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Remington reaches settlement for rifles with defective trigger
Ravalli Republic ^ | 7-7-2014 | Mike Dennison

Posted on 07/07/2014 5:48:48 PM PDT by Citizen Zed

The Remington Arms Co. has reached a nationwide settlement of claims that most of its Model 700 bolt-action hunting rifles have a defective trigger mechanism – a settlement likely to include the recall of millions of the popular firearm.

Richard Barber, a Montana man who’s been saying for a dozen years that many of the Model 700 are defective and should be recalled, indicated Monday that a recall is part of the settlement.

Barber’s 9-year-old son, Gus, was killed by a Model 700 rifle in a 2000 hunting accident in Montana. The family says the rifle fired when Barber’s wife, Barbara, released the safety as she prepared to unload the weapon. The bullet passed through a horse trailer and hit Gus, who was standing behind the trailer.

(Excerpt) Read more at m.ravallirepublic.com ...


TOPICS: Chit/Chat
KEYWORDS: banglist
I guess the moral of the story is, only point it where you intend to shoot it.
1 posted on 07/07/2014 5:48:48 PM PDT by Citizen Zed
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To: Citizen Zed

I’ve got one of those.


2 posted on 07/07/2014 5:52:31 PM PDT by F15Eagle (1Jn4:15;5:4-5,11-13;Mt27:50-54;Mk15:33-34;Jn3:17-18,6:69,11:25,14:6,20:31;Ro10:8-11;1Tm2:5-6;Ti3:4-7)
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To: Citizen Zed

I remember talking rifles with someone I worked with a couple of years back and this very subject came up. I never figured it would take this long to settle. I’ve long since swapped out “Katie’s” factory trigger for a Timney.

The basics of gun safety would help reduce the number of accidents to a bare minimum.


3 posted on 07/07/2014 5:53:14 PM PDT by Antihero101607
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To: Citizen Zed

I got a new trigger put in my 700 a couple of years ago.


4 posted on 07/07/2014 5:55:43 PM PDT by TBall
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To: TBall

Defect or not. Obviously no muzzle control. The bird is in your hand err the rifle. If it goes bang when you are holding it is your responsibility. It was not pointed in a safe direction.
I do sincerely empathize with your mistake.


5 posted on 07/07/2014 6:14:49 PM PDT by glyptol
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To: Citizen Zed

I’ve had a model 700 for the last 43 years. Never had a problem with it.


6 posted on 07/07/2014 6:22:08 PM PDT by Ruy Dias de Bivar (Sometimes you need more than seven rounds, Much more.)
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To: Citizen Zed

I have an old Remington mode 582 .22 bolt action. It is odd for a .22LR in that it has six locking lugs.

The trigger on mine went bad several years ago. It was probably intended to be a better than average trigger as it has absolutely no take up. Unfortunately it eventually got to where it needed just a little more as no matter how hard you pulled it, the gun would not fire.

I took it apart and soaked it with penetrating fluid then sprayed it with molybdenum spray. It began to work again but after a couple of years it sometimes does it again. I might check to see but since it was made in the early 70s, probably not on the list.


7 posted on 07/07/2014 6:23:25 PM PDT by yarddog (Romans 8: verses 38 and 39. "For I am persuaded".)
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To: Citizen Zed

I think they’ve had at least 2 recalls on that rifle. But accidents can also be caused by carelessness.


8 posted on 07/07/2014 6:27:05 PM PDT by smokingfrog ( sleep with one eye open (<o> ---)
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To: Citizen Zed

I have two Remington 700s, and there is nothing wrong with the trigger in either of them.

The model 700 is a superb rifle.


9 posted on 07/07/2014 6:29:07 PM PDT by ought-six ( Multiculturalism is national suicide, and political correctness is the cyanide capsule.)
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To: Ruy Dias de Bivar

I’ve had mine for 20 years now,no problems here either.


10 posted on 07/07/2014 6:29:59 PM PDT by Farmer Dean (stop worrying about what they want to do to you,start thinking about what you want to do to them)
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To: ought-six

Mine shoots straight. And to be honest, I never use the safety.

11 posted on 07/07/2014 6:36:26 PM PDT by Delta 21 (Its my freedom. YES. I will be keeping it.)
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To: ought-six
I have two Remington 700s, and there is nothing wrong with the trigger in either of them.

Here's a little more info on issues with the design (raised by the designer himself).

vid link

12 posted on 07/07/2014 6:38:10 PM PDT by Gunslingr3
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To: Delta 21
Mine shoots straight. And to be honest, I never use the safety.

Yep. At the end of the day point the damn thing in the right direction - at all times.

13 posted on 07/07/2014 6:39:31 PM PDT by Gunslingr3
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To: Citizen Zed

What is it about not pointing your weapon towards the ground whenever you fiddle with it .....???


14 posted on 07/07/2014 6:41:39 PM PDT by SkyDancer (If you don't read the newspapers you are uninformed. If you do read newspapers you are misinformed)
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To: Delta 21

Nice group!


15 posted on 07/07/2014 6:41:41 PM PDT by ought-six ( Multiculturalism is national suicide, and political correctness is the cyanide capsule.)
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To: Citizen Zed

Way back in the 1980’s a friend brought his M700 in 7mm mag over to my place telling me “there’s something wrong with the trigger.” I took it outside, aimed it in a safe direction, loaded the chamber, and activated the trigger. Nothing happened. I held it to my shoulder for a few more seconds and BOOM! I told him don’t even load the gun - take it to a smith and have it repaired. Since then I’ve never tried to fire another M700. All my bolt actions are Rugers and I’ve never had an issue with any of them.


16 posted on 07/07/2014 6:49:29 PM PDT by 43north (BHO: 50% black, 50% white, 100% RED.)
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To: Delta 21
 photo DSC00156copy.jpgThis 3 shot group was fired at a measured 23 yards. The gun was a Daisy springer and with inexpensive Daisy pellets. Both the gun and pellets interestingly, came from Spain. I was using the roof of my car as a rest. My Grandson now has the gun.
17 posted on 07/07/2014 6:50:28 PM PDT by yarddog (Romans 8: verses 38 and 39. "For I am persuaded".)
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To: Citizen Zed

I don’t think there is anything “wrong” with the 700 trigger. I’ve owned several for over 30 years. I’ve also used about 100 other bolt action trigger mechanisms, and some are safer than others.

A safety that locks the striker is safer than one that just locks the trigger or disengages sear actuation, but safe handling is the primary factor in safety.


18 posted on 07/07/2014 6:54:00 PM PDT by SampleMan (Feral Humans are the refuse of socialism.)
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To: Gunslingr3

Are you aware that they have NEVER, that is NEVER, been able to make the trigger malfunction in that manner?


19 posted on 07/07/2014 6:55:03 PM PDT by SampleMan (Feral Humans are the refuse of socialism.)
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To: Gunslingr3

Well, I’ve had both of mine since well before 2006, so the recall would not pertain to mine. Good to know, though, in case I entertained getting a new one.


20 posted on 07/07/2014 6:55:47 PM PDT by ought-six ( Multiculturalism is national suicide, and political correctness is the cyanide capsule.)
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To: yarddog

8yr old grand daughter is here for the week. Gonna break out some of those expensive .22lr and do some schoolin.


21 posted on 07/07/2014 6:56:40 PM PDT by Delta 21 (Its my freedom. YES. I will be keeping it.)
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To: Delta 21

I started my daughter off with a .22 single shot. If I had to do it again, I might choose a Daisy model 953 pellet gun to start with. Economy is part of the reason but noise also.

Still a .22 single shot is a fine beginners gun.


22 posted on 07/07/2014 7:00:36 PM PDT by yarddog (Romans 8: verses 38 and 39. "For I am persuaded".)
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To: 43north

When Remington began balking on this years ago, it was all I needed to go looking for equal and better rifles. I lucked onto a Ruger M77 UltraLite “Mountain Rifle” and it groups better than I can shoot and you never have to wonder about the action.


23 posted on 07/07/2014 7:07:54 PM PDT by X-spurt (CRUZ missile - armed and ready.)
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To: SkyDancer

There are far too many people who cannot think of more than one thing at a time. The mere moving of a gun so that the barrel crosses me or another person is infuriating. Drives me nuts, and quite angry at these people. There are either one of two things to remember—NEVER POINT THE DAM THING AT ANOTHER PERSON, or ASSUME THE WEAPON IS LOADED AND READY TO FIRE until determined otherwise. The first should be followed at all times.

Of all the people who do own guns, the percentage of people stupidly handling guns is extremely low, but a flashpoint for the libtards to advance gun control, and unfortunately can be fatal.


24 posted on 07/07/2014 7:24:12 PM PDT by SgtHooper (This is not my tag!)
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To: yarddog

I swear yarddog, the image is so realistic I can reach out and touch the hole.


25 posted on 07/07/2014 7:26:05 PM PDT by SgtHooper (This is not my tag!)
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To: X-spurt

I had a model 700 Remington 350 rem mag that I bought for bear hunting. The safety was terrible, you could hear it for 100 yards. I tried to bend the plate out a little to cancel this noise but it broke. They wouldn’t send me a replacement part and wouldn’t let a local Remington certified repairman fix it. Bought me a Canjar replacement trigger instead, never looked back, except a mental note to never buy a Remington again.


26 posted on 07/07/2014 7:32:42 PM PDT by OftheOhio (never could dance but always could kata - Romeo company)
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To: ought-six

I have a 700 left hand 30-06. Shoots very nice. Did I mention it’s left hand?


27 posted on 07/07/2014 7:33:05 PM PDT by henkster (Do I really need a sarc tag?)
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To: SgtHooper

I had intended to shoot a five shot group but after the third shot there is no way I was going for 4. The group was only something like 6 thousandths of an inch center to center.


28 posted on 07/07/2014 7:33:48 PM PDT by yarddog (Romans 8: verses 38 and 39. "For I am persuaded".)
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To: SgtHooper

And they blamed the manufacturer for their own stupidity.


29 posted on 07/07/2014 7:41:20 PM PDT by SkyDancer (If you don't read the newspapers you are uninformed. If you do read newspapers you are misinformed)
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To: yarddog

Show off.

That’s ‘frog hair fine*’, ever seen frog hair?

(must be pretty fine...;-)

My first centerfire rifle was a 700 in .270Win.

Out to 300 that rifle will easily shoot with my bench rifle.

Never a smidgen* of malfunction. Really, its done its job better that I have.

If after a good thorough cleaning any firearm malfunctions, send it to the gunsmith.

Tragic unfortunate situation.

Important to handle a firearm properly, every time.


30 posted on 07/07/2014 7:41:25 PM PDT by glasseye
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To: OftheOhio

Have heard similar complaints from others.

How any respectable company can think they can pull this kind of crap and stay respected, is beyond me. They deserve to now have a second rate reputation.


31 posted on 07/07/2014 8:00:06 PM PDT by X-spurt (CRUZ missile - armed and ready.)
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To: X-spurt

My favorite is a Ruger Hawkeye compact stainless .308 with a grey/black laminate stock and a 2-7 variable scope. Lightweight, short, sturdy, accurate, and suitable for just about any North American animal on 4 or 2 legs.


32 posted on 07/07/2014 8:20:07 PM PDT by 43north (BHO: 50% black, 50% white, 100% RED.)
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To: Antihero101607

The basics of gun safety would help reduce the number of accidents to a bare minimum.
-=080=-
Didn’t you mean Zero ?


33 posted on 07/07/2014 8:26:32 PM PDT by S.O.S121.500 (Had ENOUGH Yet ? ........................ Enforce the Bill of Rights ......... It's the LAW !!!)
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To: SampleMan
Are you aware that they have NEVER, that is NEVER, been able to make the trigger malfunction in that manner?

I commend what I'm sure is a genuine spirit, but you have to learn to read public statements like the lawyers they were crafted by:

"Both Remington and experts hired by plaintiff attorneys have conducted testing on guns returned from the field which were alleged to have fired without a trigger pull," Remington's statement says, "and neither has ever been able to duplicate such an event on guns which had been properly maintained and which had not been altered after sale."

First they tried to blame dirty rifles on the customers. Now contrast that with the statement they sent accompanying the recall, and remember what the designer said about the inspection process in the video I linked earlier (you did listen to what the designer of the trigger said about it, right?)):

The trouble, according to Remington’s product notification, is that excess bonding agent used in the assembly of the X-Mark Pro trigger in some rifles can lead to unintentional discharge of the rifles. Remington says the only remedy is to send recalled rifles in for inspection, cleaning and testing. They stress that consumers shouldn’t try to clean the triggers themselves.

34 posted on 07/07/2014 11:31:35 PM PDT by Gunslingr3
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To: Delta2; Gunslingr3
Safety... always off
35 posted on 07/08/2014 3:33:18 AM PDT by Rodamala
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To: Citizen Zed

The 700 was introduced by Remington in 1962. In 40 years of experience with the 700 I have never experienced trigger defectiveness.


36 posted on 07/08/2014 3:42:45 AM PDT by Recompennation (Constitutional protection for all not ju st selectively for Democrats.)
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To: glyptol

I never shot anyone


37 posted on 07/08/2014 3:43:18 AM PDT by TBall
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To: Gunslingr3

I read everything that there was available after my father-in-law got spooked by ABC’s 60 Minutes hit piece on the 700. Hard to imagine ABC or 60 Minutes skewing a piece to trash a big corporate gun maker, huh?

Anyway, it was clear that the plaintiffs had never been able to replicate the theoretical issue that they claimed was the problem. And yes, I’ve watched the videos and listened to the statements of the plaintiffs and their expert witnesses, including the designer.

They were able to make modified trigger mechanisms with lightened sears go off by jarring the rifle. Not a big shocker there, and an issue that everyone should understand.

Safety mechanisms that lock or block the striker are generally best, but with enough wear that can fail too. I had a ‘95 Mauser that would fire when you disengaged the cam striker safety.

As the underlying claim against Remington was that foreign material in the trigger could cause the gun to accidently discharge, they addressed that in their public statement, because the lawyers certainly would not want to imply that the trigger mechanism was safe no matter how it was maintained or modified.

Like the Toyota accelerator problem, there is no underlying design issue here. Remington just finally decided to recall/settle to clear their books. My guess is that they are wanting to sell the operation and the issue makes valuation difficult.

The case boiled down to sad stories of people who had shot themselves or their children and who understandably didn’t want to think they were at fault. But any time that an accidental discharge kills someone in close proximity (without riquochette) the #1 problem safety failure was muzzle discipline. As for the designer, he believed he could have designed an even safer mechanism. OK, I don’t know many designers who don’t think they can perfect a previous design, but that doesn’t make the older design inherently bad.

There are many older guns that do become unsafe when heavily worn, but are perfectly safe when well maintained. Such as the old Marlin pump shotguns. You will find however, that the Marlin company has made a blacket CYA statement that the guns are now unsafe to shoot.

A similar but unrelated gun safety issue involves pre-800k ‘03 Springfield receivers. Anyone and everyone who thinks they know something about firearms will tell you that those receivers are brittle, unsafe, and shouldn’t be fired. However, that is not what the Army report said at all. After reports of receiver failures had started to gain ground, the Army conducted a full investigation. What they found was that every receiver failure had a barrel obstruction. But they did a full investigation and in that they also discovered that modern quality control techniques for measuring temperature were not being used in manufacture. Making differences in hardness possible depending upon the season of the year. They fixed that issue, and receivers after ~800k used exact measurements instead of color perception.


38 posted on 07/08/2014 4:50:00 AM PDT by SampleMan (Feral Humans are the refuse of socialism.)
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To: SkyDancer

Well, in this case there is blame on both sides, but still...


39 posted on 07/08/2014 7:28:19 AM PDT by SgtHooper (This is not my tag!)
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To: TBall

Don’t give up. Use the sights next time.


40 posted on 07/09/2014 5:04:09 PM PDT by B4Ranch (Name your illness, do a Google & YouTube search with "hydrogen peroxide". Do it and be surprised.)
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