Posted on 07/13/2015 6:30:51 AM PDT by Chance Hart
There is a huge difference between Civil Unrest, Public Protest, disagreement and sometimes even hatred for those that have differing political views or other agendas than your own. Many that are hard Left or hard Right are easy to identify only because they have a forum called Media (in all its varied forms) to expose their core beliefs to the masses on a daily basis. This is an Extremely Small portion of the population. Also, there are the people that you know well from family on down to casual acquaintances, which is again a Very Small group itself as compared to the population as a whole.
All of the above (and countless more scenarios) most usually are not life threatening. When the word WAR is attached though, it becomes a game changer. War is not just about disagreement and the private or public expression of it. War, for the most part is about killing your perceived enemy before they can do unto you. That being said, how would battle lines be drawn and how could you confidently identify your enemy if (God forbid) there was the spark that ignited a second Civil War contained within the borders of the United States?
In most past and present Civil Wars, including ours, there were and are things that make enemy identification less difficult. I will list a few of these and hope the more experienced FReepers can add to the list and the conversation.
1. Unlike most countries involved in past (including ours) and present Civil War the opposing sides are for the most part separated by the land mass. Not the case here, as we all pretty much live together in the same State, City, Neighborhood, Apartment buildings, etc. I could be more specific, but you get my point.
2. Unlike military combatants, we for the most part would not be in Uniform for identification.
3. What to do about the people that not only live close by, but live in your Mega Unit apartment complex and gated communities, etc. Which of these have chosen a side and will kill you and yours on site?
4. Will the military take sides?
5. What about the large number of criminals (or soon to be criminals) that are not into it for the outcome, but for the gratification of joining in on the mayhem for various other reasons.
I know that this in no way even touches the thousands of known and unknown potential scenarios that would be involved, but would like to hear your thoughts on the subject as it pertains to both the Right, The Left, the military, politicians, and the middle of the road, and others that may find themselves embroiled in such a ghastly situation.
Thanks in advance for your comments and expertise.
I notice when talking about any enemy of the left,
they don’t “seek to understand the grievances” of those who oppose them.
If a general insurrection develops in high minority population states occurs, I can see the sane states seceding form the mess. At some point the many states are going to unhook from DC.
In before this one gets pulled.
We are a nation of herbivores - and the Left knows it, having created the herd over generations of culture war victories.
They have won the culture war - what we are seeing is the mopping up and occupation.
Would the insurgents still receive their SS checks and Medicaire for the wounded. If not, the rebellion would collapse.
I’m sick of war. My father was an infantry soldier in WWII (N. Africa, Italy & Germany), shell-shocked all to hell. My great-great grandfather was a Confederate soldier during the Civil War (Shiloh). (Had no slaves; fought because “ya’ll are down heah!”) War is as close to hell as we can get on this side of life.
There doesn’t need to be a war. All we need to do is read take the media propaganda machine.
I agree with the others; War is HELL!
With that being said and my general opposition to a Civil War, which I have seen being egged on since the 1970’s with a hiatus during the 80’s. I believe that eventually it’s going to come down to those within the outerbelts of the various cities and those outside of those limits.
Seriously people, pray that Civil War II never happens.
Yes the military will take sides but the current administration won’t like the outcome.
> They have won the culture war - what we are seeing is the mopping up and occupation.
Maybe so but they cannot win the spiritual war of good vs evil and they know that. Even evil know God exists but they don’t want to acknowledge it. I have had several former atheists tell me that they always felt that there was a God but didn’t want to be labeled “stupid” by their fellow atheists by having that discussion. They know as do the evildoers. They are just ignoring Him so they can do whatever the please...for now.
War is about imposing your will on your enemy. Sometimes they will acquiesce sometimes you have to use force, sometimes you have to destroy them.
What is shameful is when we have the means to oppose war being conducted against us and we don’t even recognize what is happening. Such is the case with Iran, who has repeatedly and openly declared the United States to be the most significant evil country on the planet, and Israel, the second most evil.
It just shows that we are engaged in a war being conducted on a spiritual level, but the secular US is entirely blind to the dangers.
Should another civil war come to these United States, it will begin amid confusion. Unless a general call to war is announced, the first volley would be relatively confusing if not entirely mis-interpreted. There are those that are at the breaking point of frustration with the handbasket trip to hell the current administration is taking us on and have probed the local establishments to test their reaction (anyone remeber Nevada???).
However, the next CW will begin locally and expand once the premise is understood and the beligerants identified.
How to give them enough rope to hang themselves with?
The reason some people chose to fight a war is they know the alternatives are worse.
Blacks have already started murdering their “enemies”. Elderly whites and solo whites, out by themselves.
1. If the left starts their war, I expect the absence of borders/separation to lead to a situation like Bosnia. As with that country, enclaves neighborhoods, towns, counties, and states can alternate on which faction dominates. That is a formula for ugly. I hope America's enemies will take that into account as they decide whether to force a civil war.
2. Many of us wear uniforms, whether or not they are issued. Many Obama-voters wear their pants halfway down, dress like Pajama Boy, or otherwise communicate their treason. Most decent people dress like they have jobs and work hard. The absence of uniforms will not interfere with forming reasonable suspicions on each person's leanings.
3. What to do about neighbors is a tough question. I have a neighborhood voter registration map that shows Obamavoters and decent people. It's nice to know which people I'm likely to deal with are parasites.
4. The military will be split but mostly patriotic. That will be a source of chaos or order, possibly exploited by liberal petty tyrants who will try to deceive the military. I will not trust emerging "conservative" leaders.
5. All criminals are criminals and are the enemy of decent people. It's our responsibility to keep our neighborhoods safe.
What happens to conservatives in California?
Lack of central organization, lukewarm support by the Catholic hierarchy, and absence of foreign assistance due to the American government disapproving of the Cristero rebellion doomed the Catholic loyalists against the anti-clericalism in the Mexico of the 1920s and 1930s. In the long term, the Catholics won due to massive resistance, including hiding priests from the authorities, secret Masses and sacraments, running out or even lynching anti-clerical public school teachers, etc. Slowly, the central government relented, modified, and by the 1980s entirely abandoned the anti-clerical measures.
In the Spanish case, while Republican and Nationalist supporters were scattered throughout the country, certain regions, like Andalusia, were strongly traditionalist, while others, like Catalonia, were radical and anti-clerical. Andalusia was Franco's base for his campaign to defeat the Republicans. Catalonia and the Basque country were the last holdouts to his authoritarian state, with guerrilla warfare continuing into the 1950s. We would likely have similar breakdowns. Oklahoma and Texas (except the border counties with Mexico), and the Upland South would be strongly conservatives, while New England and eastern New York, along with the coastal West, would be leftist strongholds. Areas with large rural black or Hispanic populations, such as the Mississippi Delta, would also support the leftist cause.
Another question is: how would the military break. One reason Franco won, as well as Pinochet in Chile in 1973, is that the military mostly sided with the rightist insurrection. The Salazar regime was overthrown in Portugal because the military stood down, and in the Cristero War, the military supported the leftist regime in the capital. The combat units in the Army and Marines will be the key, as well as the existence of strong mid-level officer support of a rebellion against a leftist government in Washington. The top generals and admirals tend to be co-opted by the elite and are often members of insider clubs like the Council on Foreign Relations. Leadership would have to come from officers at a lower rank. Remember that Obama has purged several hundred general officers in the last several years, likely for ideological reasons. Say what you will about Obama, but he knows history. Why isn't Hillary Clinton Vice President?
The best strategy for a rightist rebellion in this country is to adapt Michael Collins' strategy in the Irish War for Independence. The IRA developed a massive underground network in most of the country, isolated the Royal Irish Constabulary to their barracks, and countered Black and Tan atrocities with their own. Within a year, British authority was effectively limited to Dublin and the Protestant North. Exhausted from World War I, the British did not wish to commit massive resources to end the rebellion and conceded to Irish home rule and eventual independence. Using similar tactics, a rightist rebellion could isolate Federal authority to less than 20% of the country and effect practical secession of most of the nation.
I believe it will start when we reach our Greece moment and have forced austerity upon the gibsmedat crowd and forces a haircut upon us savers and responsible people. Yes, I’ll be very angry.
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