Posted on 05/23/2004 11:54:30 PM PDT by KentTrappedInLiberalSeattle
Calling the approval of same-sex marriage in Massachusetts "the straw that broke the camel's back," a group of Christian activists is in the beginning stages of an effort to have one state secede from the United States to become its own sovereign nation.
"Our Christian republic has declined into a pagan democracy," says Cory Burnell, president of ChristianExodus.org, a non-profit corporation based in Tyler, Texas. "There are some issues people just can't take anymore, and [same-sex marriage] might finally wake up the complacent Christians."
Burnell is leading the charge for a peaceful secession of one state from the union, and after originally considering Alabama, Mississippi and South Carolina due to their relatively small populations, coastal access, and the Christian nature of the electorate, Burnell says South Carolina has been selected as the target location.
The plan initially calls for at least 12,000 Christians willing to be active in political campaigns to move to the Palmetto State.
"We're not an invading force, we're reinforcements," Burnell tells WorldNetDaily, saying it would be a waste to move to liberal-minded states such as Massachusetts, New York or California where conservative votes would be diluted.
According to the ChristianExodus website, which is slated for a major relaunch next month, "Christians have actively tried to return our entire land to its moral foundation for more than 20 years. We can categorically say that absolutely nothing has been achieved. If you disagree, consider this:
* Abortion continues against the wishes of many states * Children may not pray in our schools * The Bible is not welcome in schools except under strict federal guidelines
* The 10 Commandments remain banned from public display * Sodomy is now legal and celebrated as 'diversity' rather than perversion
* Preaching Christianity will soon be outlawed as 'hate speech' * Gay marriage will be foisted upon us in the very near future
"All these atrocities continue in spite of the fact that we now have the 'right' people in places of power. Indeed, the occupant of the White House is a professing Christian. The U.S. attorney general is believed to be a devout Christian. 'Conservatives' control both Houses of Congress, and Republican presidents appointed seven of the nine Supreme Court justices."
The idea of moving thousands of people to affect the voting in one state is not new. As WorldNetDaily has previously reported, the Free State Project has goals of restoring certain personal liberties and limited government – but without seceding from the union. Last year, a group of 4,500 libertarians decided New Hampshire would be the best state.
S. Carolina state flag
Burnell, a math teacher and cell-phone dealer, stresses he's not looking for bloody battles that took place in the American Revolution and the Civil War, but is rather seeking a "political divorce."
"It's got to be different today," he says. "It has to be peaceful, brokered."
But he admits if the federal government decides to use military force to stop the effort, "Then it can't happen."
Already a dozen people are actively working on the project, and some 1,500 by e-mails of support have been received.
If all goes according to plan, Burnell is hoping to have a constitutional convention by 2014, with a president of the new nation – still to be known as South Carolina – elected in 2016, which is also a presidential election year in the U.S.
He says the nation would be founded on Christian principles, and the people writing its constitution would have to hash out details to safeguard it as a Christian republic.
For now, Burnell prefers to shy away from specifics on the precise laws governing the country.
"Independence first, details later," he says.
"The problem, Homer, is that you haven't been defending anything yet. What is your answer--your reasoning to the questions?"
NONE SHALL PASS! sayeth the Black Knight.....
Excellent...very well put.
BTW, did you ever answer tame's questions or are you merely bloviating?
"Tame's been asking YOU for YOUR reasoning, Homer. He actually already knows my reasoning. So, the answer is???
"
Since we are all holding our cards close to our vests, I respond that George Washington (what whas it you said...oh, yes..."duh" ) judged it to be so worthy, and I agree.
Do you disagree, lil' Ms. Palmetto?
Sorry....I have to disengage for a few hours.....but rest assured, I'll be back!
I WILL NOT PROVIDE A REASON! Sayeth RFHomer...
You were not asked what George Washington judged to be worthy. You were asked WHY the revolution was worthy. Even if you can provide the reasons WHY Washington thought it worthy, that has nothing to do with why the secessionists would NOT be worthy for the same reasons.
Stated another way, what reasons do youthinkg Washington would give against modern independence?
I can think of several reasons I would give, but you apparently haven't even thought of ONE reason (outside of "well, Washington supported Independence, therefore MODERN independence would be wrong).
To be blunt, you are not the sharpest tack in the drawer.
Huh?!? Let me get this straight. Because Washington judged Independence to be worthy, it therefore follows that Independence (today) would be unworthy?!?
That's just stupid. Quit humiliating yourself.
"Huh?!? Let me get this straight. Because Washington judged Independence to be worthy, it therefore follows that Independence (today) would be unworthy?!?
That's just stupid. Quit humiliating yourself"
ok, you paragons of wisdom and virtue...., last post for now....gotta hit the road.
In short, YES Because George Washington said so.....
In slightly more detail, George Washington judged independence worthy because we were being ruled by tyrants and proxy tyrants. Self-government was not ours, individual freedom was not ours, taxation was on a whim and there was an occupying force that prevented change from within and had to be defeated.
Revolution, armed rebellion was the only way to derail the status quo.
I submit that exactly the same situation exists for you secessionists.....except for the fact that you don't have a lack of freedom, a tyrant, taxation on a whim (I'm on the fence on that one, but what the heck), or an occupying force.......or a George Washington.
But I am so unreasonable as to state that even though the secessionists of today have the EXACT same scenario, with the above exceptions, you should still not be allowed to secede.
I'm moving up in the world though......I've gone from "dumb ass" to Greek Philosopher in very short order....I am enjoying my ascendancy tremendously.
As funny as it is.....maybe we should dispense with the name calling, for the decorum of the board, OK?
Far too ambitious. They should have picked one good sized city on the coast in a conservative state and all moved there. Mobile, Alabama would have been a good choice.
I disagree. The situation is probably worse today than it was then (see earlier posts for more on that.
But I am so unreasonable as to state that even though the secessionists of today have the EXACT same scenario, with the above exceptions, you should still not be allowed to secede.
I fail to see your reasoning, but at this point we've probably exhausted hope of a point by point dialogue. Please forgive me if I've been too tough on you.
Sorry for the harsh language. In response to your last post I agree in part with tame's response to you. The differences have not been clearly spelled out by you, but I think it's time to give it a rest. I don't think further dialogue with you would be beneficial/would make much progress.
"Please forgive me if I've been too tough on you"
I appreciate a rough-and-tumble debate, I just felt it degenerating, and wanted to get back to the point. I likewise offer apologies for any offense
BUT.....I feel that this movement that you belong to is outrageous, and am surprised that more interest has not been generated on this board.
Opposing this, as I am sure you would agree, does not mean I am not a good Christian. Unfortunately, I can't say the converse would be true for patriotism. Your dissent is welcome, of course, but I still feel secession is a wild step that sharply divides us, when the basic issues that are driving you to this step - generate nothing but agreement between us.
I think you understand that there is a healthy helping of futility in your movement. I'd love to see you suceed to make a 10th amendment argument - this needs to be done someday - but the ultimate step, secession....the nuclear option, if you will, is totally unacceptable and undermines your higher goal of a more moral society, which most folks agree with.
please see post to tame......apologies apply to you as well.
Are you truly not supportive of a secessionist movement?
I moved from Texas to Florida so I could vote for GW in 2004. I felt I had to do something to help save our country. I think a Christian nation may be worth a thought, but we have not completely lost America yet.
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