 posted on 02/07/2013 5:25:31 PM PST by don-o (He will not share His glory and He will NOT be mocked! Blessed be the name of the Lord forever.)
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To: don-o
I don't know what individualism is.

My guess is that the author has no clue what the proper role of political philosophy is, or if he does, disdains it for being unable to accomplish what it actually can't accomplish.

It struck me how Goldberg's recognition of powerlessness (how does he say it?--confusion? fragmentation? endless repetition?) helps him to find music as a solace. For Goldberg, Dylan's poetry is salvific because it is the poetry of solace. We are capable of mystic feeling, therefore we are capable of salvation.

49 posted on 02/07/2013 5:38:20 PM PST by cornelis
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To: don-o
Jesus, Jesus, Jesus, the answer's always Jesus.

What Goldberg needs is deliverance from dualism. Maybe some Maritain's degrees of knowledge, or Dooyeweerd's sphere sovereignty.

There's a strange thing about how learning works. Familiar knowledge is a friendly stepping-stone to unfamiliarity. So here's Goldberg helping himself to some familiar knowledge on the way to understand Dylan. Alas, in the end, we learn more about Goldberg. Fragmentation, no doubt!

So, back to why you posted this in the first place--what does mysticism (there are all kinds) have to do with conservatism?

50 posted on 02/07/2013 6:34:09 PM PST by cornelis
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