Futile Care: The Terri Schiavo Case

Newsmax/AP ^ | Friday, Oct. 17, 2003 | Diane Alden

[nickcarraway]

Blockbuster article by Diane Alden about Terri Schiavo AND the big picture. Long, but a must read.

[nickcarraway]

Blockbuster article by Diane Alden about Terri Schiavo AND the big picture. Long, but a must read.

[ForOurFuture]

Bump.

[independentmind]

Not taking fluids appears to actually reduce a person's discomfort, bloating, nausea, lung secretions, urinary frequency and pain, and is a good idea at the end of life in any case.

I think that someone needs to describe exactly what happens to a person who starves to death. When my father was dying, doctors told my family that it's one of the worse possible deaths and is extremely painful.

There are also many different levels of unconsciousness in those who experience brain damage. Doctors simply DO NOT KNOW the extent to which such patients actually experience pain. And anyone who says they do is LYING.

[Republic]

I am against anarchy.

But I also suffer bouts of hypocrisy.

Because if Terri is not fed and given drink tomorrow-then I stand with any citizens in Florida willing to take this matter into the people's hands.

This case is so devoid of human compassion and common sense it makes even the hardest of hearts crack.

I hope the people in the Hospice Ctr., willing to do wrong under the guise of a court order, reconsider and do the right thing.

The doctor or nurse or perhaps Mike, Terri's monstrous hsb., removed the tube that gave Terri food and drink is monster. A coward. A death monger.

Food and drink was the ONLY CARE SHE RECEIVED other than perhaps clean bedding and clothes.

Her hsb does not love her. He lives with another and is building a family. Terri must be a terrible inconvenience.

Her father says that Mike even DISALLOWED ANYONE to brush Terri's teeth for a TEN YEAR PERIOD!

What a hateful, disgusting, vile human being mike is..

[dandelion]

A bump for a powerful article. We must stop this madness. It is time to go down and take action.

I have been trying all month to scrape the money together to get to Florida. There is not enough money to get me there. It is maddening as hell to know that there are people in Florida who have not yet shown up and put themselves in the vigil. I nearly went to the hospital this week due to illness, but I am still trying to find a way to get to Florida. If you are in Florida, get to the vigil. Show up now. Do something to stop this. The time has come, and WE - not the Governor, not the Judges, not the attorneys - will be judged.

God give us strength to stand and protest, to make ourselves heard, to put our bodies in the way for you.

[candeee]

I feel confident that if Jeb Bush wanted to save her life, he would - as would his so called Christian brother, the President. Have they no shame allowing this cruelty, especially with the whole world watching? Either of them could instigate an investigation that would at the very least halt this murder temporarily.

[Graymatter]

I share your frustration, dandelion. And yours, Republic. But...Good people can't do wrong right. Mayhem with good intentions is most unlikely to save Terri Schiavo.
If Jeb Bush is the worst sort of politician, he's aware that this is a cardinal moment in his career and the press is salivating like hyenas, waiting to run "Disabled woman starved to death on Jeb's watch." Every gruesome detail of her ordeal will make every front page. He'll do something to avoid that.
And if he is a better man, he is going to do something and let the chips fall, to save her life.
Either way, give him time. He can issue orders to the people who DO know how to do these things. They'll go there holding papers, not hostages, and the results will bring no peril to anyone.

[OneTimeLurker]

Some will think this sounds ignorant but why doesn't the president order the Justice Dept. step in? Afterall, if they can go after doctors for prescribing medical marajuana and try to overturn the Oregon assisted suicide law, clearly principals of federalism don't concern them that much. Why not have the Justice Department file a lawsuit in federal court or something?

[Pegita]

See Post 95 on the Legal Solution thread for a Terri update ...

[cherry]

I don't think any of us knows for sure if starvation hurts, other than the empty feeling we all feel when we haven't eaten for several hours....

I would guess thought , that it is not painful....

but starvation is cruel in that it takes a long time....maybe up two weeks...

[dandelion]

My mother can tell you - she was a sharecropper's child during the depression, and she literally nearly starved to death. Yes, starvation hurts.

[windchime]

Bump!

[.30Carbine]

Behind this devaluation of human life is the philosophy of utilitarianism and materialism. That philosophy is the heart of both Nazism and Communism: The value of an individual is measured by his or her usefulness to the group.

...That road to hell is being prepared by the U.S. film, literati and TV culture as well, using the same kinds of propaganda on life-and-death issues that were being foisted on the German public by the cultural elites of the Third Reich.

Thank God for an another excellent exposition for Terri and for Life. These lines reminded me of the 1981 film starring Richard Dreyfus, "Whose life is it anyway?" That was my first exposure to the pro-death propaganda. The pro-death crowd has gained much ground since then.

I often wonder - and literally ask the proponents of death on demand - why they don't start "decreasing the surplus population" and "easing society's burden" by taking their own lives instead of others'.

[palmer]

Good article. I see a fairly clear difference between dying and being killed. People in terminal conditions may want to be left alone to die. In some cases their relatives may decline resuscitation measures. Some examples are terminal cancer cases, severe strokes, or fatal injuries. Killing, on the other hand, means taking the life of someone who has even a small chance of recovery or remaining in a state of existence that is at least somewhat meaningful. After watching the videos I think Terri's life clearly has some meaning. Although her chances for recovery may be small, she is not terminal and certainly not dying. She is not being "helped to die", she is being killed.

[GailA]

I emailed both Gov Bush and the AG. I called Gov Bush's office, called Sen Bill Frist's and Rep Ron Paul as both are doctors. I know many don't think highly of Frist, but it was worth the try. Maybe if enough of us called both Frist and Rep Ron Paul's offices it would help. It certainly can't hurt. Email at this point in time is a useless tool. Rep Ron Paul 202-225-2831, Sen Bill Frist 202-224-3344:

I kept repeating to their people we don't treat rapid mad dogs or convicted killers in so INHUMANE a way.

[cyn]

TERRI has been without water for longer than we knew -- 72 hrs + now, it looks like. Gov. Bush -- Please act now -- have faith and courage! Our prayers continue to all involved in this, especially ‘behind the scenes’.

We are told to continue calls & emails, that they do make a difference -- please pass this on to mailing lists and friends.

Jeb.Bush@MyFlorida.com
fl_governor@eog.state.fl.us
phone -- 850 - 488 - 4441
FAX -- 850 - 922 - 4292

FL atty Gen. Charlie Crist email -- ag@oag.state.fl.us
PHONE -- 850 - 487 - 1963
FAX -- 850 - 487 - 2564

I have to go -- pls someone post this info to every new thread, along w/abuse report info to follow. Thanks

[cyn]

If you are convinced that what Terri Schiavo has been experiencing over the last several years and now is cruel and inhumane, call the FL Abuse Hotline 1 - 800 - 962 - 2873

At a certain point, you will hear this message: "The safety and well being of Florida's most vulnerable citizens is very important. Persons making reports in good faith are not subject to prosecution. Intentional false reporting is a violation of FL law."

This is when you need to carefully consider if you truly believe this is abuse or neglect.

You will be asked a number of questions on this long form -- all allegations are truly taken seriously! Most of us know those answers from our visits to the http://www.terrisfight.org website (address of victim, age, what your concerns are). Some I didn't know (phone number of facility).

The person taking the information was businesslike but sympathetic ("trained counselors" take the calls).

~~~~ ~~~~ ~~~~

I am convinced that a precious citizen of the state of FL is being abused -- so I made the call. I'd expressed my concerns to the governor, and he said he's concerned, too, so I figure I'm in good company.

[cyn]

If, God forbid, despite all our efforts, Terri dies -- I respectfully ask the Pinellas County Medical Examiner's office, in light of the high profile and many questions surrounding Terri's initial collapse and subsequent treatment, to do their own complete investigation, and to do a full autopsy.

Have to go, Republic -- hug & prayers. Please post above and this info as you can. Thanks.