Skip to comments.Princeton Mom to All Female Students: ‘Find a Husband’
Posted on 04/07/2013 2:25:11 AM PDT by 2ndDivisionVet
In the mid-seventies, Susan A. Patton was among the "200 pioneer women" to join Princeton University's previously all-male student body. As president of her alumni class, she recently attended an Anne-Marie Slaughterendorsed "Women and Leadership" event that "allowed current undergraduate women to speak informally with older and presumably wiser alumnae." But the "girls" in attendance "glazed over" discussing careerism, she found. So today she wrote an open letter to The Daily Princetonian telling "the daughters I never had" what she wished she'd said:
Forget about having it all, or not having it all, leaning in or leaning out ... Heres what nobody is telling you: Find a husband on campus before you graduate. Yes, I went there.
Oh no. She continues,
I am the mother of two sons who are both Princetonians. My older son had the good judgment and great fortune to marry a classmate of his, but he could have married anyone. My younger son is a junior and the universe of women he can marry is limitless. Men regularly marry women who are younger, less intelligent, less educated. Its amazing how forgiving men can be about a womans lack of erudition, if she is exceptionally pretty. Smart women cant (shouldnt) marry men who arent at least their intellectual equal. As Princeton women, we have almost priced ourselves out of the market. Simply put, there is a very limited population of men who are as smart or smarter than we are. And I say again you will never again be surrounded by this concentration of men who are worthy of you.
Well, this will definitely be awkward for any future non-Princeton girlfriends of that younger son.....
(Excerpt) Read more at nymag.com ...
As for Patton's elitist assumption that finding an "intellectual equal" outside of an Ivy League campus is next to impossible? Ugh. I'm not even going to unpack that one, but it's worth noting that this embarrassing window into how Ivy Leaguers talk to each other should be as cringe-inducing to modern audiences as Patton's take on gender relations is. Some of the dumbest and most intellectually incurious people I've known were in my class at Princeton. And some of the smartest I've known went to state schools, or community colleges, or didn't go to college.
Fundamentally, the woman is correct. The reality is that women like to marry in an upward fashion, and if they already are at the pinnacle of opportunity, their choices are already narrow and will get narrower over time.
That’s where Plenty of Fish, Match.com, JDate, Craigslist, FriendFinder, etc. etc. come in. One doesn’t have to date only people in their immediate circle anymore.
You are correct in that there are more options to meet people. I don’t think the woman is intending to say that women only should be looking at Yale or Harvard men to find a husband, but simply not to wait before looking, because me of similar accomplishment and age are already eyeing women younger than they to date and if these women wait until they are finished with their education before starting to look, they may find themselves aged out of the dating market and have to settle on less accomplished men if they want to be married at all.
Okay, Princeton gals, how’d you like that mother-in-law?
All terrifying prospects if you ask me! The author makes a very good point regarding what is or should be an instinctual behavior. Some women may bristle at what she attempted to tell them, but there is a very valid truthful point. Are there exceptions, sure there are, but for the majority it is a matter of marrying up the ladder.
There are very few men who like to date women who can match wits with them. It is not until later in the marriage does a man come to appreciate his wife's intelligence and her full potential/success.
Agree, Meadsjn — but what she is saying that while a person is in college, that is when they WILL be surrounded by the largest number to choose from who are on roughly the same intellectual equivalent. This is especially key for women if she is keen to get married and not have to “dumb down” pretend she isn’t interested in “book larnin’” She’s not saying great, smart quality men aren’t found elsewhere, or outside that particular university - she’s saying if you can find a good man young, GRAB HIM if you can if the iron is hot. Don’t wait until you are out in the workforce with maybe 1 in 10 coming up to you intellectually (or often LESS!) Face it, many men (including those who should have given it a thought) marry a woman because she is “cute” or nice to puppies and children, and don’t care if she knows John Adams from the beer Sam. Adams. Then the children grow up and he finds he married an airhead and he gets to pound his head up against the wall, wondering why she can’t grasp why voting for dumbocrat politicians is not in anyone’s best interest just because “they carrrre, and it’s for the chilllldrun.” Women who wait, find their pickings are slimmer. Then when they are 28-30 and “ready to settle down” she’ll find all the smart, good guys are already taken — either by the cupcake who wiggled her fanny at him on his first job while she was cleaning the coffee machine - or by the smart cookie who nailed him in college. She will have to beat the bushes harder than he will to find her intellectual soul mate. If a guy with an IQ of 130 marries a woman with an IQ of 100, it may work out. It DOESN’T often work out for the woman with the IQ of 130 who marries the guy with an IQ of 100. Wait too long and the educated ones are “taken” and you sure as hell don’t want to marry the idiot who doesn’t know “to” from “two” from “too.” She’ll end up killing him or herself.
She is saying: “For God’s sake, if you see a guy you really love, MARRY HIM — don’t wait until you establish your career and come back 8-10 years latter he took the cupcake.”
... or resent it.
Well, unfortunately this is EXACTLY what Charles Murray has been saying for 20 years-—that the elites are inbreeding and that they concentrate in”super zips”, or zip codes dominated by certain college degrees combined with income levels. It is also true that men almost never “marry up” either financially or intellectually (some professions are exceptions if the man had prestige or glamor, such as high profile actor, politician, or academic).
Dollar on the string guys, marry a submissive and be happy.
I see nothing wrong with this hype about what she said. What is “newsworthy” is someone to recommend actively seeking marriage with a person of the opposite sex. Now that’s what makes this “news” today. She’s be more in line with the headlines recommending a lesbian partner.
Men are also intimidated by smart women. 30 years ago, they wouldn’t ask me out when they found out I was an engineering major.
I was terrible and would go out with my girlfriends and pretend to be an elementary education major and the would flock around me.
I was told that I was too cute to be an engineering major. Back in the day I was naturally blnd, 5’ 7”, and very slim.
At least, my husband wasn’t ntimidated. Of course, he was one of the smartest engineers at my company.
There’s is a high concentration of kids with autism n the Silicon Valley and some suspect it’s because of the engineers that are married and having kids there.
I thought that in the 18-22 year-old age group, the women are a lot more mature than the men. Certainly, when I was that age, it was not inspiring to sit by guys in the cafeteria who bragged about how ‘faced’ they had been the night before that they had no idea how they got home. One evening, my friends and I had to dive under our table at dinner. Two tables of ‘men’ near us had a food fight and the food was flying over our table. They all ran off after the fight and left the mess for the cafeteria staff to clean up.
Needles to say, I wasn’t serious about marrying one of them. Perhaps the Ivy League women would be better off meeting someone in their summer job or internship, who is already graduated and is more mature.
The advantage of dating people in college is you can see them and platonicly hang out with them before dating. You also have access to people who know the guy.
My wife had similar experiences. She finihed High School in 2 years then an undergrad and masters at Johns Hopkins in another 4 years (engineering). She was a bit awkward around men and had trouble in the normal dating scene. Luckily for me her brother was near by at Annapolis and she had a weakness for men in uniform. I met her through a dating site and she later told me that once she saw the pictures of me in my flight suit and dress blues she decided I was the one. Ten years and three kids later we’re still going strong. I’m lucky she didnt’t judge me by my SAT scores...
Replace “intelligence” as the desired trait in the article to “moral character”. Now you’ve got something worth looking for.
My advice to the men of Princeton is if you marry a Princeton gal GET A PRENUP!
They go Hand-in-Hand
Along with the consequences of it's abandonment
From Kipling - God's of the Copybook Headings
...On the first Feminian Sandstones we were promised the Fuller Life
(Which started by loving our neighbour and ended by loving his wife)
Till our women had no more children and the men lost reason and faith,
And the Gods of the Copybook Headings said: “The Wages of Sin is Death.”...
my husband certainly does not appreciate that I challenge his statements. Still hasn’t kicked me to the curb though.
Hello — you went to Annapolis. Even the GOAT of the class is still far above average. What you scored on a one time SAT test wouldn’t be a killer by any means. The fact that you got into Annapolis told her all she needed to know about your smarts, and the fact that you were THERE, rather than screwing around at BumFEgyptState told her you were more mature than the average man your age and had a game plan in mind for a career. All the service academies are about as selective as Ivy league, and sometimes more so. It also told her you had leadership skills. No real woman wants to marry a candyass.
Girls mature physically and mentally at an earlier age than boys. A 9-10 year old girl will often be taller than a boy her age. But girls plateau at an earlier age than boys, and the boys catch up and pass them. This is why I advised my oldest (early 20's) daughter to look at guys up to 30, rather than exclusively those her age.
A lot of guys never mature enough to satisfy some women, but part of that may come from women judging maturity according to a standard of "behaving like women think they should behave".
In college, the game for a long time has been for women to correctly recognize guys with good potential, and snag them before less-discerning women notice them. Women in the 30-35 age range keep whining that "the good men are all taken". Well, yes, that's what happens when you wait.
As an Ivy graduate the pool of options for wives was limitless. Any man worth his salt isn’t intimidated by smart women.
There are two lines of thought on this.
1) The “cupcake” is looking to “marry up” and the relationship from the man’s perspective is much less work for him at the beginning.
2) The intelligent woman is assumed to be looking to “marry up” and being her intellectual peer can be rather competitive and is significantly more effort.
the long term outlook for option #1 is low.
As gem noted, the service academies select for a more well-rounded individual (intelligence plus leadership potential plus aggressiveness) than places that just go by IQ. An Annapolis grad is well within the top fraction of 1% in terms of ability to succeed in life.
——— Women in the 30-35 age range-——
if unmarried, are spinsters but may not know it
Oh so very true. One of the most intellectually curious people I've known and who read all kinds of books on ancient history worked the tool counter at a local contractor supply house. Conversely, some of the most dogmatic and close minded and incurious carry degrees from big name schools.
No no. I should have been more specific. Her brother went to Annapolis and she developed an affinity for military men after visiting him multiple times. I’m an Army officer. I had a 4-year ROTC scholarship at a private military academy. I was already an aviation branch captain when I met my wife. Not an academy grad.
She learned to dislike the military though when I got sent to Iraq for 15 months. We got through it.
Army, navy, being a military officer still pegs you as a man of high ability.
I’m a guy who married “up” at the time. I was finishing college, and my wife was a few years older with an established career. She continues to have an inferiority complex regarding intellectual issues which drives me nuts. She is extremely smart and is brilliant with our finances. 10 years of marriage later my career is only starting to catch-up with hers.
The advantage of dating people in college is you can see them and platonicly hang out with them before dating. You also have access to people who know the guy.
This was my situation. I met my husband the last semester in college, and I didn’t know him, but many folks that I knew had grown up with him and knew his background and would always say, “he’s a really good guy.” As time went on this became more and more apparent.
So far he’s a keeper, after 26 years. ;) I’m extremely glad I married him so early — got me one of the good ones ...
Thanks for the compliment.
And to add to the above, many friends would make fun of us for spending so much time together and for marrying so young ...I think a lot of them, to this day, have never married.
And I do believe we are an intellectual match ..which is the glue that keeps us together, as we can usually figure out any difficult situation, and do it together. Dated plenty of nice looking guys, but most of them were really dumb ... I’ll take a smart, witty guy any day over the hunk with no brain.
Her son is a junior at Princeton so the obvious purpose of this is to get her (nerdy?) son to marry up. She probably blew her sales pitch as she's clearly part of the package deal and calls the shots.
But again, you STILL were a “man with a plan” and obviously a real man and not a little boy still making fart noises with his hand and armpit! At least if you did you had enough sense not to do it in front of ladies! Military academy grads are still a far cut above average.
“Some of the dumbest and most intellectually incurious people I’ve known were in my class at Princeton. And some of the smartest I’ve known went to state schools, or community colleges, or didn’t go to college.”
Flick, I used to tend bar part time at a fancy polo club in Texas. I have to tell you that these wealthy folks were the dumbest, dullest customers I’d ever had, and lousy tippers to boot. I would rather have worked a neighborhood joint any day. The best guys for conversation are very often the curious, well read, blue collar workers, as they are the most original thinkers and don’t have the habit of regurgitating what someone else thinks is correct.
You are correct, and I wish I was taught this type of thinking as a young woman. A lot of women my age were taught about how to get ahead on our own and not a lot about dealing with men. My mother openly ridiculed relatives who “had to have a man” “get to the alter first” or “fawn over their husband.” All this gets you is a chip on your shoulder. I am not married and have surpassed the big 40. I wonder why.
I have exactly two single female friends over the age of 30 (one is in her 60’s and divorced). I’d rather spend time with my happily married friends or those not desperate for a partner than miserable complaining single women.
if unmarried, are spinsters but may not know it"
There are exceptions. I met my now-husband at the age of 31, and married him at 33. He's the soulmate God had in mind for me, and I'm so thankful I didn't make the leap any earlier.
Agreed. Tiger moms are bad enough, but Tiger MIL’s?
Ivy League grads who “missed” the opportunity to marry (too) young at or before age 22 can take advantage of post-graduate Ivy League online dating sites for their first or second (or third) marriage such as:
“The Right Stuff”
It’s what they intend to do, anyway.
Meanwhile, however, they’d like to waste a little space on the rolls of yet another erstwhile male college that’s gone “modern.”
It's not too late, if you still have interest in getting married. You just have to be willing to be open to approaches by guys over 50.
I have never heard of a single school that required or solicited IQ test results as part of the admission process.
You know the SAT tests that every high school kid took as part of the college application process?
The SAT test was essentially originally an IQ test (at least it was prior to about 1994). It's been screwed over so much that today that may no longer be the case, but that's what it originally was.