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Bureaucracy Stymies Disability Claimants
Democrat and Chronicle, Rochester, NY ^ | Mar. 30,2004 | Linda Fullerton

Posted on 03/30/2004 10:15:14 AM PST by AuntB

Edited on 05/07/2004 8:07:38 PM PDT by Jim Robinson. [history]

About 12,000 people per week in this country apply for Social Security disability benefits. The time it takes to process a claim from the original filing date is now, in many cases, at least one to three years or longer. Claimants, in addition to their illnesses, face homelessness, bankruptcy and even death while waiting for their cases to be approved.


(Excerpt) Read more at democratandchronicle.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Culture/Society; Government
KEYWORDS: bureaucracy; disability; healthcare; poverty; socialsecurity; ssi
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Linda Fullerton President/Co-Founder - Social Security Disability Coalition Social Security Disability Coalition - FREE knowledge and support with a focus on reform of the Social Security Disability System: http://groups.msn.com/SocialSecurityDisabilityCoalition

Sign the Social Security Disability Reform Petition - Read the horror stories from all over the nation at: http://www.petitiononline.com/SSDC/petition.html

1 posted on 03/30/2004 10:15:15 AM PST by AuntB
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To: All
“SOCIAL SECURITY”, DISABLED NEED NOT APPLY!

Part 3 of the Invisible American Series


Every where you turn these days, you hear plenty of talk about reforming Social Security. And questions,there are so may questions, such as,

“Will there even be a social security system by the time I need it?” or
“How high are they going to raise the retirement age?” or “Why does it take up to 4 years or more to approve a disability claim?”

Everyone got ALL shook up when the head of the Federal Reserve recently suggested raising the retirement benefit age to 67. Retirement age for most of us has already gone over 65 years. The Social Security Administration’s web site retirement age charts can be found at http://www.ssa.gov/retirechartred.htm. Example: If you were born in 1959, your retirement age is 66 and 10 months. Those born in 1960 or later have to be 67.

The fact is there is are tens of thousands of people in this country who have already been cut off from their paid benefits. Yet, we hear no discussion concerning how the SSA,through it’s inefficiency and it’s bureaucratic abuse toward clients is creating an entire underclass of homeless, sick, depressed and broken citizens.

I am not referring to people seeking unearned, unpaid Social Security benefits known as Supplemental Security Income. SSI, by it’s nature is a negative to the system, because those beneficiaries did not contribute to the pool. It is welfare, and should be entirely out of the Social Security system. SSI applicants seem to get approved more readily, since SSA has as one of its qualification “steps” the fact that if one has little work experience there is all the more reason to award benefits.

This is about the FICA and medicare taken out of all of our paychecks for all the years worked, in part for those who become disabled. IF one finally gets an approval, there is an additional 2 year wait for medicare benefits producing thousands of sick people who can get no medical care for two more years added to the years of waiting for that decision. SSI, ironically awards medicare immediately when applicants are approved.

This hardly seems fair to a 55 to 60 year old who got sick or hurt through no fault of his own and worked 40 years to pay his social security. The biggest blow is to find out that after not working for approximately 5 years, our benefits “run out”, regardless of how many years they were paid into. The SSA has this information on their web site under “qualifications for disability”, though it is generally not common knowledge.

It has also created a breed of lawyer, who averages $5000.00 per applicant, generally after the applicant has done most of the work and waited years to get to the “stage” where one can get the attorney required to be awarded a claim. In other words, when the back benefits have built up sufficiently to interest an attorney putting his name on the appeal, he will bother with you. He’s not interested if you deserve disability. He’s not generally interested in you at all.

If it is a “difficult” case, and many are, needing medical records searched out, weeding through misdiagnoses or reports to SSA filled out by a clerk who NEVER saw the patient, an attorney will likely not even take the case. The applicant is left to flounder hopelessly through a maze of paperwork, years of stress between each “step” of denial, endless legal jargon, indignant, unqualified public employees and over burdened physicians and their staffs and wait as they become more ill.

SSA’s solution to the problem is the usual; throw more money at it. Hire more untrained, unqualified employees who will never have to depend on Social Security or medicare themselves because they have better insurance and retirement plans and job security.

Jo Anne Barnhart, Commissioner of Social Security, released the following statement regarding President Bush’s Fiscal Year 2004 budget The President`s budget proposes a 7.5 percent increase in administrative resources to $8.65 billion.

"What a tremendous vote of confidence from our President! This is a large allocation of resources under any circumstances, but in this fiscal climate – especially with the compelling demands of national defense and homeland security – it is huge. It clearly demonstrates his support for our programs, which touch the lives of nearly every American. This budget will enable us to add 1,000 new SSA employees and over 300 new Disability Determination Service (DDS) employees.”

What follows are a few entries from a petition to reform the Social Security Disability approval process. With over 3200 signatures and growing, it was created by some of those tax paying citizens who have spent many months, more often years waiting for public-servant-paper-shufflers to run their applications through endless steps and delays. http://www.PetitionOnLine.com/SSDC/petition.html
2 posted on 03/30/2004 10:18:53 AM PST by AuntB (You're ugly and your mother dresses you funny!)
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To: All
Thanks for playing, now die!

Bill from Missouri says, “I have a family member who died just days before finally being approved . My brother initially applied over 2 years earlier but it took that long for him to get thru your system. Don't let this happen to one more person. Stop the red tape and obvious mismanagement of the SSA.”

A husband appeals for his wife, “I have watched my wife turn from a vibrant woman into a woman in severe pain from motor vehicle accident which was not our fault and now Major Depression. What’s it gonna take before you help her?Her life?”

Jena in Georgia opines, “A SSD counselor, himself a cancer survivor, has just told my dying fiancé that it will take nine months to process his claim. He may not have nine months. However long, I will have nothing but contempt for the governors who so violate our Constitution as you”

William from Florida laments, “My brother died days before finally being approved. He had Lupus. He was also an Vietnam Vet. I wonder, if your agency had not put him through so much or made him wait., would we still have our brother today? Take a good look at all these signatures and try to think of how your agency has ineffectively served it's citizens. How many will you allow to go homeless, live in card board boxes and eat from soup kitchens. How many more will be forced to go bankrupt waiting on you?”

From Ron in Texas, “A man in our church was diagnosed with terminal liver cancer 17 months ago. He applied for SSD benefits after he had to close his sign painting business but was turned down, even with the physicians statements, and test results. He has had to hire an attorney, is on his third appeal, is so frail that he can hardly walk from his vehicle to the church, lost his home & moved in with his sister...now you tell me, where is the justice in this scenario?”

Ken and Stacy from New Hampshire write, “It kills me to see what this is doing to my marriage and my life.... If this circus of filing for my husband keeps up we will have two claims, because it is going to cause me to have a breakdown.”

Deborah from New York, “Had to stand by and fight SSA only to witness "twin" sister deteriorate. She died shortly after receiving disability benefits. So many things are very wrong with the SSD process and needs to be changed.”

Shirley in Oklahoma tells us, “my son is caught in your political red tape system and might be paralyzed due to neglect or die from complications while all you bureaucrats live like kings off of our tax $.”

Julia from Kentucky writes, “Medicare takes 29 months to receive from date of eligibility. People who have left work because of a disability need the insurance NOW. Medicaid and SSI are available immediately to people who have never paid one cent into the system. How unfair is that?”

Gary from Ohio has this to say, “I've been witness to just one of these cases - a woman who must spend days on oxygen laying in bed, amputee, brain tumor, CLEARLY disabled, still denied disability.”

M. Jones in California, “We CANNOT just buy health insurance if we are ill enough to be disabled! US Public Policy = "Disabled? Good, we have a plan to kill you so we don't have to pay a legitimate claim! No Medicare for 2 years! Thanks for playing; now die!

From Georgia, Carol writes,”I think this is very important to all Americans. You don't know when this will happen to you. We think we have this safety net of SSD if we are unable to work. You could die or wish you were dead before you get SSD”

Penny in Pennsylvania, “I watched my friend die before her disability was approved. Please listen and change the system!”

Leigh in Pennsylvania, “I have been turned down twice so far. My Dr. wrote a letter to SSDI that said I am totally and permanently disabled. SSDI ignored him. There is no way I can live like this any longer. I never thought my own government would kill me. Hah...And I was afraid of terrorists!
3 posted on 03/30/2004 10:21:51 AM PST by AuntB (You're ugly and your mother dresses you funny!)
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To: GrandmaC; Jeff Head; redrock; FITZ; JohnHuang2; farmfriend; Aquamarine; Billie; MarMema; ...
The Homeless courtesy of the SSA

.Richard C. writes, “One year since I filed. My files have been deleted from the system, they have been lost, and they have been filed in someone else's file. I am 3 months behind on my car & house payments so they have timed it just right to where I will lose both my car and home before I receive Social Security.”

Michael in Washington state, “Its really too bad that the people should have to petition for something that's owed to us, my mother worked hard for 30 years and now she's disabled, would be homeless if not for family, and in pain because she can’t afford her needed meds. God Bless America”

Sue from Oregon, “THE SOCIAL SECURITY ADMINISTRATION NEEDS AN ENEMA! I APPLIED UNDER CLINTON, STILL WAITING UNDER BUSH...IT'S SUCH A MESS A PRESIDENT CAN'T EVEN FIX IT! I'm denied because I was a good citizen and worked with my disabilities TOO long! I lost my home because of the SSA!

Margaret from Colorado writes a common refrain, “applied for SSDI in 2000... still pending review ... now even after adding presumed MS I can't get help... lost my home last week...

Kimberly in North Carolina begs, “I was seriously injured in a strong-armed robbery in 2002. I am soon to be homeless and I have no resources left. I have been bedridden since I was injured. Please listen to our voice! We paid into SS. Yet when we need it most we are treated as if we are asking for charity! Please help us.”
4 posted on 03/30/2004 10:26:33 AM PST by AuntB (You're ugly and your mother dresses you funny!)
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To: Congressman Billybob; writer33; doxteve; swampfox98; Coleus
Ambulance chasers

Darlene in Minnesota, “I've never understood where an attorney fits into Social Security Disability Benefits process. Disability is a medical issue, not a legal one. If private insurance required the majority of its claimants to hire an attorney to get benefits they paid for and were entitled to, they would be investigated & forced to make changes.

Patricia in Nebraska writes, “Current system is a moral crime. People are suffering and DYING because they are grossly neglected and abused by the system. We shouldn't need lawyers to get benefits. Let the lawyers find another specialty. Disability benefits should never go to a lawyer. What a morally bankrupt society!!!!”

Tina from Alabama questions, “I am disabled due to a Doctor's mistake! It took 2 years and a lawyer that took 25% of my back pay to fight the case. This is our money, why should we loose everything we have fighting for it?”

Kevin from Florida, “I've found that an attorney is a must. You have to play the system like a game, don't cheat but use every rule to your advantage. Most of Congress is attorneys so doesn't it figure they would write the rules to require an attorney”

William in New York says,”Waited two very long years to get my SSD benefits. The stress and finical burdens were over whelming. This current system needs to be changed. Seems the only ones who benefit from it are the lawyers this system make us hire.”

Tina from Alabama questions, “I am disabled due to a Doctor's mistake! It took 2 years and a lawyer that took 25% of my back pay to fight the case. This is our money, why should we loose everything we have fighting for it?”
.
Marguerite in New York observes,”Social Security should review their records to determine the percentage of denials on first application. It should then evaluate the percentage approved after an attorney has been hired. This has become a cash cow for the legal profession at the expense of the citizen who needs the benefit. Thank you for your attention.”

Similarly, Diane from Kansas states, “Please discontinue the practice of forcing people to get an attorney, who then slows down the process in order to get more money for themselves. People on disability cannot afford this legal robbery. ”

5 posted on 03/30/2004 10:32:37 AM PST by AuntB (You're ugly and your mother dresses you funny!)
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To: AuntB
What we obviously need is universal government health care.
6 posted on 03/30/2004 11:41:01 AM PST by Fudd
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To: AuntB
There are so many innacuracies in these posts I hardly know where to begin.

The initial stage of the disability filing process is the first decision. This takes anywhere from 30 - 90 days, If the person is denied, they have the right to file for a reconsideration. This consists of completing and signing several short forms detailing why the initial decision was incorrect. The reconsideration takes a bit longer, about 45-100 days.

If the person is denied at the reconsideration, they can file a hearing which goes before an administrative law judge. That can take anywhere from 60-200 days. The ALJs really take their time.

The workload at all levels is overwhelming. It is almost inconceivable how many cases SSA deals with. The problem is that for every truly disabled person, 50+ people file who have no demonstrable disability. That creates a backlog and is the reason it takes so long to get a medical decision.

Also, anyone who gets a lawyer during this process is being taken to the cleaners. All a lawyer does is file the same few papers that a claimant would. For this he gets 25% of the disabled person's back pay. Social Security lawyers (those who represent claimants in their quest to get SS disability) are, with few exceptions, the lowest form of life on planet earth. They willingly take big money from impoverished people for filling out 3-5 easy forms.

I could go on and on about these posts, but my arms are getting tired.
Oh
7 posted on 03/30/2004 12:05:46 PM PST by Skooz (My Biography: Psalm 40:1-3)
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To: Fudd
No, that's not even the answer.
8 posted on 03/30/2004 2:42:18 PM PST by AuntB (You're ugly and your mother dresses you funny!)
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To: Skooz
"There are so many innacuracies in these posts I hardly know where to begin."

I wish you were correct. It sounds like you are familiar somehow with the process....are you a SSA employee? If you are a disability recipient, then consider yourself very lucky if that's the way it went for you. As long as no one will believe those signatures on the petition, this will continue. Let's say half of the 3200 signatures are full of crap....what about the other half? I urge you to find out what is really happening here.

Here's some more of it:

Disability wait takes toll

By Jeff Kunerth | Sentinel Staff Writer
Posted December 7, 2003


By the numbers
* There are 7,000 Central Floridians whose Social Security disability cases are awaiting hearings or appeals.
* The average time to get a hearing in the Orlando district is almost 1 month longer than the national average.
* The Social Security Administration provides $100 billion a year in disability payments to more than 12 million Americans.



It's been 17 months since John Thompson, an Orange County construction worker who suffers from blood clots, filed for Social Security disability. While awaiting a hearing, he used up his savings, sold all his tools, cashed in his retirement stock portfolio and borrowed money from his sister and 91-year-old father.

A day before Thanksgiving, he received an eviction notice.

There are 7,000 Central Floridians and more than a quarter-million Americans just like Thompson whose cases are backlogged in the Social Security Administration's Office of Hearings and Appeals. An additional 300,000 Americans are awaiting initial reviews of their claims by disability officials.

Unable to work while accumulating medical bills, the ill, injured and crippled workers are losing their homes, filing for bankruptcy and sometimes dying before administrative judges hear their cases. In the Orlando district, it often takes a year for a case to be assigned to a judge, attorneys contend.

Last year, a woman in her 30s died while awaiting an appeal of her disability case, Orlando attorney Richard Culbertson said. Posthumously, she was granted disability benefits.

"What makes it a travesty is that it takes so long," said Culbertson, who would not identify his client. "Most of these people who go over a year or longer are found disabled."

U.S. Rep. Clay Shaw, R-Fort Lauderdale, termed the delays in the Orlando district "inexcusable."

"We have to get to the bottom of what is going on in Orlando," said Shaw, chairman of the House Social Security Subcommittee.

Social Security officials said the average time it takes to get a hearing in the Orlando district increased from 332 days in 2002 to 363 days in 2003 -- almost a month longer than the national average. The Orlando district, which comprises 11 counties from Alachua to Polk, saw the number of hearings increase from 3,155 in 2001 to 4,738 in 2003.

Understaffing is blamed

Attorneys representing people filing disability claims contend that in recent years the time it takes to get a hearing has gone from less than six months to more than a year. Attorneys blame the lengthening delays on the burgeoning caseload and an understaffed office subjected to a hiring freeze.

"They have been laboring with seven judges when they need 11," said Daytona Beach attorney Carol Ponton. "They are creating a tremendous backlog of people. We have gone from waiting five months to 15 months, and we're getting farther behind."

The number of administrative judges has been frozen for four years as a result of a lawsuit that challenged how judges were selected. That lawsuit was resolved and the hiring freeze lifted earlier this year, but it may be another year before additional judges are hired.

Based on the Orlando district's population growth and increase in disability claims, the office needs three more judges but likely will receive only one or two, said Martin Gerry, Social Security's deputy commissioner for disability and income-security programs.

Social Security Administration Commissioner Jo Anne B. Barnhart testified before Congress in September that the Office of Hearings and Appeals has 1,023 administrative judges and needs 200 more to meet the demands of unfilled vacancies and rising caseloads. Barnhart, who outlined several steps to reduce the delays, said it would be another year before the 200 judges could be hired and 2006 before all of her plans could be implemented.

Of the 7,000 cases before the Orlando district judges, about 1,000 have been tagged for expedited hearings because the claimants face eviction or death, attorneys said.

Thompson is among them. Before the eviction notice, the electricity in the house he's renting was turned off for two months because he couldn't pay the utility bill. Before the utilities were restored, Thompson, his wife and two teenage sons used water from the swimming pool to flush their toilets.

His expedited disability hearing is scheduled for Wednesday. If approved, he would qualify for $1,150 a month in Social Security disability and a lump sum of retroactive benefits.

The money, Thompson said, would cover his rent and allow him to repay his sister the $2,400 she borrowed to have the electricity restored and the $5,000 loan his father took out to stave off eviction.

'I'd rather be working'

But the money won't give him back a life free of the pain in his legs and back that makes him walk like an old man at the age of 50. And it doesn't restore a sense of worth for a man who feels like an invalid.

"I'd rather be working because I enjoyed it, and I could make more money than staying at home," said Thompson, who has owned a hardware store, installed satellite dishes, remodeled homes and retrofitted motel rooms to make them accessible to the disabled. "I don't like to sit. I like to do stuff. I like to fix things. I just can't do it anymore."

Eviction and critical illness can escalate the disability hearing process, which also gives priority to older people. Cases involving people ages 60 and older are given the highest priority, while those younger than 50 can expect a long wait.

Largely for that reason, 47-year-old Benny Matias has yet to be assigned a hearing date, although he filed for disability in September 2002.

"If you are in that 18-49 category, that's the worse place to be," said his Orlando attorney Juan Rosario.

Matias hurt his back four years ago helping to move a 15-foot communications antenna. The injury has become progressively worse, preventing Matias from sitting or standing for longer than 30 minutes at a time. He experiences pain in his arms, legs and back.

"It's frustrating; it's stressful," said Matias, who moved to Orlando from Puerto Rico in 2001. "I made the basketball team. I sang in my church. I worked with the children. I lifted weights. I was in good shape. I always worked, worked, worked."

Matias, his wife and their four children now live with Benny's father-in-law. They survive on public assistance and food stamps. If qualified for disability benefits, Matias would receive about $800 a month.

Until then, he depends on the money his teenage daughter brings home from her job at a mall food court.

"That pays for the electricity, the hot water, the telephone," Matias said.

Disability payments, like Social Security itself, are based on the past earnings of the workers. The average disability recipient receives from $400 to $800 a month.

The Social Security Administration provides $100 billion a year in disability payments to more than 12 million Americans. Disability claims are initially reviewed by the state Division of Disability Determination, which rejects the majority of the cases. But about 60 percent of the cases that reach Office of Hearings and Appeals judges are approved. To receive disability benefits, a person must be found to be unable to work in even the easiest jobs.

Ideas for streamlining

Under Barnhart's proposals, the process would be streamlined, with a quick determination given to people with disabilities such as "aggressive" cancers; end-stage kidney failure; and Lou Gehrig's disease, a degenerative muscle disease. Barnhart also would eliminate one early step in the process that now includes two rejections by the state Disability Determination office before a person can file for a hearing.

"People who are obviously disabled will receive quick decisions," said Barnhart, who testified that the disability determination would be made within 20 days of application.

Barnhart also advocates upgrading the system for electronic case files, which would eliminate the paper files that often delay the process, are incomplete or are sometimes missing.

She also proposes using federally employed medical experts instead of the consulting doctors used by the states, many of whom are not medical specialists. Barnhart would also add "reviewing officials" who would look at disability cases before they reach the Hearings and Appeals Office.

To handle its growing backlog, the Orlando office has instituted an "on the record" procedure in which cases can be handled through e-mail and settled before they reach the hearing stage. Attorneys present their cases before an administrative staff attorney who determines whether there is enough evidence to justify disability benefits. An administrative judge then signs off on the decision.

The "on the record" avenue, however, is not available to those younger than 50, attorneys said.

Yet even being in the high-priority age bracket is no guarantee that a hearing will be scheduled before the person reaches destitution.

Allan Rubin, a 60-year-old Longwood salesman, applied for Social Security disability in August 2001 and hasn't been assigned a hearing date yet. His attorney expects it to be in the summer of 2004.

About three years ago, after a bout of food poisoning, Rubin developed irritable-bowel syndrome, a disorder that causes abdominal pain, constipation and diarrhea.

Rubin has tried special diets, homeopathic medicine, medications and treatments, but nothing works.

The pain and unpredictability of his condition, Rubin said, cost him customers, commissions and his job.

While awaiting a hearing, Rubin said, he amassed $300,000 in debt and declared bankruptcy in June. His wife took a $7-an-hour job at Publix for the medical insurance.

"I get to keep my house, but everything else is gone," Rubin said.

Desperate for money, Rubin tried to return to work.

'We're just surviving'

"I've applied for jobs along the way, but then I have to tell them I suffer from IBS and might have to be in the bathroom a lot," he said. "What boss in his right mind would hire me?"

For Rubin, the wait for a disability hearing is almost as painful as the affliction.

"It's sitting on somebody's desk so it can be given to a judge," he said. "Meanwhile, we're just surviving."

The backlogged cases add unnecessary agony to people already made vulnerable by illness and accidents, Rep. Shaw said.

"The people in the pipeline who have legitimate disabilities and can't work are among the most frail and fragile people," Shaw said. "We need to get them into the system as quickly as possible and get a judgment."
http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/nationworld/orl-asecsocsec07120703dec07,1,2240984.story?coll=orl-home-headlines
Jeff Kunerth can be reached at jkunerth@orlandosentinel.com or 407-420-5392.



9 posted on 03/30/2004 2:56:57 PM PST by AuntB (You're ugly and your mother dresses you funny!)
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To: AuntB
"Kevin from Florida, “I've found that an attorney is a must. You have to play the system like a game, don't cheat but use every rule to your advantage. Most of Congress is attorneys so doesn't it figure they would write the rules to require an attorney”

What he really means is cheat.
10 posted on 03/30/2004 7:12:37 PM PST by writer33 (The U.S. Constitution defines a Conservative)
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To: AuntB
Thanks for the ping, AuntB. Tell Andy we miss him. :)
11 posted on 03/30/2004 7:17:29 PM PST by writer33 (The U.S. Constitution defines a Conservative)
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To: writer33
No, that's not what he means. I understand it sounds like it. It's a scam, the entire system. If you don't get approval right away, you won't get it without an attorney. I know that sounds unbelievable. No one wants to hear about this. People are finding out differently every day, but it doesn't matter 'cause no one will believe them.

By the way, I despised the Andy Griffith show.

12 posted on 03/30/2004 8:06:45 PM PST by AuntB (You're ugly and your mother dresses you funny!)
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To: AuntB
"By the way, I despised the Andy Griffith show."


Now, AuntB. Repeat after me. Andy Griffith rocks! Once again. Andy Griffith rocks! And one more time for good measure. Andy Griffith rocks!

Andy, Andy, Andy, Andy, Andy.

If you want to know, AuntB, Frances on the show, was a real you know what to Andy. It was on her death bed that she finally made amends to him. I think she died the next day afterwards.

Nevertheless, I got the point and thanks for the post. It was a good one.


13 posted on 03/30/2004 8:14:10 PM PST by writer33 (The U.S. Constitution defines a Conservative)
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To: AuntB
We've got $15 billion for AIDS in Africa, we are very generous with our handouts to the impoverished being sent over from Mexico and Guatemala --- $1 billion more in the Medicare bill just for them --- but those who have worked to build this country are out of luck. We're so busy taking care of everyone else, we aren't taking care of Americans.
14 posted on 03/31/2004 5:21:15 AM PST by FITZ
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To: AuntB
Medicaid and SSI are available immediately to people who have never paid one cent into the system.

And you see a lot of that on the border --- it seems easy enough to come up from Mexico disabled or elderly and start collecting. They just deported this neighbor of mine --- he'll be back --- but his 4 kids are all living on welfare, his live-in "girlfriend" or common-law wife is also illegal, never worked here, for some reason they have another man listed as the father on the birth certificates --- that man has papers but doesn't work, but maybe his legal status helps her get her welfare faster. The only reason they have the kids is for the handouts.

15 posted on 03/31/2004 5:26:52 AM PST by FITZ
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To: AuntB
I have a better idea... amend the law to prevent - ever - anyone not contributing to Social Security from ever claiming benefits exceeding their contributions. A ten year period of continuous contributions is not unreasonable.

That ought to cut back on applications by about 95%.
And speed up processing for the legitimate claimants.

16 posted on 03/31/2004 5:36:22 AM PST by Publius6961 (50.3% of Californians are as dumb as a sack of rocks (subject to a final count).)
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To: Publius6961
" I have a better idea... amend the law to prevent - ever - anyone not contributing to Social Security from ever claiming benefits exceeding their contributions. A ten year period of continuous contributions is not unreasonable."

I'd vote for that! What we have now, however, is millions of people drawing who have never paid in a cent..SSI. We also have millions who have paid in for 30-40 years, find themselves disabled and being turned down for years by SSA. IF they finally get approval, it's another 2 years before medicare kicks in...and these people are all SICK. Believe me, those folks would gladly settle for what they'd paid in to survive on. And you're right a ten year period of paying in is not unreasonable. Paying in for 40 years and not being allowed any benefits....is unreasonable, don't ya think?

17 posted on 03/31/2004 11:40:40 AM PST by AuntB ("What if they find life on Mars and it's just more pissed off Muslims?"Dennis Miller)
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To: FITZ
" it seems easy enough to come up from Mexico disabled or elderly and start collecting. "

Yes, yes it is a lot easier than trying to collect when one has paid in for 30 years. The worst part of this is, FITZ, that hardly anyone believes it. No one will take this seriously. They will when it happens to them.

You have a good day, I'm dragging my sorry body outside for some yard work!! You might enjoy my satire below:

Free Trade, anyone?

So, tell me if I have this correct.

Illegal immigrants from Mexico, can enter the USA at will, camp in our national forests, get free legal representation, free medical care, a shopping list of other tax paid social services, education, government interpreter, with no fear of deportation, prosecution, or discrimination. Is that about it?

Fine. It’s high time the Word Trade Organization stepped in and raised some noncompliance hell with the Mexican government to demand it allow American Citizens the same access to Mexico and everything it’s society has to offer. Reasonably, the same services would be available to immigrants from the USA as the US offers it’s illegals.

After all, isn’t the big argument that the US economy needs Mexicans to take all those surplus jobs and that they contribute so much to our way of life? We should have the same opportunity in Mexico, whether we decide to work or not. That is free trade!

Just think how much US Citizens spend in tourist dollars each year in Mexico. Ten or 12 million of us living down there would help our neighbor’s economy out even more. And the weather is perfect in Puerto Vallarta this time of year.

But, not live in the USA? It would be difficult, but sometimes one has to do what one has to do. Sell your home because your job has been out sourced any way. Take the cash with you, because you will only get 1% interest from a bank in this country on savings of $50,000. I understand one can live quite handsomely in Mexico for a few thousand dollars a year. Heck, there will be so many of us we can form our own little society down there. We’ll call it the “hood”.

But, you’re 55 years old, have all those aches and pains. What about medical care? Nevermind.....you can’t afford that in the US anymore either, no problemo. What about the language, no habla espanol? Well, don’t worry, no one is required to speak their language, for heavens sake!

The easy lifestyle will probably do more for your health than the drugs you can’t afford. What about your family and friends? Bring ‘em along!! After a few years of being there illegally, they’ll be eligible for citizenship! After all, we must have some qualifying standard.

Yep. It’s a clear case of discrimination that the almighty WTO needs to address. What about it, Mr. Fox, are you up for an even trade? An “open” border is what you wanted, wasn’t it? President Bush? Any Democrat? No? I didn’t think so.

Mar. 28, 2004. Fair use permitted for discussion and education purposes.

18 posted on 03/31/2004 1:37:37 PM PST by AuntB ("What if they find life on Mars and it's just more pissed off Muslims?"Dennis Miller)
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To: AuntB
No one will take this seriously. They will when it happens to them.

I was just talking with someone whose co-worker developed an infection in his leg --- in his late 40's and had to be amputated and cannot work that job, a guy who has worked all his adult life but now cannot --- it's taken a year and now he's finally going to collect SS disability checks -- not much money either. He'd rather be working but not many jobs are out there --- much less for someone in his late 40's without a leg. I wonder if this is the way this country should be --- so very generous with those of other countries but not with those who have put into the system for many years. It's no problem at all for a 16 year old girl to cross the border, give birth and immediately collect a check for a baby which was conceived only for that purpose --- enable the mother to never work at all.

19 posted on 03/31/2004 8:20:14 PM PST by FITZ
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To: AuntB
Anyhow I do think people should consider what happens to them or their family members if they become disabled --- and a wealthy country like ours which has plenty of money for those in or from foreign countries could do better for our own --- charity begins at home.
20 posted on 03/31/2004 8:28:18 PM PST by FITZ
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