Historian's Take on Islam Steers U.S. Policy

Wall St Journal ^ | 2-02-04 | PETER WALDMAN

[azhenfud]

It is sort of slow - isn't it?

[Fee]

The only complaint I have, is GWB needs a large Army to match the Foreign Policy adopted by his administration.

[Oberon]

This thread needs another BUMP.

[Cronos]

I get what you're saying and agree with you -- Saddy did NOT support alQ because they were a threat to him, probably a bigger threat than the US. The alQ loathed Saddy, as, for whatever else his faults may have been (and there were many), he was secular -- he didn't really care what religion you were as long as you supported him and hated the Persians. the anti-Israeli thing was just a way to get support in the Arab world. Of course we had to get rid of him, but now the onus is on us to show them a better way. Saddy was the lesser of the two evils (saddy or the Talibs), but now we can give them somethign better and give OURSELVEs a great opportunity to get a secure state int eh near east.

[Cronos]

This is the sort of statement I would expect from a person truly ignorant of the dynamics of history and nations.

Which statement specifically? As for the fact that the Brits laid the groundwork for most of the problems today (Palestine, Iraq, Pakistan, Kashmir), that's a known fact.

[Cronos]

all nations historically, specially since the 16th century, have been driven by trade and economics

WEll then, the Brits (and French) preferred to make money and let the slamic Turks win over the Christian Russians. They have a lot of Russian blood on their hands from the Crimean war and no good reason to have fought that war. If they hadn't then Constantinople would have been restored.

[Cronos]

All you say is true, but at least they're OUR hypocrites...

at the moment it's more profitable for them to support us so they get an Empire by proxy and make a lot of money while our soldiers do the bulk of the fighting (they have helped a lot that's true, but they've made, economically speaking, a disproportionate amount)

[Cronos]

The only complaint I have, is GWB needs a large Army to match the Foreign Policy adopted by his administration.

I agreee. If Clintack hadn't trimmed down the army we wouldn't have had quite so many problems.

[azhenfud]

My friend explained Saddam couldn't outright claim "no WMD's" because the Al Quirks were on the border and within Iraq waiting for him to declare he had no means of retribution left. If he had (and I believe Al Queida has already infiltrated since his fall) the terrorist cells would have immediately stormed him since they had a basic hatred of Saddam and needed him out of the way.

Fanatic Islam's goal is world dominion - despite all the PC coverup and denial.

As my friend explained - any democracy formed within Iraq must begin with Iraqi's. Western influence can only be just that - influence - and not force. The Iraqi people have to decide to be free and that freedom is also freedom from fanatic Islamic control.

[steve-b]

How successful it is at remolding Iraq and the rest of the Mideast could have a huge impact on what sort of superpower America will be for decades to come: bold and assertive -- or inward, defensive and cut off.

Most important: Will it succeed sufficiently to convince future would-be terrorists that their options are 1)to do nothing and see their great-grandchildren half Americanized, or 2)to fight and (if they survive) see their children nine-tenths Americanized?

[Tolik]

BUMP:

A central Lewis theme is that Muslims have had a chip on their shoulders since 1683, when the Ottomans failed for the second time to sack Christian Vienna. "Islam has been on the defensive" ever since, Mr. Lewis wrote in a 1990 essay called "The Roots of Muslim Rage," where he described a "clash of civilizations," a concept later popularized by Harvard political scientist Samuel Huntington. For 300 years, Mr. Lewis says, Muslims have watched in horror and humiliation as the Christian civilizations of Europe and North America have overshadowed them militarily, economically and culturally.

"The question people are asking is why they hate us. That's the wrong question," said Mr. Lewis on C-SPAN shortly after the Sept. 11 attacks. "In a sense, they've been hating us for centuries, and it's very natural that they should. You have this millennial rivalry between two world religions, and now, from their point of view, the wrong one seems to be winning."

He continued: "More generally ... you can't be rich, strong, successful and loved, particularly by those who are not rich, not strong and not successful. So the hatred is something almost axiomatic. The question which we should be asking is why do they neither fear nor respect us?"

For Mr. Lewis and officials influenced by his thinking, instilling respect or at least fear through force is essential for America's security.

[gaspar]

Using Michigan prof Juan R. I. Cole to counter Lewis is to use a gnat to battle a flyswatter. Cole's most recent op-ed, "Bush Sneaks In and Out of Baghdad", will tell you where the prof is coming from. For those interested in a picture of an effete Westerner and Islamist apologist check:

http://www-personal.umich.edu/~jrcole/jcpers.htm

[Tolik]

Thanks for the pings.

On the sidebar of America's policies abroad there is an important omission: Reagan's policy of calling USSR an Evil Empire and staying tough, and supporting Eastern-Europeans in their quest for freedom from the USSR.

[dennisw]

Good info. The clown seems to have gone native, has an Iranian wife.

[SuziQ]

Bernard Lewis bump for later reading!

[gridlock]

A central Lewis theme is that Muslims have had a chip on their shoulders since 1683, when the Ottomans failed for the second time to sack Christian Vienna. "Islam has been on the defensive" ever since, Mr. Lewis wrote in a 1990 essay called "The Roots of Muslim Rage," where he described a "clash of civilizations," a concept later popularized by Harvard political scientist Samuel Huntington. For 300 years, Mr. Lewis says, Muslims have watched in horror and humiliation as the Christian civilizations of Europe and North America have overshadowed them militarily, economically and culturally

'A date that ought to be among the most famous in history'

Today we are accustomed to think of the Mohammedan world as something backward and stagnant, in all material affairs at least. We cannot imagine a great Mohammedan fleet made up of modern ironclads and submarines, or a great modern Mohammedan army fully equipped with modern artillery, flying power and the rest. But not so very long ago, (less than a hundred years before the Declaration of Independence), the Mohammedan Government centred at Constantinople had better artillery and better army equipment of every kind than had we Christians in the West. The last effort they made to destroy Christendom was contemporary with the end of the reign of Charles II in England and of his brother James and of the usurper William III. It failed during the last years of the seventeenth century, only just over two hundred years ago. Vienna, as we saw, was almost taken and only saved by the Christian army under the command of the King of Poland on a date that ought to be among the most famous in history- September 11, 1683.

Hilaire Belloc, The Great Heresies, Chapter Four.

[Piranha]

I remember listening to NPR one day last year and they had on a professor who was listing useful books to read in order to understand the mind of the modern Muslim.

One caller asked about Bernard Lewis. The guest smirked and said that Lewis isn't held in high regard in academic circles.

I'm delighted that he has become one of the intellectual lights of this administration. One more reason why it is so important to the US that George Bush win a second term.

[Piranha]

Very interesting theory (in two sentences, Saddam had to overestimate his WMD capabilities to keep al-Qaeda out. Now that he's gone, they are infiltrating Iraq.).

Our administration has reported that about 70% of al-Qaeda is destroyed. I would guess that part of that is because they are easier to find in Iraq, where they rushed to congregate like moths to light.

[Piranha]

I think that they have had a chip on their shoulder since they were expelled from el-Andaluz (Spain) in 1492. Osama made reference to this in one of his statements, and there is an el-Andaluz hotel in Baghdad.

[Publius6961]

BUMP