Assault weapons ban back in play; Feinstein tries to get reluctant Congress ...

San Francisco Chronicle ^ | Feb 9, 2004 | by Edward Epstein

[Lazamataz]

Washington -- Gun control hasn't emerged as a leading issue in the 2004 presidential race, but that is likely to change as Democratic California Sen. Dianne Feinstein intensifies her effort to win renewal of the decade-old assault weapons ban, which expires in September.

[tacticalogic]

That is false since it wasn't even IN the constitution until amended.

At least it's in there. And it pre-dates the New Deal Commerce Clause by about 150 years.

[looscnnn]

"Read the amendment and you will see that it clearly states the militias' purpose "...being necessary to the security of a free STATE, ...." says nothing about protection FROM the state. I am sure such points mean nothing to you."

The state referred to in the 2nd is the nation as a whole. As an example, ever hear of nation states? But again, being NRA you should know that.

"Their practical function was almost entirely to protect the citizenry from Indian attacks."

Um, no mr. "NRA". The militias were created to provide a military force. They were the precurser to the National Guard. The militia was/is for defending the nation against enemies of the nation. I read an article about a former Soviet big wig that said that the reason Russia never tried to invade the US is not because of our military (they felt they could beat it), but because of all the guns that the citizens had. We as gun owners are the militia, we are the last line of defense of this country if it were to be invaded.

"Against a real army they were of limited use and those among the founders who had served in the Continental Army well understood this."

Not so, the Mel Gibson movie The Patriot was based on a real person from here in SC. The militia was what tipped the scales in our favor.

[NittanyLion]

Do I know you?

[looscnnn]

"You are dreaming, a nice romantic dream but still a dream. Leftists aren't terrified by the 2d amendment in any way. It is just a convenient whipping boy they use to appeal to the weak-minded terrorized by crime."

Ok, you clinched it. You are not an NRA member and you do not know what the 2nd means (or possibly the Constitution). You are clueless. The libs are terrified of the 2nd, they have been since before 9/11. Get a clue.

"There is no confrontation of the Islamaniacs through the second amendment. There is no confrontation of any of our enemies through it."

The 2nd does not say anything about confronting anyone, it is about rights. Where are you getting this stuff?


"It is a recognition of a right but there will never be a militia of military value again."

If need be, the citizens will rise up to form militias. When, if China or anyone else were to get past our military and invade the US.

[WKB]

Do I know you?



Probably not but your reputation precedes you!!

[NittanyLion]

I can't recall having ever exchanged posts with you, yet you certainly seem to know a great deal about my "reputation". Might I ask how that could be?

[WKB]

Might I ask how that could be?


Even though I went to the public schools in Ms I did learn how to read and can write a little bit. It's not that hard to figure out,

[Dan from Michigan]

Kerry, for instance, took reporters and camera crews along on an Iowa pheasant hunt.

And DiFi carries. So f'n what?

"If the Republican Party in an election year wants to kill a bill that has dominant public support, it becomes a legitimate campaign issue

How dominant is the support, and WHERE is it dominant? I know San Francisco and NYC are very anti-freedom. That's not a suprise, but you talk about gun grabbing in Fowlerville, Michigan, you lose.

I am here to tell you that it will absolutely make it to his desk. 100% guarenteed.

I hope you're wrong. If it does, I do what I have to do.

[longtermmemmory]

so it passes in the senate but dies in the house?

Somebody correct me if I am wrong, but Pelosi's claim to grenate launchers is wrong becaus grenade launchers are regulated by a different law right? (kind of like class III licenses)

[NittanyLion]

Even though I went to the public schools in Ms I did learn how to read and can write a little bit. It's not that hard to figure out,

Do you often form opinions of people without ever having held a conversation with them? I would suggest that you'd be better served to base your conclusions on actual interactions, as opposed to the shrill whining of third-parties. Up to you, though.

Do you disagree that signing this bill would be quite damaging to Bush's support among members of his base?

[longtermmemmory]

There are three areas where Bush will loose support if he waivers.

God, Guns and Gays.

Immigration is not on that list.

[Dan from Michigan]

Carl Lenin. What a suprise.

Don't blame me. I voted for Rocky.

[Dan from Michigan]

I've called the offices of Debbie Stabmenow, Carl Lenin, and Mike Rogers multiple times on this.

I'm not too worried about Rogers. My sinators are worthless though.

[gatex]

"Read the amendment and you will see that it clearly states the militias' purpose "...being necessary to the security of a free STATE, ...." says nothing about protection FROM the state. I am sure such points mean nothing to you. ..."

Who are "the people " in the Second Amendment, whose right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed ?

[KantianBurke]

Alabama - R
Alaska - R
Arizona - R
Arkansas - R
California - D
Colorado - R
Connecticut - D
Delaware - D
District of Columbia - D
Florida - R
Georgia - R
Hawaii - D
Idaho - R
Illinois - D
Indiana - R
Iowa - D
Kansas - R
Kentucky - R
Louisiana - R
Maine - D
Maryland - D
Massachusetts - D
Michigan - D
Minnesota - D
Mississippi - R
Missouri - D
Montana - R
Nebraska - R
Nevada - R
New Hampshire - R
New Jersey - D
New Mexico - D
New York - D
North Carolina - R
North Dakota - R
Ohio - D
Oklahoma - R
Oregon - D
Pennsylvania - D
Rhode Island - D
South Carolina - R
South Dakota - R
Tennessee - R
Texas - R
Utah - R
Vermont - D
Virginia - R
Washington - D
West Virginia - R
Wisconsin - D
Wyoming - R

Electoral Totals: Rat gets 291, Bush gets 247. If Dubya signs the AWB and Kerry picks Gephardt (who brings in OH and MO) for VP, this result coming to pass becomes quite possible.

http://www.archives.gov/federal_register/electoral_college/calculator.html

[The KG9 Kid]

"... MMMs are not members of the NRA now are they?"

Never mind them, I know you're an NRA member in good standing...

... That is to say 'To hell with rights, we have to get Republicans elected!', which has been the NRA's position for over a decade.

[tpaine]

You wrote to flashbunny #119 and to 45Auto #107:

It --- [The right to bear arms] --- wasn't even IN the constitution until amended.
Read the amendment and you will see that it clearly states the militias' purpose " ... being necessary to the security of a free STATE, ...." --- says nothing about protection FROM the state.

Their [the militas] practical function was almost entirely to protect the citizenry from Indian attacks. Against a real army they were of limited use ----

 
--- Nor do I believe the amendment was pointed at the government since militia's would not stand a chance against a modern army (nor did they in the 1787.)



Nor is there anything in the second amendment which prevent some laws wrt firearms being legitimate, initially it did not even apply to the states only the fedgov.


Unless you believe that the Crips and Bloods have the RtKaBA and continue in their lawbreaking ways.
The question is what laws ARE justifiable and necessary.

With the spread of CC laws it appears those laws are being reduced.

Most of us on the FR recognize that the AW ban is unnecessary --
But it should be clear that the possibility of an extension would not exist unless the majority of the people supported the idea.
When enough are against it it will go away.

That is what needs to be addressed and worked on not quixote campaigns against real friends and fellow patriots.
   
______________________________________


You brand yourself as a believer in the 'militia' theory of the 2nd.. -- then go on to say:

-- "Nor do I believe the amendment was pointed at the government" ---

An outright admission that, to you, our various levels of government are not bound by "shall not be infringed"..

To ice the cake, you claim that blacks in LA who are suspected of gangsterism have no RKBA's as such laws may be "justifiable and necessary".

And to finish up you make an emotional appeal that we should allow majority rule to win on the AWB renewal, --- as when maybe a new majority gains power it would "go away", -- using the same harebrained theory..

Jsuati, my boyo, you are WAY over the edge here..
-- Thanks.. Bizarro posts like yours are alotta fun..

[WKB]

Do you disagree that signing this bill would be quite damaging to Bush's support among members of his base?


Maybe maybe not

To tell you the truth I am not real big on a holding conversation with FReepers who are afraid to put any personal information on their home page.

[NittanyLion]

To tell you the truth I am not real big on a holding conversation with FReepers who are afraid to put any personal information on their home page.

And I thought I'd seen every excuse in the book to avoid substantive debate...I must admit yours is a new one to me. LOL.

[looscnnn]

Where do you stand on this issue? Do you think the AWB is unconstitutional? Do you hold the same beliefs about the 2nd as justshutup?