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Getting close not enough for McNabb (BARRRFFFF!!!!!)
Chicago Sun-Times ^ | January 19, 2004 | JAY MARIOTTI SUN-TIMES COLUMNIST

Posted on 01/19/2004 10:02:49 AM PST by Chi-townChief

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To: ConservativeMan55
bttt
41 posted on 01/19/2004 12:44:59 PM PST by lainde (Heads up...We're coming and we've got tongue blades!!)
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To: Jhensy
As a Giants fan who is not particularly enthralled with Kerry Collins as our QB

The Panthers employed Kerry Collins when he was the captain of the NFL All-Star Drinking Team. (We don't want him back either.)

42 posted on 01/19/2004 12:55:12 PM PST by DeFault User
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To: Chi-townChief
Here's what I don't get about this whole thing. Why should McNabb care what Limbaugh thinks? It's not like Limbaugh was the coach or owner, and thus had power over his career -- he was somebody pontificating on a poorly-watched sports show. Big deal.

And according to McNabb's father, racists breaking into your new home and causing horrible physical damage to your house is morally equivalent to Rush Limbaugh making a stupid comment on a sports show. What nonsense. When I read Sam McNabb's ridiculous comments in yesterday's paper, I rooted against his son, and his son's team.

43 posted on 01/19/2004 1:01:34 PM PST by NYCVirago
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To: Packer Pete
"This guy has been waiting for weeks for the Eagles post-season to end, with only a slight change in script already played out in his head. Had the Eagles won the SuperBowl, he'd have rubbed Rush's face in what he would have documented as McNabb's brilliant, championship-winning play."

Exactly! How else are shallow, pouty, untalented nobodies like him and Al Franken going to get noticed by anybody unless they can find a way to tie their star to a talented somebody that they and all their friends are all jealous of and hate? Hahahaha

44 posted on 01/19/2004 1:04:45 PM PST by Matchett-PI (Why do America's enemies desperately want DemocRATS back in power?)
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To: Chi-townChief
The reason this Chicago sportwriter believes that an average quarterback is so above-average is because the author hails from a town with a WAY below-average football team.
45 posted on 01/19/2004 1:11:54 PM PST by The KG9 Kid (Semper Fi)
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Comment #46 Removed by Moderator

To: Chi-townChief
Could someone please post that Sports Illustrated pic from a few years back showing the football player puking?
47 posted on 01/19/2004 1:53:14 PM PST by RightWingAtheist
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To: Chi-townChief
As one who thought Rush's comment was stupid as it is obvious how it would be perceived, it certainly was not *hate*.

Yes, over the top.
48 posted on 01/19/2004 2:05:36 PM PST by cyncooper ("We call evil by its name")
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To: lainde
BUMP!
49 posted on 01/19/2004 2:25:55 PM PST by ConservativeMan55 (You...You sit down! You've had your say and now I'll have mine!!!!)
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To: Chi-townChief
''Most of the Hall of Fame quarterbacks never won the Super Bowl. You do the math on that.''

Yep. Guys like Otto Graham, may he rest in peace, Norm van Brocklin, Sid Luckman, Y.A. Tittle, et al. never won a Super Bowl. I did the math, and it says that THERE WAS NO SUPER BOWL WHEN THEY PLAYED, Numbnuts! But they all won championships.

50 posted on 01/19/2004 2:46:26 PM PST by mrustow
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To: Chi-townChief
Mariotti is my least favorite of the panelists on Around The Horn. Michael Holley and Adande are the best because they don't need to shout to make their points.
51 posted on 01/19/2004 2:52:05 PM PST by JohnBDay
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To: Chi-townChief
Limbaugh's hatred?

What a joke.
52 posted on 01/19/2004 2:53:43 PM PST by CyberCowboy777 (Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.)
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To: Chi-townChief
This time, it wasn't Rush Limbaugh spewing hatred.

Rush Limbaugh spewing hatred? Mariotti is an idiot.

53 posted on 01/19/2004 3:22:38 PM PST by judgeandjury
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To: Lando Lincoln
Heyyyy! Landoooo!
What gets me are all the comments post game on last night's thread by those who said McNabb "tanked" this game by "taking himself out". Apparently the decision was not his-Reid took him out. And it would seem that McNabb's injury was more serious than people thought.
54 posted on 01/19/2004 3:26:44 PM PST by jaugust (Old Curmudgeon)
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To: kinghorse
McnNabb was forced to be a pocket passer and hilarity ensued. The Panther coaches even said ahead of time what they were going to do. Pretty funny watching Mr. Limited imagination get folded, spindled and mutilated.

I have to disagree. There were so many drops I lost count. At least one and probably two of the intercepts were clearly the receiver's fault. Pinkston was awful.

55 posted on 01/19/2004 3:31:09 PM PST by lasereye
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To: 2banana
Rush should sue for libel and make them prove it....

I might be mistaken...but the burden of proof is typically upon the plaintiff...

You cant just hurl allegations via tort, and then sit back and wait for the defendant to disprove them

You will end up very broke very fast with that strategy

56 posted on 01/19/2004 3:35:46 PM PST by antaresequity
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To: mrustow
My thoughts exactly. I think what's needed for some of these guys is an NFL history lesson.
57 posted on 01/19/2004 3:39:56 PM PST by jaugust (Old Curmudgeon)
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To: cyncooper; Chi-townChief
Dan Marino is known as one of the five best quarterbacks ever, but despite his many records, he'll never go down as the best because he didn't win a Super Bowl when Joe Montana, John Elway and Brett Favre did.

So who's the fifth? Unitas? This is the second time in the past year, I've seen a sportswriter mention "the five best quarterbacks ever," while only naming four. I wonder if the other time was the same guy, or this guy's just a copy cat. And the lists usually list only guys who played in the past 20 years, which is a giveaway, as to the writer's age.

I never see mention of the late Otto Graham on these lists. Although I never saw Graham play, even on old footage, based on the record and his stats, a case can be made that he was the greatest of them all: "led Cleveland Browns to 7 league titles in 10 years, winning 4 AAFC championships (1946-49) and 3 NFL (1950,54-55); 5-time All-Pro; 2-time NFL MVP (1953,55)." And he still has the record for the most yards per attempt.

Thursday, December 18, 2003

Graham won seven pro titles


Associated Press


CLEVELAND -- For 10 seasons, Otto Graham personified perfection, the Cleveland Browns and greatness. No quarterback has done it better.

The Hall of Famer, who led the Browns to 10 championship games in the 10 seasons he played for them, died Wednesday of an aneurysm to the heart. He was 82.

Graham died in Sarasota, Fla., team spokesman Todd Stewart said. Graham was taken to Sarasota Memorial Hospital earlier in the day with a tear in his aorta, said his son Duey.

Before Johnny Unitas, Joe Namath or Joe Montana, Graham set the bar for all NFL quarterbacks by winning more consistently than anyone else.

"The test of a quarterback is where his team finishes," said Paul Brown, Graham's coach in Cleveland. "By that standard, Otto Graham was the best of all time."

Graham helped the Browns become a football dynasty -- first in the All-America Football Conference and later in the NFL. He quarterbacked Cleveland teams in the 1940s and '50s that included Hall of Famers such as Marion Motley, Dante Lavelli, Lou Groza and Bill Willis.

"He was as great of a quarterback as there ever was," said longtime friend George Steinbrenner, who grew up in Cleveland. "He was a god in Cleveland."

"Automatic Otto" never missed a game as a pro while passing for 23,584 yards and 174 touchdowns. Graham finished his career with an astounding 105-17-4 regular-season record.

He took Brown's teams to the title game in each season from 1946 to 1955.

"That's hard to beat," said Sammy Baugh, a contemporary of Graham's and also a Hall of Famer.

With Graham as their quarterback, the Browns won four championships in the AAFC and three NFL titles. He was MVP of the AAFC three times.

Graham, who wore uniform numbers 14 and 60, was inducted into the Pro Football Hall of Fame in 1965. In 1994, Graham was picked for the NFL's 75th anniversary team, joining quarterbacks Baugh, Unitas and Montana.

"Otto Graham was the superstar of the 1950s, when the NFL was gaining stability and growing in popularity," NFL commissioner Paul Tagliabue said Wednesday night. "He helped glamorize the sport by winning championships and elevating the role of quarterback as the NFL entered the television era.

"He also played a major role in building the tradition of the Cleveland Browns."

After dominating the AAFC with an innovative offense that was ahead of its time, Graham and the Browns moved into the more-established NFL in 1950.

They opened in Philadelphia against the defending champion Eagles, and Graham's first pass in the NFL went for a touchdown as the Browns stunned the sports world with a 35-10 win.

Cleveland went 12-2 during the regular season, then defeated the Los Angeles Rams, who had defected from Cleveland after winning the 1945 title.

The Browns lost in the NFL title game the next three years before winning the 1954 championship behind Graham, who ran for three TDs and threw three more in Cleveland's 56-10 rout of Detroit.

After the game, Graham announced he was retiring. But he was talked into making a comeback on the eve of the 1955 season opener and led the Browns to yet another title.

In his final game, 33-year-old Graham threw two TD passes and ran for two more as the Browns beat the Rams 38-14.

"I liked all his quarterback skills," Baugh told The Associated Press on Wednesday. "I thought he was one of the better quarterbacks in the league. He had a smart head and a good arm."

Graham later coached the Washington Redskins from 1966 to 1968 -- he compiled a 17-22-3 record and was replaced by Vince Lombardi in 1969. Coaching the Redskins was just a lark, according to the team's quarterback, Sonny Jurgensen.

"He said he was not cut out to coach professional football, but he did it for [Redskins owner] Edward Bennett Williams," said Jurgensen, also a Hall of Famer.

Graham, who also made history as the first player to wear a face mask, took great pride in his many career records -- and that they all came with his beloved Browns.

"How many players stay with the same team for 10 years these days? It's a different time, a different game," he said on a visit to Browns Stadium in 2002.

Otto Everett Graham Jr. began setting records on the first day of his life in Waukegan, Ill. He weighed a state record 14 pounds, 12 ounces at birth.

Graham went to Northwestern on a basketball scholarship and played intramural football, leading his team to a fraternity championship. Wildcats football coach Lynn "Pappy" Waldorf noticed the freshman and invited him to a spring tryout.

He was an All-American in both basketball and football in 1943 and finished third in the Heisman Trophy voting won by Notre Dame's Angelo Bertelli.

In 1959, on the recommendation of Steinbrenner, Graham became athletic director and football coach at the U.S. Coast Guard Academy. He left the Coast Guard to become general manager and coach of the Redskins in 1966.

He is survived by his wife of 57 years, Beverly; three children: Duey, Sandy and Dave; two foster daughters; 16 grandchildren; and four great-grandchildren.

58 posted on 01/19/2004 3:52:07 PM PST by mrustow
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To: jaugust
Speaking of which, #58 should be of interest to you.
59 posted on 01/19/2004 3:54:54 PM PST by mrustow
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To: FormerLib
Vintage Marriotti, who wanted John Rocker kicked out of baseball, but whined about Latrell Sprewell's suspension being excessive.
60 posted on 01/19/2004 3:57:46 PM PST by Ol' Sparky
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